Russia(gate/bot) Russia-Ukraine War Political Discussion

[King Arts]

In other news:



Serbia will arrest any of it's citizens who go to fight for Russia in their invasion of Ukraine and attempt to return.

Look, you seem to be mistaking me for someone trying to push isolationism, rather than try to help make sure the US is less isolationist by pointing out when Euro's rant about what America needs to be/must be, it causes more isolationist feelings most of the time, not less.

You want to keep the US from going isolationist, don't feed the resentment a lot in the US feel towards foreigners who expect us to control the world for them, while ignoring the cost that has on the US domestic scene.

The American public is tired of being expected to 'happily' control the world to make things safe for smaller nations; you want us to be world police, make other nations start paying what they said they would (Poland pulls it's weight, so not really applicable to your nation) and discourage nations from attempting to entice off-shoring of US jobs to their shores.

Also, no one is going to seriously invade the US; the CCP or Russia might try something stupid in Alaska, but the US can keep our CONUS shores protected without a lot of foreign involvement or materials.

To be fair vucic might just be a NATO puppet and traitor to Serbia because Kosova. Should be part of Serbia.

 

[King Arts]

...Bacle what the fuck are you talking about? The only commies in this stupid fucking fake war are Western European countries. The EU is filled with retards arresting women who got raped by Arabs for reporting their rapists as arabs, locking their countries down and jabbing them at gun point, arresting people like Tommy Robinson for punching pedos in public, forcefully removing children from hospital beds and giving them vaxxed blood..They're the ones with controlled economies wherein everyone gets a stipend from the state at the expense of the few people able to work and earn; they're the ones with epidemics of exploding mailboxes and 1600 sexual assaults on a new years eve all covered up by the politburo.

Western Europe is where kebabs made of former child prostitutes were served in Pakistani restaurants for years because leftist politicians say it's integral for the bourgeoisie to shut up about it and take one for the team.

Russia and the Ukraine aren't capitalist, and they aren't communist. Both of those countries are reduced to states too primitive to be either. They're thuggocracies governed by drug dealers.

You're right I hate leftists and I hate leftism and I hate communism. That's why I don't give a single solitary fuck what happens in Europe. They're all a bunch of effete Marxists and cultural nihilists.

This ain't the 1980's dude...Russia isn't communist, Russia's not anything. It is insanity for you to suggest we're facing the USSR...that's fucking wild Bacle.


...Most conservatives are part of the GAE/globalists and the ones who aren't are moving away from conservatism and embracing a Christian traditionalism.

I don't care about cultural embalmers, most of us in the New Right don't, hell most conservatives are abandoning political conservatism because they're tired of conserving democratic talking points from the 1980's.


Then the US can reemerge and do what the Mongols did. "Knock this shit off or we will Golden Horde in Baghdad on your ass"

Y'all ain't gaining on us, when most of you are collapsing due to your own internal problems while being propped up by us.

What makes you think you'll survive without us? We've been artificially keeping Europe going since the treaty of Versailles.



Desperate animals trying to keep the other foot from entering the grave tend to do desperate things. Too bad the Ukrainian Government is so lazy and corrupt it can't drive out a bunch of half dead barbarians without extensive bribes and money laundering from the US.


All the more reason not to involve ourselves in an external tribal bitchfit, we gotta deal with our own almost mortal social problems...problems encouraged by the US IC and imported by European schools of thought by the by!




Yeah, no it's not like zelensky didn't try and start a nuclear war or anything.

I’m sorry I can’t take you seriously when you make up bullshit like Pakistan pedo cannibals. I can believe the pedi rape, but you sound like you are just stringing every insult together.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

I’m sorry I can’t take you seriously when you make up bullshit like Pakistan pedo cannibals. I can believe the pedi rape, but you sound like you are just stringing every insult together.

..You were saying.

Charlene Downes went missing 15 years ago this week - aged 14.

Her parents, Karen and Bob, were forced to endure courtroom claims her body was cut up and mixed into kebabs.

