Would Segregation have been wrong if it really was separate but equal?

[ShieldWife]

You know, sometimes I feel as if this thread was created by someone of SB or SV to say "Look at what those racist on The Sietch are doing, total animals". Let's just finish this up once and for all. Segregation is wrong, Skin color matters not at all as it is the Rich fools who seek to divide us that lead to thoughts of separating races. For in the end, there is no race, but the human race.

Race is more than just skin color and mountains of evidence demonstrates that. Different races are different, different cultures are different, men and women are different. Leftist dogma claims that every group is the same and that any differences in outcome is the result of evil white men and their oppression. That isn’t true and pushing the leftist narratives about sameness just helps create resentment.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

Race is more than just skin color and mountains of evidence demonstrates that. Different races are different, different cultures are different, men and women are different. Leftist dogma claims that every group is the same and that any differences in outcome is the result of evil white men and their oppression. That isn’t true and pushing the leftist narratives about sameness just helps create resentment.

The important part is that our differences are solely OUR responsibility.

They are not imposed on us by the color of our skin. Shade matters not.

We CHOOSE to let that define us or not.

 

[ShieldWife]

The important part is that our differences are solely OUR responsibility.

They are not imposed on us by the color of our skin. Shade matters not.

We CHOOSE to let that define us or not.

Those are just deepities.

People don’t choose how they are different. Humans are a product of biology. A man can’t become a woman no matter how much he wants to be one. A dwarf won’t be able to play in the NBA no matter how hard he practices. A person with a very low IQ might study hard but can never be a doctor or scientist.

Many of our traits are imposed on us by biology, including skin tone and the numerous other traits which are tied to race. We can work within our limitations, but not transcend them.

Which is neither here nor there. Different demographics (including but not limited to ethnic ones) are different and people shouldn’t be villainized for recognizing those differences o in accordance to those differences.

 

[Scottty]

You know, sometimes I feel as if this thread was created by someone of SB or SV to say "Look at what those racist on The Sietch are doing, total animals".

Let them. Kind of the whole point of this site is that we can discuss things as intelligent grown-ups, without having to self-censor lest we offend against the oh-so-sensitive feeelings of the liberal snowflakes.
Stop thinking those people's opinion of you matters.

Let's just finish this up once and for all. Segregation is wrong, Skin color matters not at all as it is the Rich fools who seek to divide us that lead to thoughts of separating races. For in the end, there is no race, but the human race.

And to many of our ideological opponents, what you just said there makes you super-racist. No kidding!
Stop thinking that they can be appeased or reasoned with.

Now, that having been said, one should oppose both government-imposed segregation, and government-imposed integration, for the exact same reason - because it is government imposed. People should be free to make their own choices.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Which is neither here nor there. Different demographics (including but not limited to ethnic ones) are different and people shouldn’t be villainized for recognizing those differences o in accordance to those differences.

no but they can and should be villainized when they refuse to cooperate and attempt to destabilize the rest of society because of said differences which dare I say is what inevitably happens. just because you (generalized you not you as in specifically) can't get along with a certain group of people doesn't give you the right to attempt to disrupt and ruin the lives of those who can. at the very least don't be surprised when the people you are antagonizing tell you rather forcefully to "Buzz off."

I'm sorry, KKK, black panthers, neo-nazis BLM CHAZ and ESPECIALLY our government and their media lap dogs, as far as I'm concerned they are all villians and I will treat them as such.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

"Those of African decent have slightly differently shaped skulls, thus we must start legislating based off race!"

I feel there's a rather vast middle ground between those two statements, and I think it's worth exploring. Can we leave Jim Crow to the 1950s please?

 

[ShieldWife]

no but they can and should be villainized when they refuse to cooperate and attempt to destabilize the rest of society because of said differences which dare I say is what inevitably happens. just because you (generalized you not you as in specifically) can't get along with a certain group of people doesn't give you the right to attempt to disrupt and ruin the lives of those who can. at the very least don't be surprised when the people you are antagonizing tell you rather forcefully to "Buzz off."

