Commentary on the current affairs of The Sietch

[Bacle]

To what I've said in private, I believe I have generally maintained that that post is a true representation of my feelings. Maybe I was slightly meaner than I had to be, or I could have more decisively said that I didn't personally see egregious racism or bigotry, but that's at most a minor issue of emphasis. I imagine you know me well enough by this point to understand that I hate speaking ill of anyone.

And I think it's best that we leave that point there. This topic is about the Sietch - not about whatever grudges you might have against me on SB.

This site and the PM issue are intrinsically linked, there is no way around that. And a 'grudge' is not why I have been after you about this.

It is more than a simple 'minor emphasis' issue, particularly given you barely had enough presence to judge the PM at all. And given the way things were going then, you had to realize to you were feeding the mob what they wanted to hear.

The reason I am keeping at this is because I thought you were better than this, and would be willing to admit what you just did via that post, without needing to be prodded into it by me and others.

You say you are here trying to tell friends when they made a mistake, fine. Well as someone who, despite all this, still does like you and respect you, I have been trying to get you to own yours publically, nothing more or less. I own my mistakes without needing this much prodding, and I know you are a better man than me; I just want you to act like it.

I'll leave it at that.

 

[Rocinante]

I'll just chime in...if we were to reverse the clock and erase all those mistakes UA mentioned (I agree these things were handled very poorly, for the record, but vehemently disagree with the 'acting like nazis' thing) we would still be called Nazis by those who consider us enemies.

It doesn't matter. We are Nazis to them. Period. I posted a message to my account on SB stating i'm taking leave, and the response in the discord was to call me a fucking rapist. They hate us. We cannot change that.

These people don't care how we present ourselves. Those mistakes don't matter. They've already made their decision: we are Nazis.

The best thing to do from here is to learn from those mistakes, but even more importantly, to shrug off the fact that people are calling us Nazis. That, my friends, is out of our control. It's a thing we cannot change, and therefore should not be stressed about.


God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
the courage to change the things I can,
and the wisdom to know the difference.

 

[Harlock]

That’s a nice quote, where’d you get it?

Dunno, just something I must have heard in the distant past and remembered as useful

 

[Deleted member]

@Unhappy Anchovy , yes, you are right. I came home from an eleven hour day that ended with emails invoking OSHA regulatons and my acting boss and I raising our voices. It wasn’t very nice. I am very particular about safety implementation.

What I saw was a thread with the same paucity of thought and passive use of the terms thrown about by the left which has always upset me, because words are often twisted around and redefined. I tend to make a single very serious mistake when drunk—I treat message board conversation like an actual version conversation. I type at 103 words per minute, error corrected, and have been living in chat rooms since 1994. I also tend to assume, unfortunately, that even people I disagree with are debating in good faith and have actually familiarised myself with the views I have. That’s the consequence of alcohol. It led me to believe that the thread would be capable of contextualising the comment to understand how tongue-in-cheek (with a measure of real seriousness, that Oxford style you know) that comment was. When they didn’t I got angry, then Fried talked to me on Discord and I got scared. Both were frankly worse than the original mistake.

That’s all there is to it. I haven’t debated online in, oh, well, more than half a decade anyway. To be honest, I wouldn’t be doing it so much now if my post volume hadn’t seemed important to growing the community.

@Quirel , we will delete the posts outright as should have been done to begin with, it was wrong to edit them, but editing them back is essentially compelled speech from me to my view of it.

 

[Husky_Khan]

@Unhappy Anchovy

I worry for you. You have seemingly hostile posters here and possible kangaroo courts waiting for you at SB if you in their eyes step out of line. Maybe best to leave here?

To be clear, I'm not saying "GTFO Unhappy Anchovy!!" cause you suck or something but more of worry cause you are an elder on SB. You were there before all the drama with Athene, I forget, that brought about SV. It'd be a shame to see you attacked by idealogues.

Just my thoughts. Stay safe.

Pretty sure UA invited all of this "notoriety" on himself. Theres no mistake in that his post was one of the first ones and it was a huge one that was 'sympathetically' critical of The Sietch and it's his posts that are ironically sustaining his criticisms of this places community (Well that and this corners owner can't help but go half cocked into everything).