And catering to the silly wishful thinking and pet theories of silly people like dogmatic isolationists and "anti war" activists helps this... how exactly?
Going out of your way to keep silly people happy is exactly the sort of attitude that got you into all these problems in the first place.

Just... how? Where did you get all these crazy theories? I know there are certain media pipelines specializing in this, but that's the stuff you're not supposed to take seriously.

You mean patriots, not silly people. We're done bleeding and going broke for you guys.

You wanna kill Russians so badly? Do it, they can't stop you, they're fucking pathetic and Poland has been seeking a solution to the Tartar problem since what? The fucking 1300s?

Don't bother us about it, take out your own trash. You're clearly bloodlusted enough.

 

[Agent23]

Provided, of course, that he is willing to encase the attacking country in nuclear weapons until there is nothing left of it. When both sides have nuclear weapons they might as well not have them, because there is no point in using them because it will only bring mutual destruction and that is not what war is about.

That's why I said if the Americans are stupid enough to use it. Because that way the U.S. automatically erases itself from existence. Such a conflict will be exhausting but losing does not equal annihilation like in MAD. You can always recover from defeat in a conventional war. From a nuclear one not necessarily.

Only insane , fanatical or desperate people are capable of using weapons in MAD, preferring to be dead than under someone else's boot. An ordinary person is unlikely to part with his life and be remembered as the gravedigger of the world.

Force de dissuasion - Wikipedia

De Gaulle said something along the lines of, I don't care if their conventional army can kill all of us and their nuclear weapons can kill all of us, because we have enough nukes to kill enough of them to make it unthinkable.

You Poliaks need a De Gaulle, you are already the closest thing that Eastern Europe has to it's equivalent of the French.

 

[Zachowon]

My only issue with isolastion policies is that I know exactly what is gonna be the first thing they start cutting funding too.
Defense

 

[Batrix2070]

You are demonstrating a severe lack of understanding about how nuclear weapons, doctrine, and policy, work.

First off, there is a difference between tactical and strategic nuclear weapons. Tactical weapons can be deployed by something as small as an MLRS, and be an alternate payload for a strike fighter, missile cell on a ship, or even used as a glorified remote-detonation mine.

Strategic weapons are the big bombs and missiles that can generally be detected from long ranges, and are what provoke immediate responses when used.


Second off, there are only two nations in the world with currently-relevant systems regarding intercepting missiles, the USA and Israel. If there actually is a strategic nuclear exchange between the USA and other major powers, the USA is the only nation with a chance of coming out partially intact. The exact odds are unknown, but there is at least a chance, and with the current development arc of technology, the US's capabilities in that regard are going to be improving steadily, while it'll be decades or never before anyone else has the capability.

On top of that, given the US has a habit of developing technology to counter what it itself is already doing, odds are decent that by the time anyone else comes up with said capabilities, American penetration aids and the like will already be designed to overcome them. Not guaranteed, but a solid chance.


Third off, responding to tactical nuclear weapons with all-out strategic launch is standing policy for nobody.

If a hostile power tries to send their military across the Atlantic or Pacific, and the US responds with tactical nuclear weapons that blow the shit out of said invasion fleets, this is not an automatic 'and now everyone launches nukes and everyone dies.' It's also important to note that due to shorter travel distances and different delivery systems, tactical nukes will generally have detonated before there's even the chance at a strategic response, meaning decision-makers will have to make said decisions after the fact, not when tactical weapons are in the process of closing on their fleet.

Further, the very mutually-assured destruction you are talking about actually makes it less likely that tactical use will result in a strategic response. If the US tac-nukes the fleets, the enemy nations are out their expeditionary forces, but the nations themselves are still fully intact. If they then reply with strategic weapons, the US does likewise, and then everybody in major cities dies.

This means that MAD actually works against the invaders, because they can either accept the loss of a big chunk of their military, or they can all die in exchange for killing tens of millions of Americans out of sheer spite. They gain nothing except spiting America by launching strategic weapons.


The same is largely true for any other nuclear power. It is generally understood that attempting a conventional invasion of a nuclear power invites defensive nuclear response, which is why it'd be suidicing your military for little to no gain. India and Pakistan are something of an exception to this with each other.