"Those of African decent have slightly differently shaped skulls, thus we must start legislating based off race!"

Is it possible to have this conversation without this constant barrage of absurd strawmen?

 

[Lord Sovereign]

Is it possible to have this conversation without this constant barrage of absurd strawmen?

No, because you muppets don't seem to understand that you are asking for legislation based on race. You cannot have wide reaching segregation without it.

 

[ShieldWife]

No, because you muppets don't seem to understand that you are asking for legislation based on race. You cannot have wide reaching segregation without it.

So you think my position, whatever you think it is, justifies your lies?

We have had many decades of forced integration and enforced anti-white discrimination. How has that been working out for our society?

 

[VictortheMonarch]

Let them. Kind of the whole point of this site is that we can discuss things as intelligent grown-ups, without having to self-censor lest we offend against the oh-so-sensitive feeelings of the liberal snowflakes.
Stop thinking those people's opinion of you matters.



And to many of our ideological opponents, what you just said there makes you super-racist. No kidding!
Stop thinking that they can be appeased or reasoned with.

Now, that having been said, one should oppose both government-imposed segregation, and government-opposed integration, for the exact same reason - because it is government imposed. People should be free to make their own choices.

Indeed, but as I see it over time people Integrate, at least here in the USA. Now they keep parts of their culture, like the Irish, Italians, and Yoruba as seen in New York, but for the most part they are nothing like what would be seen in their native nation. They are in a way, American in every way.

I don't really know about you, but I don't see skin color. Oh there are physical differences, but we are the same race in the end; Homo sapiens, thus of the same race. a man in Hong Kong with bleed the same color as I here in Tennessee. We may look different, but we are the same biologically. Thus I concur that racism is a trick of the mind. An inherent trick our mind does to get us to fight. All that is needed is to stop yourself when necessary, and to control that kind of urge.

 

[Marduk]

Indeed, but as I see it over time people Integrate, at least here in the USA. Now they keep parts of their culture, like the Irish, Italians, and Yoruba as seen in New York, but for the most part they are nothing like what would be seen in their native nation. They are in a way, American in every way.

I don't really know about you, but I don't see skin color. Oh there are physical differences, but we are the same race in the end; Homo sapiens, thus of the same race. a man in Hong Kong with bleed the same color as I here in Tennessee. We may look different, but we are the same biologically. Thus I concur that racism is a trick of the mind. An inherent trick our mind does to get us to fight. All that is needed is to stop yourself when necessary, and to control that kind of urge.

That's a lot of effort to ask people to look up, down, and behind, but absolutely not look in front, at the elephant in the room.
And the elephant in the room is the things that most directly and obviously decide how society functions, at every scale - religions, ideologies, cultures, subcultures.
Most of these are not strictly ethnically based, but they do tend to be more or less aligned on these lines for various reasons, usually more, which malicious actors obsessed about race will jump to paint as racist whenever convenient.
The "can X be part of our club" question everyone likes to ask in this realm is a red herring, because the more relevant questions are "do X want to be part of our club" and "what do we do about the X who say fuck your club, your club should be more like my old club", or "what do we do with X who don't give a fuck about our club's ideals and mission, they are just in it for the membership benefits".
Such social clubs, from internet fandoms to empires fighting wars, do fight, and the urge to fight is vital to survive in such a landscape. For if even your club's most ardent supporters say that what their club stands for is not worth fighting for, who is there to disagree with them? The competition can do nothing but welcome such attitude.

I'd also be careful of making broad statements about all people being biologically the same. There are scientifically provable differences between various populations (though the term "race" usually is usually not nearly accurate enough to describe them), usually quite subtle, but denying their existence for the sake of ideological purity only opens up any such ideology to perfectly factual criticism, and we don't want to be like the Soviet Union, do we? Are you going to tell me that the Danes and the Japanese are equally tall? Well that is just one of many examples of well documented biological differences, like it or not.

