'Climate Change' and the coming 'Climate Lockdown'

Read the next line of the post you are quoting.
They only need to do it in minutes if the power consumption spike is a SURPRISE.

1. We have weather forecasts. We know days in advance when and how much power is needed.
Weather forecasts have limited reliability. With further secondary effect grown with increasing share of renewables in the grid.
It's going to be cold and cloudy? Well, not only people will want power for heating, but solar will produce less, so you need to compensate for that too.
2. You are completely ignoring the fact that nuclear power plants can and do store power into Pumped-Storage-Hydropower. Look at the ramp time for PSH not for nuclear
There is a very limited amount of it available, and building the kind of megaconstructions that add a lot gets hit with a lot of green tape.
3. You are making a backwards semantics argument. Your logic is:
> Peaker plants are designed to "provide power during peak hours"
> Traditionally this was done via "plants that are off most of the time and turn on fast"
> Thus the textbook definition describes them "plants that are off most of the time and turn on fast to provide power at peak times"
> Thus this tech that can "provide power during peak hours" cannot actually "provide power during peak hours" because the textbook definition says peaker plant must turn on fast.

Put aside the textbook definition. Peaker plants are designed to provide power during peak hours. A natural gas plant that can turn on in minutes is one way to do it.
A nuclear power plant that is connected to a weather forecast + hydro storage facility is another way to do it.
Again, both of these have massive problems of their own that can in fact get worse in scale than the peaker plant problem.
Also you would still need peaker plants anyway because a weather forecast cannot predict, say, a grid junction or power plant failure, as i said, they don't even predict weather that accurately.
And even if they did, predicting the weather means jack shit if the prediction is that compensating for the change in renewable production and consumption due to weather will happen faster than the nuclear reactor and the hydro support can ramp up or down.
 
They only need to do it in minutes if the power consumption spike is a SURPRISE.
No, it's actually because most "peaker plant" usage cases actually have dramatic spikes in a matter of minutes and overproduction damages equipment. While hydrogen electrolysis facilities and hydroelectric storage are functional ways around the overproduction problem for preparatory ramp-up that nuclear demands, those supplemental facilities are liable get attached to the nuclearization price-tag as required infrastructure making the proposal that much less viable due to up-front costs.
 
Again, both of these have massive problems of their own that can in fact get worse in scale than the peaker plant problem.
Also you would still need peaker plants anyway because a weather forecast cannot predict, say, a grid junction or power plant failure, as i said, they don't even predict weather that accurately.
I am perfectly ok with having natural gas plants acting as backup for cases where a nuclear plant connected to weather forecast + hydro storage turns out to be insufficient. Either due to incorrect forecasting or due to the spike being caused by a different thing.

The ideal setup really is:
> extensive water storage
> homes have roof solar. pump excess electricity to grid either for other consumers or for hydro storage facility
> wind only allowed if they solve the bird genocide problem. we need birds!
> nuclear power plants provide bulk of power. with weather prediction and the hydro storage allowing nuclear to provide the predictable consumption fluctuations brought about by air conditioning.
> natural gas plants as backup which are usually powered down until some emergency happens
 
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No, it's actually because most "peaker plant" usage cases actually have dramatic spikes in a matter of minutes and overproduction damages equipment. While hydrogen electrolysis facilities and hydroelectric storage are functional ways around the overproduction problem for preparatory ramp-up that nuclear demands, those supplemental facilities are liable get attached to the nuclearization price-tag as required infrastructure making the proposal that much less viable due to up-front costs.
PSH is absolutely essential for solar and wind. So we are expanding those facilities anyways.
If we attach their price to nuclear, we should also attach their price to solar and wind.

Yes it adds cost to the system compared to nuclear without PSH.
It is still worth it for nuclear because nuclear is so much cheaper than other forms of energy on a per watt basis. So the additional cost of PSH does not dislodge nuclear from the number 1 spot.
 
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People... didn't they just use Cowpox, a similar-enough but non-fatal virus?