The problem lies in the fact that all of this goes into the trash when America goes into isolation.

If any power becomes a superpower in a post-America world. It will make the rules, not the US. Americans will have to adapt if this superpower sets the rule, a nuclear strike is a nuclear strike and any attempt to use nuclear weapons on anything belonging to them is met with a full response.

It is the Americans who will be forced not to use the atom because it very quickly turns into destroying themselves and accomplishing nothing. What's the use of the atom in defense if you're going to die yourself right after? In the case of a simple defeat, you always have the opportunity to rise from defeat and get even later. After nuclear annihilation, there will be nothing like that. You have to be mad to use nuclear weapons.

To put it shorter sets the ball rolling on the US side, you want to defend yourself? Use something else, the nuclear solution immediately goes right to the top of the escalation.

And assuming that America will have a technological advantage in a situation of isolation over a superpower that just dominates the world. Particularly since isolationist America doesn't have that strong reason to keep its overgrown arms industry and research in its new situation. This is a heavily naive scenario.

A very strongly naive scenario, why should a country that is primarily concerned with itself still have an advantage in anything over a country that has just emerged victorious from a struggle for world domination. Such a state has already faced an analogous scenario with another country and won. They wouldn't have thrown themselves at America if they didn't see it as an opportunity to win. If someone already attacks America on its soil, they can probably handle even tactical nuclear weapons without a problem.

For them, America is just the ultimate boss to kill. The former hegemon who is gone but we want him never to return.

Fortunately, this scenario is as real as America's isolationism. That is, it is little, but it is possible.

Also, no one is going to seriously invade the US; the CCP or Russia might try something stupid in Alaska, but the US can keep our CONUS shores protected without a lot of foreign involvement or materials.

Today? Not for now, but in the future? Especially in isolationism? Most likely yes although it would be better if it never happened.

Look, you seem to be mistaking me for someone trying to push isolationism, rather than try to help make sure the US is less isolationist by pointing out when Euro's rant about what America needs to be/must be, it causes more isolationist feelings most of the time, not less.

Yes, people are tired, and getting their asses tired by melly lazy people only exacerbates this fatigue more. But this does not remove the problem that someone very much wishes to remove America into the shadows, and will exacerbate this fatigue for their own interests.

There will be someone if I was a superpower that wants to expand and my influence and a strong enemy bother me. And fighting him in his current state is too much trouble, if not suicide. I would strive to convince a hostile society that it is too tired, that allies leave them and parasitize their efforts. So that he himself, of his own free will, went into isolationism. That way I would have my hands free for my activities.

make other nations start paying what they said they would

There is a way, but you don't like it because of your anti-imperialism and liberalism. It is called zamordyzm (zamordism) in Polish. That is, literally taking someone by the face and forcing them to do what you want. If you don't want to play policeman, find volunteers, force the unwilling to help (you have enough power to do that) and bring the resistant down to the first floor and make them less important than they are and give the power over them to the volunteers to watch over them.

Otherwise, it's best for certain countries unwilling to help keep order *cough* Germany *cough* pull the plug and bill them for their past security services. Say you will pay so much and so much to maintain the US Army and US Navy to protect your area or they will keep order themselves but at their own expense. If the answer in both is no, then in response remove the protective umbrella over the country in question and thank you for your cooperation so far, for because it makes no sense.

That's what I'd do if I were you, weary of the constant wars to protect those who are shitting all over America and plotting behind their backs anyway. In short, give kick in ass to the parasites. They seem to have forgotten how things are.

 

[King Arts]

..You were saying.


View attachment 1606



You mean patriots, not silly people. We're done bleeding and going broke for you guys.

You wanna kill Russians so badly? Do it, they can't stop you, they're fucking pathetic and Poland has been seeking a solution to the Tartar problem since what? The fucking 1300s?

Don't bother us about it, take out your own trash. You're clearly bloodlusted enough.

Disappearance of Charlene Downes - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Why not post the wiki article instead of a buggy article?
Anyway while this modern day Sweeney tod might exist and makes one want to become a vegetarian that case is all kinds of fucked because of incompetent police and government.

