Fallout The Eagle And The Bear [Fallout AU]

[CarlManvers2019]

Huh why the BOS hasn't ever heen anti-capitalism anywhere in tye entire franchise. So where exactly are you getting this?

Kinda from remembering Danse in Fallout 4 going on about how the corporations were all what lead to all the technology that caused the end and all the mad science that came afterwards

TBF, Vault-Tech was pretty unnecessarily evil

Then again, it may have been played for comedy, but guy thought Takahashi was a Chinese spy

 

[SuperHeavy]

Kinda from remembering Danse in Fallout 4 going on about how the corporations were all what lead to all the technology that caused the end and all the mad science that came afterwards

To be fair it turns out just about every Fallout corporation turned out to be evil in some over the top way so kinda had a point.

 

[Lanmandragon]

Kinda from remembering Danse in Fallout 4 going on about how the corporations were all what lead to all the technology that caused the end and all the mad science that came afterwards

TBF, Vault-Tech was pretty unnecessarily evil

Then again, it may have been played for comedy, but guy thought Takahashi was a Chinese spy

I mean I and many other conservatives will down on overarching corporate power. For example when we bitch about big tech. That hardly makes us anti capitalist hell T. Roosevelt invented trust busting. The dude was a republican it's not a zero sum game. In conclusion i see no reason whatsoever to believe the BOS is anti capitalist. Also it should noted that the E BOS are well heretic's. The way they operate and do things shouldn't be taken. As an example of any other BOS chapters operations.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

To be fair it turns out just about every Fallout corporation turned out to be evil in some over the top way so kinda had a point.

I mean I and many other conservatives will down on overarching corporate power. For example when we bitch about big tech. That hardly makes us anti capitalist hell T. Roosevelt invented trust busting. The dude was a republican it's not a zero sum game. In conclusion i see no reason whatsoever to believe the BOS is anti capitalist. Also it should noted that the E BOS are well heretic's. The way they operate and do things shouldn't be taken. As an example of any other BOS chapters operations.

Yeah, honestly the fact that

Valery Barstow

Overseer Doctor Valery Barstow is the Overseer of Vault 88, surviving as a ghoul in 2287, in Vault-Tec Workshop, encountered during the quest Better Living Underground. Valery Barstow was meant to become overseer of Vault 88, but the fallout shelter's construction had barely begun when the bombs...

fallout.fandom.com

Even the saner and surprisingly practical stuff proposed and made by one scientist was hated by this ACTUAL Vault-Tech was more-or-less rejected by the other scientists

It's honestly as if profit isn't the goal, because they knew they were ontop regardless

 

[TyrantTriumphant]

Looking back, I think this whole campaign has been a trap for the NCR.

The Enclave has compromised the Republic's intelligence network so as to make the NCR believe the worst of them. The Enclave, or at least a faction of the Enclave has always planned to let the NCR take some of their territory and then force them to retreat.

When the NCR soldiers will bring back information on how the new Enclave actually works, then NCR morale will plummet. Many might think that their government was deliberately lying to them

This plan is also made to get the populace of the USA invested into the war. Which they will be after those BoS atrocities get shown on the news. You can already see some of the results now.

 

[Lanmandragon]

Yeah, honestly the fact that

Valery Barstow

Overseer Doctor Valery Barstow is the Overseer of Vault 88, surviving as a ghoul in 2287, in Vault-Tec Workshop, encountered during the quest Better Living Underground. Valery Barstow was meant to become overseer of Vault 88, but the fallout shelter's construction had barely begun when the bombs...

fallout.fandom.com

Even the saner and surprisingly practical stuff proposed and made by one scientist was hated by this ACTUAL Vault-Tech was more-or-less rejected by the other scientists

It's honestly as if profit isn't the goal, because they knew they were ontop regardless

The pre war US was facist not in the sjw way but actually fascist. Aka the government and corps working together to crush the population.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

Looking back, I think this whole campaign has been a trap for the NCR.

The Enclave has compromised the Republic's intelligence network so as to make the NCR believe the worst of them. The Enclave, or at least a faction of the Enclave has always planned to let the NCR take some of their territory and then force them to retreat.

When the NCR soldiers will bring back information on how the new Enclave actually works, then NCR morale will plummet. Many might think that their government was deliberately lying to them

This plan is also made to get the populace of the USA invested into the war. Which they will be after those BoS atrocities get shown on the news. You can already see some of the results now.