One example is that just by replying to them you all are apparently reinforcing a "Nazi" narrative because Nazis felt defensive too. UA literally conjured this up.

But seriously I'm sure UA is fine. He's probably getting a couple likes as he details his adventures here on SB's staff forum or wherever they dwell and responses from fellow staff ranging from mortified smh'ing to various shades of schadenfreude and amusement.

The previous thread about inter forum drama hadn't been posted in for several days prior to this showing that the base Of this community really didn't give that much of a damn about things on SB enough to comment on it. But the "sympathetic critics" of this website really wanted this thread and after getting permission finally made this thread to whine about interforum drama some more. It's not a conspiracy or anything but it's pretty clear that it's not us Nazis that feel the urge to whine about things. This whole thread is basically set up to feed the critics and every response from you sturmtruppen (including this one I guess) is doing so.

 

[Vargas Fan]

I'll let it be known that I am an SB staff member, but to be honest, I rarely get involved in politics. US politics to me has always seemed a bit, what's the word, not crazy, not extreme, but different. However, living in the UK we have our own screw ups right now, and living in Scotland, because I don't treat Braveheart as a documentary, more than once I've been told that traitorous filth like me will be garrotted/shot/hung/gassed (add as appropriate) come the glorious day.

On top of that, at the moment I have a number of personal problems that are preying on me right now. I just basically look at non political stuff.

 

[Tyzuris]

Neither, from what I know of the situation; they just used info from Rufus's public posts to connect the dots, so to speak. Rufus wasn't exactly shy about posting personal info on SB.

Yeah. He had linked one video from a fan convention of some series where he was interviewed on camera to SB. For someone so insecure about separating his "real life" (oh lord I hate that term) from his online activity, he sure as hell did a poor job at it.

 

[FriedCFour]

The most damaging thing happening to this site right now is the lie being spread that its full of malware or for hacking accounts. The rest of the drama draws people, clearly, and we have a solid fanfic and RP section that draws the apolitical thats amazing for a site this size. Malware and hacking though? That makes just about everyone think twice before joining way more than accusations about us wearing funny little armbands and hating juice.

 

[Guardian Box]

The most damaging thing happening to this site right now is the lie being spread that its full of malware or for hacking accounts. The rest of the drama draws people, clearly, and we have a solid fanfic and RP section that draws the apolitical thats amazing for a site this size. Malware and hacking though? That makes just about everyone think twice before joining way more than accusations about us wearing funny little armbands and hating juice.

The registration process here checks for compromised email addresses, and made me change all of my passwords.

So it's like a complete opposite of that.

 

[JagerIV]

I don't see the issue with the Admins having different accounts: it lets you argue with them like normal people, instead of Admins. Zoe's issue was that they didn't adequately separate the two: an admin account should be used for just admin stuff, basically near form letter stuff where their personality barely comes across.

 

[Emperor Tippy]

The narrative given here - and reinforced by other staff members - is that the Sietch is under attack by a malicious external conspiracy of the left.

It's not a narrative. We literally have a long list of screenshots filled with numerous individuals across multiple platforms talking about, advocating for, planning, and carrying out attacks on TS, its members, and its staff in a coordinated manner. That is by definition a malicious external conspiracy. And seeing as virtually all of them are on the "left" end of the political spectrum the "of the left" is also nothing less than the truth.

They have already reported us to our hosting service claiming with blatantly made up claims.

Did I say "you look like Nazis" for cheap shock value? Maybe for shock value, yeah, a bit. But I wanted to communicate, in appropriately urgent terms, where I think you're going wrong.

And in doing so you could have technically been hit for a ToS violation. Calling people Nazi's without evidence that they are actually Nazis is not allowed on TS. You admit to doing it for "shock value" and that is exactly why the rule exists; the Nazi's were an abomination against humanity and using them to try and score some shock value points in a meaningless online debate only serves to cause people to ignore just how much of an abomination the Nazis were.

The visible behaviour and messaging of staff helps to establish which views can be stated or exchanged. Culture matters.