No, because you muppets don't seem to understand that you are asking for legislation based on race. You cannot have wide reaching segregation without it.

Funny enough, there is a simple and current example of that naturally happening.
Google photos of audiences of musical shows of radically different bands and genres. Some of them will have visibly different ethnic proportions of the audience than others. Even though the government (or even the organizer) does not mandate who can go to which one. Anyone can, they just need to want to show up and buy a ticket. But the willingness to do that is sometimes very unequally distributed across the society. That's how voluntary segregation works.

 

[VictortheMonarch]

That's a lot of effort to ask people to look up, down, and behind, but absolutely not look in front, at the elephant in the room.
And the elephant in the room is the things that most directly and obviously decide how society functions, at every scale - religions, ideologies, cultures, subcultures.
Most of these are not strictly ethnically based, but they do tend to be more or less aligned on these lines for various reasons, usually more, which malicious actors obsessed about race will jump to paint as racist whenever convenient.
The "can X be part of our club" question everyone likes to ask in this realm is a red herring, because the more relevant questions are "do X want to be part of our club" and "what do we do about the X who say fuck your club, your club should be more like my old club", or "what do we do with X who don't give a fuck about our club's ideals and mission, they are just in it for the membership benefits".
Such social clubs, from internet fandoms to empires fighting wars, do fight, and the urge to fight is vital to survive in such a landscape. For if even your club's most ardent supporters say that what their club stands for is not worth fighting for, who is there to disagree with them? The competition can do nothing but welcome such attitude.

I'd also be careful of making broad statements about all people being biologically the same. There are scientifically provable differences between various populations (though the term "race" usually is usually not nearly accurate enough to describe them), usually quite subtle, but denying their existence for the sake of ideological purity only opens up any such ideology to perfectly factual criticism, and we don't want to be like the Soviet Union, do we? Are you going to tell me that the Danes and the Japanese are equally tall? Well that is just one of many examples of well documented biological differences, like it or not.


Funny enough, there is a simple and current example of that naturally happening.
Google photos of audiences of musical shows of radically different bands and genres. Some of them will have visibly different ethnic proportions of the audience than others. Even though the government (or even the organizer) does not mandate who can go to which one. Anyone can, they just need to want to show up and buy a ticket. But the willingness to do that is sometimes very unequally distributed across the society. That's how voluntary segregation works.

we are technically the same, as physical differences matter not. Whether we like it or not things will happen. We are Humans, and should only see each other as humans, not Africans or Asians, Latinos or Caucasians. We are all Human, and it is morally bankrupt to say otherwise.

 

[Marduk]

we are technically the same, as physical differences matter not.

Good luck trying that attitude in any competitive sports.

We are Humans, and should only see each other as humans, not Africans or Asians, Latinos or Caucasians. We are all Human, and it is morally bankrupt to say otherwise.

Hardly any people outside the west share that view. Most people in the world identify with their nationality, tribe or religion way more than "we are all human".
But yes, race is less useful for such identification than the abovementioned qualifiers. Most of such groups have some or all of their major hostilities with groups of the same race.

 

[ShadowArxxy]

Sydney, Australia, has had a Chinatown for over 120 years.

I call Bullshit.

How does a single example which you don't even explain constitute evidence of anything?

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Is it possible to have this conversation without this constant barrage of absurd strawmen?

haven't you at least on a couple of occasions on this site said America belongs to the white man. Jim Crow Laws, "Separate but equal" (Which is the topic of the thread by the way) are not straw men. they were things that happened. if nothing else I'm saying your missing the forest for the trees. Your focusing on the racial aspects when the root of the problem is rivals with a superiority complex, something neither segregation (at least in the context of Jim Crow separate but equal type laws) nor an ethnic state will fix.