All the strange stuff came later. But the problem is that Smallpox was a DNA-based virus, and thus relatively stable, while the Coronavirus family are all RNA-based.

It still seems to be that if you are a pureblood, you catch Covid-19 once, recover, and then don't get it again.
While if you are Pfizer-injected, you will get Covid over and over and over.

Cowpox the way Jenner would infect people was pretty nasty.

Poking infection from cows into people, then taking those infected sores and poking someone else mixing with fluids.

Might have made me them immune to small pox, might also have caused down syndrome.

There's really not any good way to inoculate.
 
facepalm.
we literally have videos of the worlds oligarchs gathering up in the world economic forum and outlining their plans exactly and specifically.
it is not conspiracy theories. it is conspiracy facts.

Also, you must have been living under a rock somewhere if you have not noticed the "for the environment" ban craze.
They say it is a conspiracy theory until the very moment they go through with the ban.
Like how they repeatedly said nobody wants to ban gas stoves and then they started banning gas stoves.
And none of this has anything to do with the concept of a walkable city.

Protip, 'conspiracy theory' doesn't mean it's nonsense.
It just means there's a theory of a conspiracy, and conspiracies are real/existing things.

And they openly talk about this shit on live TV, it's not nonsense at all.

You WILL live in the pod.

You WILL eat the bugs.

You WILL own nothing.

And YOU WILL BE HAPPY.
Hence why I added the modifier nonsense to it.

And none of that has to do with walkable cities.
If you want to live in one, that's your choice. But don't try to force everyone else into it.
Does "I will never understand" really mean "I refuse to understand" ?



The answer to that is that we need to make it be realistic for Joe Normal to outright own his suburban or rural home. The sort of plan I have vaguely in mind involves a big pile of dead oligarchs.

Anyway, before you sound of on "I don't understand why..." or suchlike, maybe educate yourself a little on what is actually being discussed. Lean about the type of existence the Important People intend for everyone else, and ask yourself sane questions like:
"Is this the sort of environment in which anyone would want to try to raise children?"
When did I mention forcing everyone else into it? It's other people freaking about because somebody mentioned building one.

And again, none of what you mentioned has anything to do with the concept of walkable cities.
Here is a video released by world economic forum, a yearly meeting in Davos resort in switzerland.

The minimum requirement to be invited to WEF is to make over 5 billion dollars a year with your business. almost all the oligarchs from western nations are members of the WEF.




You might say "well clearly this is just a single random moron"... except the WEF itself decided to push the "you will own nothing and be happy" on their website, facebook, and twitter.


And again, the WEF's vision of commoners not owning anything has nothing to do with the concept of a walkable city.
Because the "walkable cities" come with their advantage advertisement in the name, but no one wants to weight the disadvantages, because that concept absolutely does have them, and many (especially greens) want to handwave them away, or even make them sound like necessities. I obviously mean shitting on car owners with restrictions and taxes in particular, and we all know what political factions love that.

Yeah, the property bubble problem is spreading from cities to suburbs, which raises even more complex questions, why would the kind of people who can afford to live in a "walkable city" want it to be walkable? Who is supposed to live in a city anyway?
Say, for someone who is not particularly healthy, be it from age, sickness or being a lardass, the need to walk or use public transport to get anywhere can quickly turn from advantage to disadvantage. Or even someone who for work or other reason needs to carry around lots of stuff.

And last but not least, i keep saying this, "nudging" people into walking around or public transport would not generate the same amount of discontent if it was not pushed by the very same people who also are perfectly ok with large sections of said cities having the sidewalks and public transport they expect people to use filled with crazy hobos, gangbangers, junkies and illegal immigrants. Oh, also no guns or decent self defense rights for you, fuck you. The most functional "walkable cities" in Asia at least have their leadership absolutely insistent on countering such problems harshly before they even develop, they have absolutely no patience for the kind of shit cities like San Francisco or Chicago have recently gotten infamous for.
If they weren't like this, the people there would also think moving around a city in a personal 2 ton metal can is preferable.
I can get to basically everything I need other than my job (which used to be in walking distance but I switched to a different one because I hated that job and now I have to drive 45 minutes to work) within a 15-20 minute walk of my apartment, and my rent is actually lower than it would be for an equivalent rental out in the suburbs.
 