 

[Marduk]

..You were saying.


View attachment 1606



You mean patriots, not silly people. We're done bleeding and going broke for you guys.

Nice slogans you have there, but no thinking behind the whole thing. Ignoring Europe doesn't make events there not affect you, ditto for any other place.

You wanna kill Russians so badly? Do it, they can't stop you, they're fucking pathetic and Poland has been seeking a solution to the Tartar problem since what? The fucking 1300s?

Don't bother us about it, take out your own trash. You're clearly bloodlusted enough.

So you're just clueless about the military strategic side of the issue then.

 

[King Arts]

The problem lies in the fact that all of this goes into the trash when America goes into isolation.

If any power becomes a superpower in a post-America world. It will make the rules, not the US. Americans will have to adapt if this superpower sets the rule, a nuclear strike is a nuclear strike and any attempt to use nuclear weapons on anything belonging to them is met with a full response.

It is the Americans who will be forced not to use the atom because it very quickly turns into destroying themselves and accomplishing nothing. What's the use of the atom in defense if you're going to die yourself right after? In the case of a simple defeat, you always have the opportunity to rise from defeat and get even later. After nuclear annihilation, there will be nothing like that. You have to be mad to use nuclear weapons.

To put it shorter sets the ball rolling on the US side, you want to defend yourself? Use something else, the nuclear solution immediately goes right to the top of the escalation.

And assuming that America will have a technological advantage in a situation of isolation over a superpower that just dominates the world. Particularly since isolationist America doesn't have that strong reason to keep its overgrown arms industry and research in its new situation. This is a heavily naive scenario.

A very strongly naive scenario, why should a country that is primarily concerned with itself still have an advantage in anything over a country that has just emerged victorious from a struggle for world domination. Such a state has already faced an analogous scenario with another country and won. They wouldn't have thrown themselves at America if they didn't see it as an opportunity to win. If someone already attacks America on its soil, they can probably handle even tactical nuclear weapons without a problem.

For them, America is just the ultimate boss to kill. The former hegemon who is gone but we want him never to return.

Fortunately, this scenario is as real as America's isolationism. That is, it is little, but it is possible.

Today? Not for now, but in the future? Especially in isolationism? Most likely yes although it would be better if it never happened.


Yes, people are tired, and getting their asses tired by melly lazy people only exacerbates this fatigue more. But this does not remove the problem that someone very much wishes to remove America into the shadows, and will exacerbate this fatigue for their own interests.

There will be someone if I was a superpower that wants to expand and my influence and a strong enemy bother me. And fighting him in his current state is too much trouble, if not suicide. I would strive to convince a hostile society that it is too tired, that allies leave them and parasitize their efforts. So that he himself, of his own free will, went into isolationism. That way I would have my hands free for my activities.


There is a way, but you don't like it because of your anti-imperialism and liberalism. It is called zamordyzm (zamordism) in Polish. That is, literally taking someone by the face and forcing them to do what you want. If you don't want to play policeman, find volunteers, force the unwilling to help (you have enough power to do that) and bring the resistant down to the first floor and make them less important than they are and give the power over them to the volunteers to watch over them.

Otherwise, it's best for certain countries unwilling to help keep order *cough* Germany *cough* pull the plug and bill them for their past security services. Say you will pay so much and so much to maintain the US Army and US Navy to protect your area or they will keep order themselves but at their own expense. If the answer in both is no, then in response remove the protective umbrella over the country in question and thank you for your cooperation so far, for because it makes no sense.

That's what I'd do if I were you, weary of the constant wars to protect those who are shitting all over America and plotting behind their backs anyway. In short, give kick in ass to the parasites. They seem to have forgotten how things are.

So you think nukes will never be used in defense against another nuclear power? You honestly think if America right now invaded Russia they would not launch? I’m sorry but it’s you poles who are truly mad if you think that.

 

[Batrix2070]

So you think nukes will never be used in defense against another nuclear power? You honestly think if America right now invaded Russia they would not launch? I’m sorry but it’s you poles who are truly mad if you think that.