Our position is that all* views can be stated, exchanged, and advocated. We are not going to content police ideas (beyond what is specified in the ToS). The culture that we want is one where any user can express whatever ideas they feel like for whatever reasons they feel like.

If someone expresses ideas that you disagree with then engage them and show them (or others) how they are wrong/those ideas are flawed. Or, if their idea is really stupid, just call them an idiot and get on with your life.

 

[Atreus]

I don't see the issue with the Admins having different accounts: it lets you argue with them like normal people, instead of Admins. Zoe's issue was that they didn't adequately separate the two: an admin account should be used for just admin stuff, basically near form letter stuff where their personality barely comes across.

Anon staff accounts could also be used to artificially bulwark unpopular policies, especially if they aren't as transparently obvious as Zoe. And Especially with such a low active userbase. How do we know users in here aren't staff patting themselves and others on the back? What self policing do they have in the use of such accounts? I mean, I can just imagine the outrage of some us if the SB staff acted even remotely similar to this. But apparently because we're managed by the "in" crowd, its fine because of "righteousness". Just seems chilling tbh, you never know if someone you are arguing with is going to turn out to be staff in disguise and hold it against you later on.

 

[Realm]

It's not a narrative. We literally have a long list of screenshots filled with numerous individuals across multiple platforms talking about, advocating for, planning, and carrying out attacks on TS, its members, and its staff in a coordinated manner. That is by definition a malicious external conspiracy. And seeing as virtually all of them are on the "left" end of the political spectrum the "of the left" is also nothing less than the truth.

They have already reported us to our hosting service claiming with blatantly made up claims.

Have you posted these screenshots anywhere?

I'm aware of the one guy from FiC who posted the hosting service, but I was under the impression that everyone told him not to do that but I could be wrong.

Also, the discord says hi, no one there's planning a conspiracy against you, we just find you all kinda funny to a bit depressing.

 

[Emperor Tippy]

Have you posted these screenshots anywhere?

I'm aware of the one guy from FiC who posted the hosting service, but I was under the impression that everyone told him not to do that but I could be wrong.

Also, the discord says hi, no one there's planning a conspiracy against you, we just find you all kinda funny to a bit depressing.

Ah yes, the discord that banned me for having the audacity to say hello and is run by people who think I should be killed. That discord

 

[Realm]

Ah yes, the discord that banned me for having the audacity to say hello and is run by people who think I should be killed. That discord

I mean, I've eaten both a ban and been told I should be murdered here on the Sietch, so I'm not sure those indicate any sort of fundamental disqualification in your mind.

Also, Rodyle got banned like, immediately after saying that, so I'm not sure your complaint

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

I mean, I've eaten both a ban and been told I should be murdered here on the Sietch, so I'm not sure those indicate any sort of fundamental disqualification in your mind.

Did you report someone saying you should be murdered?

 

[Realm]

Did you report someone saying you should be murdered?

Seeing as a mod threadbanned both me and him for going off topic, with no further sanction I can only assume it was read with mod eye balls

 

[FriedCFour]

I mean, I've eaten both a ban and been told I should be murdered here on the Sietch,

Are you talking about my meme? It was for a meme war, and to be fair you did the exact same to many of us with many of your own memes. You will also notice I liked and posted socialist memes myself. For me it was about funny shitposting. I am sorry if that really did hurt you.

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

Seeing as a mod threadbanned both me and him for going off topic, with no further sanction I can only assume it was read with mod eye balls

So to be clear, you were in some kind of a spat, and a mod punished both of you, including whoever went out of line.

So what you meant to say was "The mods did not ignore someone telling me to die in a fight".

 

[Realm]

Are you talking about my meme? It was for a meme war, and to be fair you did the exact same to many of us with many of your own memes. You will also notice I liked and posted socialist memes myself. For me it was about funny shitposting. I am sorry if that really did hurt you.

Gold ranger, not you, thanks for the thought.

So to be clear, you were in some kind of a spat, and a mod punished both of you, including whoever went out of line.

So what you meant to say was "The mods did not ignore someone telling me to die in a fight".

Kek, aight, getting slapped for derailing after saying someone deserves to be murdered is definitely addressing the elephant in the room, u right dawg