We have had many decades of forced integration and enforced anti-white discrimination. How has that been working out for our society?

that depends, how often are you connected to things like youtube twitter and the mainstream media? if your constantly connected there probably is this sense of "the sky is falling, a civil and race war is inevitable and my family is going to be sent to death camps." but if you disconnect for a little bit and actually go outside and go about your daily business, you'll find probably that most people don't give a crap about your skin color. I can honestly say that sense heavily tampering down on my dosage of daily political commentary and actually going to town and shopping, interacting with real people, having a cookout in my backyard, my outlook on life has been MUCH better. Honestly if it wasn't for the supply shortages caused by Biden's idiotic fiscal policies and his stupid covid policies, I would probably look at the sky going "What do they mean the sky is falling?" You've got to remember the people trying to enforce racial discrimination, the people causing the riots in the inter cities, these are the same small group of people who always were causing trouble, they've just learned to use technology to make it seem like they are bigger than they are and they are only going to seem as big as much as you let them get inside your head.

I don't know where you live, maybe you live in an area that's very left leaning and very hostile towards whites. If this is the case, I pity you and I highly suggest you move. if by some ungodly misfortune you live in some megaplex part of California like LA or San Fran, I say don't walk but run. a red state would be your best bet but just getting away from any area left of Stalin would help. I can tell you from meeting people all over the country both left and right that the country isn't this huge battlefield that the media and the internet is making it out to be. Don't let them get into your head.

 

[ShadowArxxy]

Sounds like maybe the neighbors were right.

Bullshit. Studies show that the vast majority (over 70%) of all lottery winners end up blowing through their entire winnings in five years or less, ending up in exactly the same economic state as when they won. It has absolutely nothing to do with racial characteristics.

Edit: It has everything to do with the fact that investing a lottery windfall *and* structuring it to avoid massive tax losses is actually extremely tricky; even among investment professionals, it's a specialty skillset.

 

[Simonbob]

Edit: It has everything to do with the fact that investing a lottery windfall *and* structuring it to avoid massive tax losses is actually extremely tricky; even among investment professionals, it's a specialty skillset.

I thought there was an element of "People who are rich are rich for a reason" and a single windfall doesn't generally change who you are.

If you're a stupid thug, more money doesn't make you anything else. If you're a brilliant kid, you have a much higher chance of leveraging that chance to do better.

 

[King Arts]

Bullshit. Studies show that the vast majority (over 70%) of all lottery winners end up blowing through their entire winnings in five years or less, ending up in exactly the same economic state as when they won. It has absolutely nothing to do with racial characteristics.

Edit: It has everything to do with the fact that investing a lottery windfall *and* structuring it to avoid massive tax losses is actually extremely tricky; even among investment professionals, it's a specialty skillset.

I’m not a classist or a racist. I don’t believe in looking down on people because they are not sophisticated economically. But the neighbors might not have been wrong. I mean you said that she kept paying bail for her boyfriend. Her being in a relationship with a criminal and not leaving him does make her low class.

 

[Blasterbot]

Culture matters not race. To determine if a culture is good look at the results it produces.

 

[ShieldWife]

Bullshit. Studies show that the vast majority (over 70%) of all lottery winners end up blowing through their entire winnings in five years or less, ending up in exactly the same economic state as when they won. It has absolutely nothing to do with racial characteristics.

This woman had enough money to buy a mansion in a gated community but also spent so much money bailing out her boyfriend that it threatened her wealth. He must have been committing pretty severe crimes, in addition to jumping bail.

People who live in gated communities spend that extra money in large part because they don’t want criminals in their neighborhood. If those neighbors are accurately judging the character of the woman moving into their community, and/or the company she keeps, then it’s absurd to call it “racism.”

Though, statistically speaking, black people do commit crimes at a much higher rate than other racial groups do, so maybe it’s not just skin color that people are concerned about.