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Lord Sovereign
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  • You know, as fond as we are of casting America as the New Rome role-wise, I’d actually say the US has some strong economic parallels with Carthage. That is, an exceptionally wealthy nation with a mercantile spirit and the finest blue-water navy in history, as well as a love for commerce and entrepreneurship stretching back to its founding days.

    In short, imagine if some angry sex between Rome and Carthage bore a child over two-thousand years later, and that’s basically America. The result: Roman grandeur and power projection married to Punic commercialism and maritime success, much to the surprise (and jealousy) of Romans and Carthaginians alike spectating from the afterlife.
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    Lord Sovereign
    Lord Sovereign
    That is a strangely accurate description. I suppose that makes Europe the Greek Cities; past their prime and looking on in envy.
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    Zyobot
    Zyobot
    Thanks. Actually, so long as I'm running with the comparison, I suppose that makes Britain a "crossbreed" of Athens and Phoenicia, both because it's the most prominent European power (in the American imagination, at least) and because it was a global maritime empire with a first-rate navy, as well as a knack for trade and commerce that'd have made Hannibal's jaw hit the floor.
    Well, considering the occasion, I was wondering how you Brits are taught about the American Revolution?

    Probably wasn't nearly the high point for your guys' national story as it is for us Yanks, I imagine. But then, considering how close-knit the Kingdom and the States are nowadays, I'm guessing it's not disparaged as entirely negative, either. (The fact it wasn't nearly as calamitous as the French Revolution probably helps, as well, so there's that.)
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    It's not often talked about much in our history, to the point where it doesn't really gets taught specifically in schools. Obviously there's a joking "those treacherous yanks" but it doesn't really register much in the British mindset these days.

    When it is taught, it's the usual "Britain taxed its colonies too much and they rebelled over it." As you can imagine, I have somewhat different views on the matter (those treacherous yanks, but unironically), but I'm not the norm.
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    Thanks, man.

    Would’ve made an interesting counterfactual if the Revolution either failed or never came to pass, with North America basically evolving into Thicc Canada and retaining more “European” influences that way. (And, perhaps, earning its independence via a peaceful transition much later down the line. :unsure:)
    Zyobot
    Zyobot
    In any case, assuming America’s still destined to become Rome Reborn, it’d be irony of the highest order for Britain to someday become one of Imperial America’s most treasured colonies by 2122 or so. (You know, being the Athens to the whole of Europe’s Greece or whatever.)
    Out of curiosity, I don’t suppose you have some “ideas” about what we can expect from the rest of the 21st century?

    For one, you strike me as a great deal less cynical than @Skallagrim, despite being more or less agreement that America will be Rome Reborn.
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    Zyobot
    Zyobot
    I'm aware of that, yes.

    However, I'm guessing by "conservative", you're probably referring to something that fuses the more localist and class-conscious governments of ages past with good ol' Classical Liberalism, especially since America will probably be at the head of the pendulum swing? (Personally, I'd be down with a return to the Old Republic and a more libertarian-esque approach to governance, similar to what someone like Ron Paul advocates for. But in any case, I don't expect the "transition period" between now and then to be... easy, let's say.)
    Lord Sovereign
    Lord Sovereign
    I don't pretend to have a perfect prediction of the future, only something more along the lines of "leanings." I've little doubt America will embrace its constitutional heritage again alongside some tighter immigration laws (essentially what you've described). Although, one thing I think will be common among all post progressive paradigm countries is a semi-paranoia over leftism. It wouldn't entirely be unsimilar from what most modern Eastern European countries think of communism.
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    Perhaps that's for the best. Granted, I think there are a few things worth salvaging, such as modern technology and a healthy regard for human rights, which I believe a more constitutionally-inclined America probably will retain.

    As you say, there's no way to pinpoint what's to come exactly, though I once cooked up a more "impressionistic" scenario elsewhere, in which I "color within the lines" of @Skallagrim's macro-historical outlook by predicting a demonic Neo-Caesar who's basically a fusion of Thanos and Emperor Palpatine, followed by 1776 roaring back to life and bringing a kind, humble Luke Skywalker-as-Neo-Augustus to the forefront. (Under his rule, the central government is practically toothless, leaving conquests abroad to explorers, homesteaders, and business interests who engage in "privatized" imperialism that meshes Britain's trade-centric approach with the Wild West-style bonanza of 19th century America.)
    On a different subject entirely, have you thought about cross-posting your NGE fic here?
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    Maybe one day. This doesn't seem to be a very NGE "place," and I'm planning on doing a Star Wars exclusive for the Sietch at one point.

    If you've had a look at the fic, what do you make of it so far?
    MrBirthday
    MrBirthday
    I've only glanced at it so far. I'd have to actually read it to give an opinion.
    Lord Sovereign
    Lord Sovereign
    Fair enough. Funny story really, I initially started writing it because I hated NGE, and felt that I should try to do better if I was to bitch about it. Years and multiple restarts later, it has somewhat become a labour of love for me.
    So, to sum up your attitude about the Covid lockdowns; politicians with a working brain will present the vaccine as a vindication of their lockdown strategy, declare victory, and open up to get the economy back to normal. The petty tyrants who use the lockdowns as a means of control (and thus try to keep them going indefinitely) will end up regretting it. Do I understand you correctly?
    Lord Sovereign
    Lord Sovereign
    That's a pretty good assessment. Alas, there is a dark possibility that some of them just don't have the grey cells to take the sensible approach. We haven't been so cursed with such an incompetent class of elites since the Fall of Rome.
    So, thoughts on Brexit going into effect tonight? (Besides "good", of course.)
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    MrBirthday
    MrBirthday
    Also, I've seen it pointed out that the entire reason for the Brexit Party was to force a change of leadership in the Tories.
    Lord Sovereign
    Lord Sovereign
    Partially, although I do think it has grown a bit beyond that. They definitely wanted to twist the Tories's arm into giving us Brexit, but now they've got it in mind to become a real populist movement.
    MrBirthday
    MrBirthday
    With any luck, some of the purely home-grown BS will also be dealt with before too long.
    Lol, I made my pokemon post before I read yours. So we both made the same joke independently of each other, within the span of a few hours in response to the exact same post. I guess we shared the same high energy at that moment?
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