TBF for that faction, I think the NCR was gonna be able to take some settlements at some point, so letting em take over was not entirely deliberate

That said, I'm not sure if the NCR military will even be believed when they say what they actually saw even if they tell it to others who went and saw it all

 

[Lanmandragon]

TBF for that faction, I think the NCR was gonna be able to take some settlements at some point, so letting em take over was not entirely deliberate

That said, I'm not sure if the NCR military will even be believed when they say what they actually saw even if they tell it to others who went and saw it all

None of that matters at all perceptionis everything. For example the "Tet offensive" was an overwhelming victory for the US. So much so that the Vietcong ceased to be a valid force. Yet because the MSM liked and presented it as an American defeat. The American public largely viewed it that way thus the victory became a defeat. Perception has always and will always matter more then truth that's the reality. Accept it or not

 

[TyrantTriumphant]

TBF for that faction, I think the NCR was gonna be able to take some settlements at some point, so letting em take over was not entirely deliberate

That said, I'm not sure if the NCR military will even be believed when they say what they actually saw even if they tell it to others who went and saw it all

While I'm sure that some people won't believe the soldiers, that doesn't really matter. The infighting between those who don't believe and those who do will still serve the Enclave.

What I wonder is what all the hardcore anti-Enclave people in the north NCR will do once the news gets out. People who have their deepest beliefs contradicted like that rarely react well.

 

[Navarro]

Looking back, I think this whole campaign has been a trap for the NCR.

The Enclave has compromised the Republic's intelligence network so as to make the NCR believe the worst of them. The Enclave, or at least a faction of the Enclave has always planned to let the NCR take some of their territory and then force them to retreat.

When the NCR soldiers will bring back information on how the new Enclave actually works, then NCR morale will plummet. Many might think that their government was deliberately lying to them

This plan is also made to get the populace of the USA invested into the war. Which they will be after those BoS atrocities get shown on the news. You can already see some of the results now.

Not everything that happens in war is down to one side's elaborate master plan.

 

[TyrantTriumphant]

Not everything that happens in war is down to one side's elaborate master plan.

I guess I was wrong. But considering the orders from Enclave high command to pursue the NCR army out of their territory instead of encircling them, and that the FBI has been feeding the NCR bogus intelligence for years, the information seemed to point in the direction of a unified plan.

 

[Navarro]

You'll get the full scoop in time.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

Say, since Raiders are considered history or the villains of stories in current times, any "raider" gangs still operative?

Or have they almost all consolidated or decided to tone down on the obviously crazy looks and became regular organized crime

 

[Lanmandragon]

Say, since Raiders are considered history or the villains of stories in current times, any "raider" gangs still operative?

Or have they almost all consolidated or decided to tone down on the obviously crazy looks and became regular organized crime

The Reno families started as raiders as did(likely) quite a few robber barons. I'd also say that personally I consider the BOS high tech raiders.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

The Reno families started as raiders as did(likely) quite a few robber barons. I'd also say that personally I consider the BOS high tech raiders.

They're even out to make "fiefdoms" when this is over, so they can tax/extort the populace and make em live in fear

All that's missing is the rape, drugs and liking to murder innocent people and string up lots of dead bodies everywhere in very gory fashions due to pure sadism and dirty fashion sense

 

[ForeverShogo]

Uhhhh, Lanma, you do realize that the Republican Party wasn't always a (strictly) conservative party, right?

Like, Teddy Roosevelt was a full on Progressive. To the extent he established a Progressive Party.

I'm extremely confident that Teddy would hate the modern Republican Party. Though he'd probably hate the modern Democrats too.

Economically and socially speaking, he'd basically be a non-SJW Liberal in today's political climate. Hell, he even campaigned for a National Health Service when he was the Progressive candidate in the 1912 elections. (By social I mean stuff like welfare, not wacky SJW stuff.)

Just read up on the Square Deal and New Nationalism.

==========

Anyways . . . For the actual story . . . Interesting to see how things are coming together.

I'm anticipating bad times for the NCR. Especially with the Brotherhood fucking up and sticking their dick in unnecessary meat grinders that have only managed to deny the NCR access to useful power armor and air assets.

Oh, and it's also fun to see that America is keeping the Union version of Dixie alive.

 

[f1onagher]

The Reno families started as raiders as did(likely) quite a few robber barons. I'd also say that personally I consider the BOS high tech raiders.

I have to assume that most raiders either got with the times or got squashed. At this point, they've more likely evolved into regular criminal enterprises rather than packs of deranged murderers wandering around and causing havoc. Functional societies tend to react harshly to overt acts of anarchy and violence.