And again, the WEF's vision of commoners not owning anything has nothing to do with the concept of a walkable city.
... yes it does.
1. they are the ones pushing it

2. the walkable cities model heavily rely on you not owning anything. you do not own a car, so you walk. you do not own a bicycle so you walk. you rent everything so you can live in a pod because you don't need to store your property. you certainly do not own any land of your own.
I can get to basically everything I need other than my job (which used to be in walking distance but I switched to a different one because I hated that job and now I have to drive 45 minutes to work) within a 15-20 minute walk of my apartment, and my rent is actually lower than it would be for an equivalent rental out in the suburbs.
You are talking about what you imagine a "15 minute walking city" is based on your own imagination.
Rather than the actual political thing being pushed.

This is like saying "I believe in science therefore I am a scientologist". And when people point out scientology is a cult that exists, you call them conspiracy theorists and say that there is no such thing as a church of scientology.
 
When did I mention forcing everyone else into it? It's other people freaking about because somebody mentioned building one.

This topic is not all about you.

And again, none of what you mentioned has anything to do with the concept of walkable cities.

I'm getting a "la-la-la can't hear you, I'm fine with living in a huge city so I refuse to understand why other people aren't" vibe from you.
 
I honestly couldn't live in a huge 'walkable city'. I think I'd be driven mad pretty quickly.
I need open spaces, trees, beaches.
Even discounting the logical conclusion of what sorts of people would be living in such a city (protip, my local big city is full of homeless insane people), using nothing but public services makes you feel like a cog in the machine, not an operator of said machine.
 
I honestly couldn't live in a huge 'walkable city'. I think I'd be driven mad pretty quickly.
I need open spaces, trees, beaches.
Even discounting the logical conclusion of what sorts of people would be living in such a city (protip, my local big city is full of homeless insane people), using nothing but public services makes you feel like a cog in the machine, not an operator of said machine.
I lived and worked and went to college in a city for a bit.

At first i liked it, but i grew to Absolutely hate it. The city life is not for me.

I need peace, quiet, and space. I liked it at first because it was easy access to parties and entertainment, and i was young and wanted to go clubbing/bar hopping and socialize with my fellow college students (was a college city. Big party/entertsinment scene) But it quickly became exhausting.

I can't stand being around that many people. I'm on edge 24/7 and can't ever fully relax. It takes its toll on you over time.
 
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I need peace, quiet, and space. I liked it at first because it was easy access to parties and entertainment, and i was young and wanted to go clubbing/bar hopping and socialize with my fellow college students (was a college city. Big party/entertsinment scene) But it quickly became exhausting.

I can't stand being around that many people. I'm on edge 24/7 and can't ever fully relax. It takes its toll on you over time.

Same feeling here. I need space. Clean fresh air. And most importantly, peace and quiet.

The type of environment that the "15 minute city" people seek to impose on humanity is incompatible with that.
And note well - they themselves do not want to live like that either!
 
It seems that if you want a 15-minute city, the way to do it is to build the entire town in one building and minimize travel properly.

The Boeing Everett facility is 8 stories tall and just under 100 acres, it's a single building that's actually about as large as Disneyland for comparison, though it's hollow inside so it should be easier to make one that has floors and internal structural supports, and that factory was built using 60s technology. I suspect we could actually make it twice as high and also add several layers of basement but let's assume it's still only possible to go up 8 stories.