I believe that the atom, in a conventional war between nuclear powers, is and should only be a safeguard against attempts to force unilateral surrender and impose their will on the loser.

Trying to use nukes as a direct defense against an invader for me leads immediately to nuclear war, and how not. This is what opens Pandora's box, a box that should never be opened. Because where would then be the limit in using nukes? And I prefer not to risk playing with atomic shooting. Let them stay where they are, in the launchers.

Atom to destroy the enemy, can only be used in the scenario when a non-atomic country attacks a nuclear country. Because then there is no threat of mutual destruction. Only punishment of the idiots.

In any other scenario, it's just a safeguard and a bogeyman.

 

[mrttao]

My only issue with isolastion policies is that I know exactly what is gonna be the first thing they start cutting funding too.
Defense

What "defense". The military is fully crewed by SJWs who are treating it as a welfare program. Not to mention all the graft that lines politician pockets

It is not about how much money you have, but how that money is being spent.

 

[Agent23]

My only issue with isolastion policies is that I know exactly what is gonna be the first thing they start cutting funding too.
Defense

Yeah, we all know you are guardiang your paycheck to a degree.
But once that money stays in the more productive parts of the economy you can find a civilian job.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Nice slogans you have there, but no thinking behind the whole thing. Ignoring Europe doesn't make events there not affect you, ditto for any other place.

The logic is simple: "fuck the world, they don't deserve us...also fuck our leaders for destroying our economy to sate their greed and ensure your comfort over ours".

So you're just clueless about the military strategic side of the issue then.

Either Russia is a paper tiger that can't handle some shithole on its border run by a retard who got famous for playing a piano with his dick and fucking babies. Or it's a juggernaut.

You can have one or the other but not both.

If it's a paper tiger, go sate your genocidal urges and leave us out of your Rwandan style drama.

What "defense". The military is fully crewed by SJWs who are treating it as a welfare program. Not to mention all the graft that lines politician pockets

It is not about how much money you have, but how that money is being spent.

Yeah, the US military leadership has no loyalty to the US, it has loyalty to the GAE and their desire to rape kids and make front holes for themselves.

We could honestly do with less generals and Admirals, probably less spies too.

We need to reduce the US IC to its pre-civil war size. I'm not exactly happy about my taxes going to traitors who care about "The message" more than the constitution or the people.

Disappearance of Charlene Downes - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Why not post the wiki article instead of a buggy article?
Anyway while this modern day Sweeney tod might exist and makes one want to become a vegetarian that case is all kinds of fucked because of incompetent police and government.

The point was that the cultural enrichment of Western Europe hadn't devolved to "Pedophilic cannibals" yet.

You were incorrect.

 

[Bacle]

...Bacle what the fuck are you talking about? The only commies in this stupid fucking fake war are Western European countries. The EU is filled with retards arresting women who got raped by Arabs for reporting their rapists as arabs, locking their countries down and jabbing them at gun point, arresting people like Tommy Robinson for punching pedos in public, forcefully removing children from hospital beds and giving them vaxxed blood..They're the ones with controlled economies wherein everyone gets a stipend from the state at the expense of the few people able to work and earn; they're the ones with epidemics of exploding mailboxes and 1600 sexual assaults on a new years eve all covered up by the politburo.

Western Europe is where kebabs made of former child prostitutes were served in Pakistani restaurants for years because leftist politicians say it's integral for the bourgeoisie to shut up about it and take one for the team.

Russia and the Ukraine aren't capitalist, and they aren't communist. Both of those countries are reduced to states too primitive to be either. They're thuggocracies governed by drug dealers.

You're right I hate leftists and I hate leftism and I hate communism. That's why I don't give a single solitary fuck what happens in Europe. They're all a bunch of effete Marxists and cultural nihilists.

This ain't the 1980's dude...Russia isn't communist, Russia's not anything. It is insanity for you to suggest we're facing the USSR...that's fucking wild Bacle.


...Most conservatives are part of the GAE/globalists and the ones who aren't are moving away from conservatism and embracing a Christian traditionalism.

