Trump Investigations Thread

Blasterbot

Well-known member
You literally have no clue what you're talking about, do you?
sure bruh. we just both say coolio at eachother and I link a song. I am sure your recordings will finally get him. that the walls are closing in. that this will be the thing that finally beats donald trump. that it won't be revealed that there is additional context should it get to court. that everything will go your way.
 

Terthna

Professional Lurker
"But Joey got away with it when he did it!" didn't work in Kindergarten and shouldn't work now either.

The fact that enforcement is selective is a serious problem, but it doesn't absolve the person who's actually on trial for committing the crime, it just means there needs to be more even enforcement.
But it's not just Joey; it's damn near every kid in the classroom, and yet Trump not only gets singled out, but persecuted well beyond what the law requires. Also, with so many having broken a law that is rarely enforced (and is clearly only being enforced in this case to weaponize the judicial system against a political opponent), you have to consider whether or not the doctrine of desuetude applies.
 

Megadeath

Well-known member
sure bruh. we just both say coolio at eachother and I link a song. I am sure your recordings will finally get him. that the walls are closing in. that this will be the thing that finally beats donald trump. that it won't be revealed that there is additional context should it get to court. that everything will go your way.
Yep, that's literally all I did. /s Go listen to the audio recording yourself. Read trump's own response. Inform yourself the absolute bare minimum, and try and learn the difference between arguing an opinion and debating fact.

But it's not just Joey; it's damn near every kid in the classroom, and yet Trump not only gets singled out, but persecuted well beyond what the law requires. Also, with so many having broken a law that is rarely enforced (and is clearly only being enforced in this case to weaponize the judicial system against a political opponent), you have to consider whether or not the doctrine of desuetude applies.
Name one other person who took classified military information, refused to give it back, defied and lied in the face of a subpoena, and shared it with a publisher. There are several stark, significant and major differences between trump and any of the examples I imagine you're thinking of. For a case that is somewhat similar, Jack Teixeira was charged and is facing up to 60 years in jail. Was he also only pursued because of his political damage to the establishment? Or, because like trump he wilfully and repeatedly broke the law and endangered the country.
 

strunkenwhite

Well-known member
But it's not just Joey; it's damn near every kid in the classroom, and yet Trump not only gets singled out, but persecuted well beyond what the law requires. Also, with so many having broken a law that is rarely enforced (and is clearly only being enforced in this case to weaponize the judicial system against a political opponent), you have to consider whether or not the doctrine of desuetude applies.
Every kid in class may have stolen some crayons but only one [provably] refused to give them back, lied about having them, and had to have his backpack searched.
 
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Blasterbot

Well-known member
Every kid in class may have stolen some crayons but only one refused to give them back, lied about having them, and had to have his backpack searched.
if hillary, billy and joey did a bad along with half the class but only donald is punished and he was the only black kid in class we would look at the teacher.

if the same was true and donald was the only poor kid it would be the same.

if it was done and the teacher said they fucking hate donald and wished he was dead we would do the same.

the class is the government now and rather than a detention it is prison time and rather than caring about grades they want a certain political agenda.
 

Doomsought

Well-known member
"But Joey got away with it when he did it!" didn't work in Kindergarten and shouldn't work now either.

The fact that enforcement is selective is a serious problem, but it doesn't absolve the person who's actually on trial for committing the crime, it just means there needs to be more even enforcement.
I disagree. Et Tu as a legal argument is the only way to effectively fight selective enforcement.
 

prinCZess

Warrior, Writer, Performer, Perv
Selective enforcement is a greater danger, for any law, than the law being broken by individuals.

A law selectively enforced should not exist until such a time as it will be universally enforced with the same rigor regardless of its target. There is no conceivable near-future where DC bureaucracies do such--largely thanks to decades of selective enforcement and power-accumulation going unchallenged and shrugged-off with the advice being for people to just not make themselves targets.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
Yep, that's literally all I did. /s Go listen to the audio recording yourself. Read trump's own response. Inform yourself the absolute bare minimum, and try and learn the difference between arguing an opinion and debating fact.


Name one other person who took classified military information, refused to give it back, defied and lied in the face of a subpoena, and shared it with a publisher. There are several stark, significant and major differences between trump and any of the examples I imagine you're thinking of. For a case that is somewhat similar, Jack Teixeira was charged and is facing up to 60 years in jail. Was he also only pursued because of his political damage to the establishment? Or, because like trump he wilfully and repeatedly broke the law and endangered the country.
Hillary and her 30k whitewashed emails on that private server would like a word with you.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
Hillary Clinton's case lacked evidence but probably should have seen her charged with something they could get to stick.
It did not lack evidence. In 2016, the FBI came right out and said 'She did it, we know she did it, but we've determined she had no criminal intent, so we're not going to charge her for it.'

That she was 100% guilty is not even remotely in question. They just (D)ecided she shouldn't actually face punishment for it.
 

Blasterbot

Well-known member
Shouldn't the case get thrown out because of prosecutor misconduct? Leaking stuff to the media is illegal right?
nah see you forgot that orange man is bad. so fruit of the poisoned tree doesn't apply when confidential talks with lawyers get leaked. please remember in the future when talking with your lawyer anything you tell him can and will be used against you. this absolutely doesn't throw a bomb in the middle of our judicial system that is already viewed as politically motivated from both the left and the right.
 