Making a similar structure but with floors would give us 34,394,976 square feet to work with. Let's presume one-quarter of that space is taken up by elevators, hallways, moving sidewalks, ducts, and some rooms that are two floors high for dramatic effect. 25,796,232 square feet left. Assume two-thirds of that is living quarters. We have 17,197,488 square feet of homes. Minimum apartment sizes for one person tend to be about 400 square feet (Japan goes smaller but that's Japan). A thousand square feet is generally considered extremely generous per person so let's go with that. About seventeen thousand people live in our mega-building. We can probably more reasonably round up to 20,000, with wealthier inhabitants taking the windowed wall apartments, the corners being the highest-prestige, and smaller low-budget apartments being deeper inside the complex where there are no windows or balconies.

Because it's all one building, it can be made more efficient, f'rex only soundproofing is really needed in between rooms and thermal insulation only needs to be on the outside walls, so we could go for broke with outer walls having five-foot thick insulation reducing heating to nil (we do have the body heat of 20,000 people) and making certain the summer heat won't be able to infiltrate and raise cooling bills in summer. Similarly, individual colossal heavily insulated air conditioners and heating systems for both and air and water will be more efficient than thousands of tiny ones.

The remaining quarter of the space gets devoted to commercial support. Shopping centers, research labs, theatres, restaurants, gyms, spas, bars, offices, etc. This is actually really excessive compared to the acreage most cities devote to this, and none of these structures would require parking lots, but we could have some light industry and manufacturing in there. Heavy industry is probably going to generate too much noise/heat/pollution. The roof of the building, being the size of Disneyland already, gets converted into an open-air amusement park or botanical garden. In some areas like New Mexico, it might be better to cover it with solar panels. This provides quite a few jobs already

For a distance of thirty-minutes in all directions, surround the building with outdoor attractions. Hiking trails, lakes for fishing and boating, biking trails, gardens, playgrounds, stadiums, tennis courts, waterparks, maybe even a NASCAR track going all the way around so that people on the roof and outer balconies can watch.

Past that zone is farmland, with roads and rail connecting multiple megacomplexes together, and a set of power plants sufficient to take care of both the farmland and the megacomplex. Farmers and ruralites live on their own land, only urbanites live in the megastructure. Spots with inferior land for farming instead contain factories, manufacturing complexes, mines, and other heavy industry providing blue-collar jobs.

Bam, five-minute cities that make fifteen-minute cities look wasteful. Minimal land used, generous amounts of space for all inhabitants, access to nature and entertainment of all kinds, and the building concept can be refined into a self-contained colony for hitting up Mars in the future.
 
It seems that if you want a 15-minute city, the way to do it is to build the entire town in one building and minimize travel properly.

The Boeing Everett facility is 8 stories tall and just under 100 acres, it's a single building that's actually about as large as Disneyland for comparison, though it's hollow inside so it should be easier to make one that has floors and internal structural supports, and that factory was built using 60s technology. I suspect we could actually make it twice as high and also add several layers of basement but let's assume it's still only possible to go up 8 stories.

Making a similar structure but with floors would give us 34,394,976 square feet to work with. Let's presume one-quarter of that space is taken up by elevators, hallways, moving sidewalks, ducts, and some rooms that are two floors high for dramatic effect. 25,796,232 square feet left. Assume two-thirds of that is living quarters. We have 17,197,488 square feet of homes. Minimum apartment sizes for one person tend to be about 400 square feet (Japan goes smaller but that's Japan). A thousand square feet is generally considered extremely generous per person so let's go with that. About seventeen thousand people live in our mega-building. We can probably more reasonably round up to 20,000, with wealthier inhabitants taking the windowed wall apartments, the corners being the highest-prestige, and smaller low-budget apartments being deeper inside the complex where there are no windows or balconies.

Because it's all one building, it can be made more efficient, f'rex only soundproofing is really needed in between rooms and thermal insulation only needs to be on the outside walls, so we could go for broke with outer walls having five-foot thick insulation reducing heating to nil (we do have the body heat of 20,000 people) and making certain the summer heat won't be able to infiltrate and raise cooling bills in summer. Similarly, individual colossal heavily insulated air conditioners and heating systems for both and air and water will be more efficient than thousands of tiny ones.