I don't care about cultural embalmers, most of us in the New Right don't, hell most conservatives are abandoning political conservatism because they're tired of conserving democratic talking points from the 1980's.


Then the US can reemerge and do what the Mongols did. "Knock this shit off or we will Golden Horde in Baghdad on your ass"

Y'all ain't gaining on us, when most of you are collapsing due to your own internal problems while being propped up by us.

What makes you think you'll survive without us? We've been artificially keeping Europe going since the treaty of Versailles.



Desperate animals trying to keep the other foot from entering the grave tend to do desperate things. Too bad the Ukrainian Government is so lazy and corrupt it can't drive out a bunch of half dead barbarians without extensive bribes and money laundering from the US.


All the more reason not to involve ourselves in an external tribal bitchfit, we gotta deal with our own almost mortal social problems...problems encouraged by the US IC and imported by European schools of thought by the by!




Yeah, no it's not like zelensky didn't try and start a nuclear war or anything.

Sorry, but you are just plain wrong that Russia is not still a commie state, or that the West are the commies now. I mean shit, Putin was a fucking KGB colonel, and most of the Russian leadership are former Soviet personnel as it is.

This rant of yours may sound like a lot of good rhetorical bit strung together to some who want to abandon Ukraine, however it doesn't actually address what I said or give any sort of meaningful rebuttal, and no amount of pedo's or grooming gangs in UK justifies what you desire with abandoning Ukraine and international relations in general.

You aren't going to get the isolationist America to the degree you want, you won't see Ukraine abandoned, and you will help show how easy it is for foreign psy-ops to manipulate American public opinion.

If the Right want to win the culture war in America, don't burn social capital on stupid and moronic positions and fights like trying to get us to abandon Ukraine or go full isolationist. All that does is actually make winning the culture war harder.

The problem lies in the fact that all of this goes into the trash when America goes into isolation.

If any power becomes a superpower in a post-America world. It will make the rules, not the US. Americans will have to adapt if this superpower sets the rule, a nuclear strike is a nuclear strike and any attempt to use nuclear weapons on anything belonging to them is met with a full response.

It is the Americans who will be forced not to use the atom because it very quickly turns into destroying themselves and accomplishing nothing. What's the use of the atom in defense if you're going to die yourself right after? In the case of a simple defeat, you always have the opportunity to rise from defeat and get even later. After nuclear annihilation, there will be nothing like that. You have to be mad to use nuclear weapons.

To put it shorter sets the ball rolling on the US side, you want to defend yourself? Use something else, the nuclear solution immediately goes right to the top of the escalation.

And assuming that America will have a technological advantage in a situation of isolation over a superpower that just dominates the world. Particularly since isolationist America doesn't have that strong reason to keep its overgrown arms industry and research in its new situation. This is a heavily naive scenario.

A very strongly naive scenario, why should a country that is primarily concerned with itself still have an advantage in anything over a country that has just emerged victorious from a struggle for world domination. Such a state has already faced an analogous scenario with another country and won. They wouldn't have thrown themselves at America if they didn't see it as an opportunity to win. If someone already attacks America on its soil, they can probably handle even tactical nuclear weapons without a problem.

For them, America is just the ultimate boss to kill. The former hegemon who is gone but we want him never to return.

Fortunately, this scenario is as real as America's isolationism. That is, it is little, but it is possible.

Today? Not for now, but in the future? Especially in isolationism? Most likely yes although it would be better if it never happened.


Yes, people are tired, and getting their asses tired by melly lazy people only exacerbates this fatigue more. But this does not remove the problem that someone very much wishes to remove America into the shadows, and will exacerbate this fatigue for their own interests.

There will be someone if I was a superpower that wants to expand and my influence and a strong enemy bother me. And fighting him in his current state is too much trouble, if not suicide. I would strive to convince a hostile society that it is too tired, that allies leave them and parasitize their efforts. So that he himself, of his own free will, went into isolationism. That way I would have my hands free for my activities.


There is a way, but you don't like it because of your anti-imperialism and liberalism. It is called zamordyzm (zamordism) in Polish. That is, literally taking someone by the face and forcing them to do what you want. If you don't want to play policeman, find volunteers, force the unwilling to help (you have enough power to do that) and bring the resistant down to the first floor and make them less important than they are and give the power over them to the volunteers to watch over them.