As for the BoS, all of the moderate chapters were wiped out or suppressed in this universe, so the Midwest is stuck with the crappy feudal devotees. Practically speaking the super-orthodox idiots aren't going to make it. Their governmental system is literally antiquated and highly inefficient compared to the more or less fully functional nation-states on either side of them.

Even in a universe where things work out for them, the old Lyons faction is very likely to eventually win out since they actually try to adjust to the changing world rather than desperately attempting to force a misunderstood and outdated transitional ideology onto reality. The later Brotherhood was always tragic due to how far they'd wandered from Maxson's original intent. In this world that tragedy has metastasized into, as you say, a polity of techno-barbarians.

 

[Lanmandragon]

I have to assume that most raiders either got with the times or got squashed. At this point, they've more likely evolved into regular criminal enterprises rather than packs of deranged murderers wandering around and causing havoc. Functional societies tend to react harshly to overt acts of anarchy and violence.

As for the BoS, all of the moderate chapters were wiped out or suppressed in this universe, so the Midwest is stuck with the crappy feudal devotees. Practically speaking the super-orthodox idiots aren't going to make it. Their governmental system is literally antiquated and highly inefficient compared to the more or less fully functional nation-states on either side of them.

Even in a universe where things work out for them, the old Lyons faction is very likely to eventually win out since they actually try to adjust to the changing world rather than desperately attempting to force a misunderstood and outdated transitional ideology onto reality. The later Brotherhood was always tragic due to how far they'd wandered from Maxson's original intent. In this world that tragedy has metastasized into, as you say, a polity of techno-barbarians.

Oh I agree they've evolved into well the mob basically. The groups I mentioned just week the most likley to have been raidiers originally.

 

[Navarro]

The Reno families started as raiders as did(likely) quite a few robber barons. I'd also say that personally I consider the BOS high tech raiders.

They started as mafia families in pre-War Reno. Then the nukes fell, local government eventually collapsed, and guess who was there to pick up the pieces?

The Brahmin barons also weren't raiders, they were farmers and caravaneers. Though as late as the FNV period they were hiring raiders as mercs to fight low-level internecine wars against each other.


It's not like a situation like NV, where House got tribals to LARP as gangsters.

I have to assume that most raiders either got with the times or got squashed. At this point, they've more likely evolved into regular criminal enterprises rather than packs of deranged murderers wandering around and causing havoc. Functional societies tend to react harshly to overt acts of anarchy and violence.

More like raiders got squashed, regular organised crime families took up their place.

As for the BoS, all of the moderate chapters were wiped out or suppressed in this universe

Who says the BoS moderates are all out of the picture?

Practically speaking the super-orthodox idiots aren't going to make it. Their governmental system is literally antiquated and highly inefficient compared to the more or less fully functional nation-states on either side of them.

The Brotherhood's best shot was to maintain their alliance with the NCR and accept their role as the junior partner in said alliance.

Even in a universe where things work out for them, the old Lyons faction is very likely to eventually win out since they actually try to adjust to the changing world rather than desperately attempting to force a misunderstood and outdated transitional ideology onto reality.

The Brotherhood were definitely heroes back in FO1 and FO2. And Lyons? Lyons had no wider vision beyond an incoherent idea of helping out wastelanders, which is all very well and all but isn't enough to found a polity on. Perhaps if his daughter had lived in canon she would have turned his vague concepts into something workable, but she didn't, so she didn't.

The later Brotherhood was always tragic due to how far they'd wandered from Maxson's original intent. In this world that tragedy has metastasized into, as you say, a polity of techno-barbarians.

Yep. Roger Maxson didn't want any of this, just like Aradesh didn't want the NCR to become an industrialised, always-on-war-footing, imperialist superpower.

In conclusion i see no reason whatsoever to believe the BOS is anti capitalist. Also it should noted that the E BOS are well heretic's. The way they operate and do things shouldn't be taken. As an example of any other BOS chapters operations.

You forget that for the BoS to allow a free market in the territory they administer would be (inevitably) to allow advanced technology to go out of their control.

 

[ForeverShogo]

And even that early heroism is entirely because of who their leader is at the time.

Maintaining friendly relations with Wastelanders? Actually working on R&D and trying to safely distribute technologies? All on Rhombus.

If Rhombus dies?

Whoever replaces him as leader for the Brotherhood would have turned them into a "techno-religious dictatorship" known as the Steal Plague. Who would have gone on to devastate a baby NCR and initiated a Dark Age that "could last 1000 years".

Because even as early as the very first game they had people who wanted to be the assholes we see in the later games. The Elders just have so much power that the assholes usually listen when told to be nice.