Armchair General's DonbAss Derailed Discussion Thread (Topics Include History, Traps, and the Ongoing Slavic Civil War plus much much more)

[Marduk]

Ree some more.

Polish broken record screeching intensifies, noises are louder and aimed differently, but nothing substantially new is heard.

No one asked you for a stupid quip.
Reposting shills like you do doesn't count as new nor useful. Seethe more.

 

[D4rk0w1]

"Muh nazis" do not matter outside of the propaganda layer.
What really matters is the location of Mariupol on the map. Kiev was supposed to be the crown of ambitious maximum plan. Grab it by shock and total surprise, install puppet government, rubberstamp everything Russia wants. Didn't work, sucks but there are still less ambitious plans to fulfill to claim victory and get something out of the mess. Like a land corridor from Russia's mainland to Crimea, that's something nice to landgrab. And Mariupol is in the way.

Makes sense, looking at the map there seems to be also a major railway connection in Mariupol so if the Russian manage to pacify the port area, they can possibly ease their supply situation. I thought they would focus more in Kherson and Mykolayiv since it would increase the security of Crimea.

 

[Agent23]

No one asked you for a stupid quip.
Reposting shills like you do doesn't count as new nor useful. Seethe more.

You are the one that pushes Ukie and US talking head propaganda, not me.
I listen to people who actually know their stuff, like Ritter and MacGregor, not random rabid poles with chips on their shoulders on da interwebz.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

You are the one that pushes Ukie and US talking head propaganda, not me.

Says the person pushing Russian propaganda.

 

[Marduk]

You are the one that pushes Ukie and US talking head propaganda, not me.
I listen to people who actually know their stuff, like Ritter and MacGregor, not random rabid poles with chips on their shoulders on da interwebz.

At least i write my opinions myself instead of reposting shills like you do lazily, leaving no doubt about whose opinions these are.

 

[Agent23]

NOTE: I am splitting serious comments from shitposting, since there is no need for both to go to DonBass.

Makes sense, looking at the map there seems to be also a major railway connection in Mariupol so if the Russian manage to pacify the port area, they can possibly ease their supply situation. I thought they would focus more in Kherson and Mykolayiv since it would increase the security of Crimea.

It is part of the landbridge to Crimea, it basically helps Russia link up its mainland and the Donbass republics with it.
Also, as I said, the place is the home of the biggest ukronazi stronghold, so it is an important symbolic victory.

 

[Agent23]

Your opinion is a mix of whataboutism and cope, and can be sum up as Russia bad, Russia evil, war against Russia at all costs good.Everyone who disagrees with me is a commie/Russian bot.This is basically repeated over and over, with you occasionally trying to throw in a few tidbits of western MSM garbage to rationalize and justify your crap.
You are a joke.

Says the person pushing Russian propaganda.

What should I be pushing, the NY times, the Washington Compost, the blatantly obvious astroturfed crap on twitter and the shit that comes out of Zelenski's mouth and the Ukrainian propaganda organizations?

 

[Agent23]

Do you at least acknowledge that you've had to repeatedly and dramatically adjust your position? I mean, half of what you say contradicts itself! "Russia are strenuously avoiding civilian casualties and infrastructure... HAHA, LOOK AT ALL THE UKIE SCUM DEAD IN THE RUINS OF MARIUPOL!"

If you had paid any attention you would have noticed that your beloved Ukronazis are using people as human shields, and that they are obstructing humanitarian evacuations, not the Russians.

Also, the Chechens are clearing out Mariupol mostly building by building, not simply calling in artillery and air strikes.
Sure, I posted all of that stuff long ago, but obviously you can't be bothered to read it.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

What should I be pushing, the NY times, the Washington Compost, the blatantly obvious astroturfed crap that comes out of Zelenski's mouth and the Ukrainian propaganda organizations?

These people predicted the invasion would happen.

You didn't.

Therefore, they are more reliable and accurate than whatever sources you have.

 

[Agent23]

These people predicted the invasion would happen.

You didn't.

Therefore, they are more reliable and accurate than whatever sources you have.

I had no "sources" aide from thinking that the Clawn of Kiev wasn't insane or more afraid of his nazi string pullers than of the Russians.
Also, the morons have been predicting this since 2014, and their Deep state paymasters have been antagonizing Russia even longer.
The invasion could have been avoided if the Minsk process was adhered to.

 

[Marduk]

Your opinion is a mix of whataboutism and cope, and can be sum up as Russia bad, Russia evil, war against Russia at all costs good.Everyone who disagrees with me is a commie/Russian bot.This is basically repeated over and over, with you occasionally trying to throw in a few tidbits of western MSM garbage to rationalize and justify your crap.
You are a joke.

The guy who is religiously reposting Intel Slava Z like if it was a serious source and parrots all sorts of silly conspiracy theories from social media about nazis controlling everything calls me a joke.
Do you even have any self-awareness?

 

[Chiron]

"Muh nazis" do not matter outside of the propaganda layer.
What really matters is the location of Mariupol on the map. Kiev was supposed to be the crown of ambitious maximum plan. Grab it by shock and total surprise, install puppet government, rubberstamp everything Russia wants. Didn't work, sucks but there are still less ambitious plans to fulfill to claim victory and get something out of the mess. Like a land corridor from Russia's mainland to Crimea, that's something nice to landgrab. And Mariupol is in the way.