Megadeath

Well-known member
Hillary and her 30k whitewashed emails on that private server would like a word with you.
Yep, 30,000 emails and not one was classified. There's also a difference between not having sufficient security on confidential emails, and actively showing classified military information to a publisher.

It did not lack evidence. In 2016, the FBI came right out and said 'She did it, we know she did it, but we've determined she had no criminal intent, so we're not going to charge her for it.'

That she was 100% guilty is not even remotely in question. They just (D)ecided she shouldn't actually face punishment for it.
Youre right and I was mistemembering. That said, mens rea is a required element for prosecuting basically all crimes. Also, again, there's a difference between confidential emails that don't have sufficiently secure servers, and classified military documents shared with a publisher.

Shouldn't the case get thrown out because of prosecutor misconduct? Leaking stuff to the media is illegal right?
No? Even if there was prosecutorial misconduct, that would be grounds to punish the prosecutor and possibly replace them, but why on earth would it have any impact on the case? Also, given trump thinks the leak exonerates him (Because he's an idiot.) why would you assume the leak came from the prosecutor? There's also several other groups who'd have the information and ability/reason to leak it.

nah see you forgot that orange man is bad. so fruit of the poisoned tree doesn't apply when confidential talks with lawyers get leaked. please remember in the future when talking with your lawyer anything you tell him can and will be used against you. this absolutely doesn't throw a bomb in the middle of our judicial system that is already viewed as politically motivated from both the left and the right.
Again, VERY clear you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Talks with lawyers weren't leaked. Recordings of trump meeting with publishers and using the opportunity to flash some classified military documents for clout were leaked. You have nothing useful to contribute, and you're a moron responding with the first knee-jerk response when one neuron bumps into another one.
That's also not what the idea of fruit from the poison tree refers to. That would be Illegaly obtained evidence, and has nothing to do with whether evidence is leaked or not.
 

Blasterbot

Well-known member
Yep, 30,000 emails and not one was classified. There's also a difference between not having sufficient security on confidential emails, and actively showing classified military information to a publisher.


Youre right and I was mistemembering. That said, mens rea is a required element for prosecuting basically all crimes. Also, again, there's a difference between confidential emails that don't have sufficiently secure servers, and classified military documents shared with a publisher.


No? Even if there was prosecutorial misconduct, that would be grounds to punish the prosecutor and possibly replace them, but why on earth would it have any impact on the case? Also, given trump thinks the leak exonerates him (Because he's an idiot.) why would you assume the leak came from the prosecutor? There's also several other groups who'd have the information and ability/reason to leak it.


Again, VERY clear you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Talks with lawyers weren't leaked. Recordings of trump meeting with publishers and using the opportunity to flash some classified military documents for clout were leaked. You have nothing useful to contribute, and you're a moron responding with the first knee-jerk response when one neuron bumps into another one.
That's also not what the idea of fruit from the poison tree refers to. That would be Illegaly obtained evidence, and has nothing to do with whether evidence is leaked or not.
1st no we literally know there was

2nd no there are loads of crimes that don't require mens rea. see manslaughter.

3rd yes absolutely prosecutorial misconduct can mean an acquittal and not merely replacing the prosecutor. it just requires the prosecutor to fuck up that badly.

4th neat bruh I believe you. all the other shit didn't fly but this. man. I just dunno. maybe orange man talking about plans from 2018 to invade a country that we weren't at war with that rely on us holding Afghanistan and Iraq and don't apply any more is so bad we can violate all our norms and finally get him. ThE wAlLs ArE cLoSiNg In. all who disagree are morons.
 

Blasterbot

Well-known member

oh what a surprise the audio has nothing to with the charges. this is just another hoax again. what a shocker. another out of context clip people will read what they want into.
 

King Arts

Well-known member
1st no we literally know there was

2nd no there are loads of crimes that don't require mens rea. see manslaughter.

3rd yes absolutely prosecutorial misconduct can mean an acquittal and not merely replacing the prosecutor. it just requires the prosecutor to fuck up that badly.

4th neat bruh I believe you. all the other shit didn't fly but this. man. I just dunno. maybe orange man talking about plans from 2018 to invade a country that we weren't at war with that rely on us holding Afghanistan and Iraq and don't apply any more is so bad we can violate all our norms and finally get him. ThE wAlLs ArE cLoSiNg In. all who disagree are morons.
Umm manslaughter still has mens rea an extreme indifference to human life.

A better example would be statutory rape, which is pretty controversial to be honest.
 

strunkenwhite

Well-known member
oh what a surprise the audio has nothing to with the charges. this is just another hoax again. what a shocker. another out of context clip people will read what they want into.
It's always good to keep one's facts straight. The point of the audio isn't to demonstrate that that particular document was among the ones he refused to return when asked (the charges are, as is commonly the case, more about the coverup than the initial incident) but rather to demonstrate that he was fully aware of the fact that he had not declassified the classified documents he took home.

I don't think they charged him exactly for having classified documents but the fact that they were classified is material to the charges they did file and the events that (allegedly) transpired.
 

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