The remaining quarter of the space gets devoted to commercial support. Shopping centers, research labs, theatres, restaurants, gyms, spas, bars, offices, etc. This is actually really excessive compared to the acreage most cities devote to this, and none of these structures would require parking lots, but we could have some light industry and manufacturing in there. Heavy industry is probably going to generate too much noise/heat/pollution. The roof of the building, being the size of Disneyland already, gets converted into an open-air amusement park or botanical garden. In some areas like New Mexico, it might be better to cover it with solar panels. This provides quite a few jobs already

For a distance of thirty-minutes in all directions, surround the building with outdoor attractions. Hiking trails, lakes for fishing and boating, biking trails, gardens, playgrounds, stadiums, tennis courts, waterparks, maybe even a NASCAR track going all the way around so that people on the roof and outer balconies can watch.

Past that zone is farmland, with roads and rail connecting multiple megacomplexes together, and a set of power plants sufficient to take care of both the farmland and the megacomplex. Farmers and ruralites live on their own land, only urbanites live in the megastructure. Spots with inferior land for farming instead contain factories, manufacturing complexes, mines, and other heavy industry providing blue-collar jobs.

Bam, five-minute cities that make fifteen-minute cities look wasteful. Minimal land used, generous amounts of space for all inhabitants, access to nature and entertainment of all kinds, and the building concept can be refined into a self-contained colony for hitting up Mars in the future.
. . . You're describing an Archology, more or less.
 
. . . You're describing an Archology, more or less.
Pretty much, though most archology projects somehow have the idiotic idea that the archology should also have food production inside itself which is just stupid. Oh, maybe an aquaponic for lettuce and fish, and rabbits produce an unreal amount of protein per square foot so you could have a bit of production there, but trying to grow grain, lumber, and fruit trees inside an archology is moronic. As is, I think the fifteen-minute city concept is an idiotic half-assing that doesn't give people access to nature but does waste too much space to be efficient about land use.
 

This is a '15 minute' city already in existence, and yeah, unless people really like LARPing as living in the bowels of Courscant, it's not for most humans.
 

This is a '15 minute' city already in existence, and yeah, unless people really like LARPing as living in the bowels of Courscant, it's not for most humans.
Ugh, it makes me uneasy just looking at it.

This project, which has started, is pretty atrocious as well

 

This is a '15 minute' city already in existence, and yeah, unless people really like LARPing as living in the bowels of Courscant, it's not for most humans.
Huh? Most Whittier residents love it. Cost of living is only about 82% of the national average even though Alaska itself averages 116%, and it has ample access to nature and a big city without the headaches of urban sprawl. Whittier is a good example of why I'm in favor of archologies rather than 15-minute cities. The big kicker is housing in Whittier, which due to everybody being in one building is only about 27% of the national average.
 

This is a '15 minute' city already in existence, and yeah, unless people really like LARPing as living in the bowels of Courscant, it's not for most humans.
This sort of stuff may be the least bad option for some extreme environments like Mars, undersea or even far north. But i don't see a reason why would people pick this when cheaper and more comfortable options exist (which greens and shitty city real estate lobby hate existing).
 
Huh? Most Whittier residents love it. Cost of living is only about 82% of the national average even though Alaska itself averages 116%, and it has ample access to nature and a big city without the headaches of urban sprawl. Whittier is a good example of why I'm in favor of archologies rather than 15-minute cities. The big kicker is housing in Whittier, which due to everybody being in one building is only about 27% of the national average.
...have you ever been through Whittier?

It takes a very, very special sort of person to willingly live in that sort of situation.

The town only exists because it was a place the the US military in WW2 thought the Japanese would never be able to reach with recon planes and remains ice-free year round to supply the interior of Alaska if Seward's dock were taken out of action.

As well, it's 'access to nature' is mostly just the semi-temperate rainforests/semi-taiga landscapes of the Kenai peninsula and Prince William Sound, and even that mostly requires a trip through the only one-lane road/railroad tunnel that is on a fixed schedule.

As I said, takes a very particular sort to live in that sort of situation long term.
 

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