Otherwise, it's best for certain countries unwilling to help keep order *cough* Germany *cough* pull the plug and bill them for their past security services. Say you will pay so much and so much to maintain the US Army and US Navy to protect your area or they will keep order themselves but at their own expense. If the answer in both is no, then in response remove the protective umbrella over the country in question and thank you for your cooperation so far, for because it makes no sense.

That's what I'd do if I were you, weary of the constant wars to protect those who are shitting all over America and plotting behind their backs anyway. In short, give kick in ass to the parasites. They seem to have forgotten how things are.

See, this all operates as though any American pull back would mean cutting our Navy to the point it cannot stop an invasion of CONUS, and like America not being the hegemony of the world can only lead to our destruction.

Which is silly, and undermines the whole point you are trying to make.

We aren't Poland, you guys don't have ocean sized moats, NASA, or nukes, or have enough orbital assets to keep track of all the important shit in the world.

You are effectively trying to create, and knock down, a strawman of what the US's actual situation is/could be if we went isolationist, and your whole idea ignores US soft-power potential with economics, Silicon Valley, things like GPS, and Hollywood would not disappear if the US military wasn't trying to play world police.

I think you are overhyping the situation of possible US isolationism, overhyping how severe any isolationism would be (we wouldn't be Japan shutting our borders for 200 years) and actually making isolationism more likely with hyperbole and exaggeration of the situation that could face the US.

If Poles don't want the US to go isolationist, then please stop engaging in the same arguments and rhtorical tactics that make people in the US want to be isolationist just to spite nossy and bossy Euro's.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Sorry, but you are just plain wrong that Russia is not still a commie state, or that the West are the commies now. I mean shit, Putin was a fucking KGB colonel, and most of the Russian leadership are former Soviet personnel as it is.

This rant of yours may sound like a lot of good rhetorical bit strung together to some who want to abandon Ukraine, however it doesn't actually address what I said or give any sort of meaningful rebuttal, and no amount of pedo's or grooming gangs in UK justifies what you desire with abandoning Ukraine and international relations in general.

What you said was fucking insane, talking points right out of Mitch Sean Hannity and Lindsey Grahams mouths...it sounds like some Langly talking point and is absolutely absurd.

So yeah it rebutts it, it points out actual communism in practice amongst our allies and the absolute state of irrelevant primitivity of our enemies.

Sorry you're too psyopped to understand that. But the Cold war ended 32 years ago, and the last of our civil liberties went with it.

And yes, we will see the Ukraine abandoned Bacle, we've already succeeded in turning public support away from the war to the point that President Penis Piano had to whine about it in a presser.

We're winning, precisely because we keep pushing the social issues you find "stupid"....and it's gonna be awesome. The world is gonna be a better place when the New Right asserts itself fully.

 

[Bacle]

What you said was fucking insane, talking points right out of Mitch Sean Hannity and Lindsey Grahams mouths...it sounds like some Langly talking point and is absolutely absurd.

So yeah it rebutts it, it points out actual communism in practice amongst our allies and the absolute state of irrelevant primitivity of our enemies.

Sorry you're too psyopped to understand that. But the Cold war ended 32 years ago and the last of our civil liberties went with it.

And yes, we will see the Ukraine abandoned Bacle, we've already succeded in turning public support away from the war to the point that President Penis Piano had to whine about it in a presser.

We're winning.....and it's gonna be awesome.

...why do I even fucking try.

Well, at least now I can prepare myself for when the Dems sweep up in 2024, using the 'GOP wants to cut aid to Ukraine and appease Russia' soundbites to make it so much easier to hide their own misdeeds at home.

 

[Batrix2070]

See, this all operates as though any American pull back would mean cutting our Navy to the point it cannot stop an invasion of CONUS, and like America not being the hegemony of the world can only lead to our destruction.

Which is silly, and undermines the whole point you are trying to make.

We aren't Poland, you guys don't have ocean sized moats, NASA, or nukes, or have enough orbital assets to keep track of all the important shit in the world.

You are effectively trying to create, and knock down, a strawman of what the US's actual situation is/could be if we went isolationist, and your whole idea ignores US soft-power potential with economics, Silicon Valley, things like GPS, and Hollywood would not disappear if the US military wasn't trying to play world police.

I think you are overhyping the situation of possible US isolationism, overhyping how severe any isolationism would be (we wouldn't be Japan shutting our borders for 200 years) and actually making isolationism more likely with hyperbole and exaggeration of the situation that could face the US.

If Poles don't want the US to go isolationist, then please stop engaging in the same arguments and rhtorical tactics that make people in the US want to be isolationist just to spite nossy and bossy Euro's.

Okay, let me explain as simply as possible.
Better to assume the worst possible scenario and be glad it's not there. Because the whole, make for a bad Euro is the same as in this saying.

To spite mommy, I'll frostbite my ears.

It's not Poland that will pay for the stupidity of isolation, it's the greatest United States, which apparently needs to see for itself what it means to have no foreign influence.

Because it is not in my interest that you play the World Policeman, but your own. And if you think that there won't be forces pushing you into more isolationism because it pays off for them, then I don't know what I can say anymore.

 

[Zachowon]

What "defense". The military is fully crewed by SJWs who are treating it as a welfare program. Not to mention all the graft that lines politician pockets

It is not about how much money you have, but how that money is being spent.

You do know the US has the most powerful military in the world right.
And majority of that money goes towards not the SJW stuff, which Congress has full control over btw.


But what I am getting at is, all the money from going isolated would gut the military and then guess what.
Welfare for all.
Because we have no need for a military when the world doesn't bother us.
States can have thier own if they want.

That is what would happen.

 

[Marduk]

The logic is simple: "fuck the world, they don't deserve us...also fuck our leaders for destroying our economy to sate their greed and ensure your comfort over ours".

Unfortunately you cannot escape from either, and neither will go away if you ignore it either, quite the opposite in fact.

Either Russia is a paper tiger that can't handle some shithole on its border run by a retard who got famous for playing a piano with his dick and fucking babies. Or it's a juggernaut.

You can have one or the other but not both.

If it's a paper tiger, go sate your genocidal urges and leave us out of your Rwandan style drama.

Rarely in history such extremes happen, and anyone with a real clue about this topic does not subscribe to such propaganda takes of either side, even there it's an extreme view.

Where you are absolutely right is that we can't have both, i'll go even further, we absolutely should have neither, we should be realistic instead.

 

[Cherico]

Okay, let me explain as simply as possible.
Better to assume the worst possible scenario and be glad it's not there. Because the whole, make for a bad Euro is the same as in this saying.

To spite mommy, I'll frostbite my ears.

It's not Poland that will pay for the stupidity of isolation, it's the greatest United States, which apparently needs to see for itself what it means to have no foreign influence.

Because it is not in my interest that you play the World Policeman, but your own. And if you think that there won't be forces pushing you into more isolationism because it pays off for them, then I don't know what I can say anymore.

The thing is man we are really getting tired of bailing you out.

Seriously Dog has a point its been once thing after another with you guys since versalies. We helped prop up your economies in the inter war period, then we got stuck intervening in world war two. Then we had to station troops in europe to keep the communists from conquering you out right and spent billions to help you rebuild, and we used our navy to let you trade freely.

Then the soviets fall and you guys can't even handle fucking Serbia, and we get called in to bail you out of that. Then you guys said that the EU was the new super power and when the economic crisis happened you guys couldn't handle that shit either and we got stuck bailing out your banks under the table again.

Then this crisis.

We litterally warned you for 30 FUCKING years not to trust the russians that you couldn't rely on their oil then Ukraine happens and were stuck bailing you guys out again.


And heres the thing, all of that all of those decades of hard work, all of our people who died so you could be comfortable in your homes, all of that money spent to keep you functional all of the sacerfice we made for generations?

You guys are not grateful for any of it.

And were getting real tried of helping you out and getting spit in our face as our reward.