If Russia had actually wanted Kyiv, it would have had set up collaborators and weighed all its offensive power to it. They did not, the units there were not reinforced, they made no actual attempts to close pockets, or even get the few who collaborated out, leaving them at the mercy of Azov. Their job was to draw all the UkA Reserves north, destroy the Main Depots, and Repair Shops of UkA, and do so long enough for Izium to be breached. They accomplished that, successfully broke contact, and redeployed south. UkA was unable to pursue and its famed KORD units largely dropped off the scene after the 2nd Week where as in the first week they were constantly posting social media bits. That's because they got annihilated and were unable to report the withdrawal or harass it. It took Azov 4 days from Russia abandoning Bucha to them reaching it, because the transport networks and logistical support is shot.

Compare to the south where Collaborators were placed in governing control, civil administration is being coopted and they are trying to set up a civil police force to enforce civil laws. These units also have victory banners with them unlike in the North around Kyiv.

This should have clued everyone in from the start what the real plan was. Russia never expected Kyiv to fall, and would have been surprised if it had. They likely never expected Kherson to fall either, but ran with it as it made the Odessa Feint last far longer than they had hoped it would. But its main thrust was for the Sea of Azov and Mariupol which is in the bag and opens the way for the Donbass battle to begin. Victory here, pushes Ukraine into an economic and demographic death spiral they won't recover from.

 

[Agent23]

The guy who is religiously reposting Intel Slava Z like if it was a serious source and parrots all sorts of silly conspiracy theories from social media about nazis controlling everything calls me a joke.
Do you even have any self-awareness?

There you go, reeing again.
Right Sector and their buddies have been an integral part of the post-Coup power structure in Ukraine, that is a fact.
I will read whatever news and Telegram channels I want and I will post them, but you keep gulping out the Western lugenpresse's watery diarrhea.

 

[Agent23]

If Russia had actually wanted Kyiv, it would have had set up collaborators and weighed all its offensive power to it. They did not, the units there were not reinforced, they made no actual attempts to close pockets, or even get the few who collaborated out, leaving them at the mercy of Azov. Their job was to draw all the UkA Reserves north, destroy the Main Depots, and Repair Shops of UkA, and do so long enough for Izium to be breached. They accomplished that, successfully broke contact, and redeployed south. UkA was unable to pursue and its famed KORD units largely dropped off the scene after the 2nd Week where as in the first week they were constantly posting social media bits. That's because they got annihilated and were unable to report the withdrawal or harass it. It took Azov 4 days from Russia abandoning Bucha to them reaching it, because the transport networks and logistical support is shot.

Compare to the south where Collaborators were placed in governing control, civil administration is being coopted and they are trying to set up a civil police force to enforce civil laws. These units also have victory banners with them unlike in the North around Kyiv.

This should have clued everyone in from the start what the real plan was. Russia never expected Kyiv to fall, and would have been surprised if it had. They likely never expected Kherson to fall either, but ran with it as it made the Odessa Feint last far longer than they had hoped it would. But its main thrust was for the Sea of Azov and Mariupol which is in the bag and opens the way for the Donbass battle to begin. Victory here, pushes Ukraine into an economic and demographic death spiral they won't recover from.

Exactly, and the Russians were rather good at making Kiev into a diversion with all those "40 km long vehicle columns" the west was on about.
The problem is that everyone accustomed to the US way of Shock and Awe war, myself included, has forgotten the ideas of Clausewitz, particularly that war is a continuation of politics.
Well, Russia's political objectives are recognition for the Donbass and Crimea, demilitarization and removal of nazi anti-Russia elements and keeping Ukraine as a neutral buffer.
The unstated objective is probably a landbridge to Crimea and perhaps taking Southern Ukraine with Odessa since that is a very important city for Russian historic reasons, it also cuts off Rump Ukraine from the sea.
If the Zelenski regime keeps foot-dragging they will probably lose more of the east, too, now that the long-term fighting ability of the Ukrainians is destroyed and their best front-line units in the East are about to get annihilated.

 

[D4rk0w1]

It is part of the landbridge to Crimea, it basically helps Russia link up its mainland and the Donbass republics with it.
Also, as I said, the place is the home of the biggest ukronazi stronghold, so it is an important symbolic victory.

Yeah, there is a lot of political victory if the manage to mop up Azov battalion. I believe they would push towards Dnipropetrovska towards Dnieper river after this or reinforce the Kharkiv offensive.

Rob Lee commenting on the Russian Manpower crunch in Ukraine. It's a multiple post thread. 75% of its permanently ready BTG's have already been deployed to Ukraine.


Also Binkov did a video on the same potential manpower shortages.

There was a reason I was skeptical about the possibility of a Russian invasion in earlier SB threads because I actually believe 200, 000 troops in not enough to invade Ukraine since they have at least 500,000 troops. Russian need a least 3 times the number of troops to actually invade a country like Ukraine so I was so fucking surprised when they actually invaded with only 200k troops.

They likely never expected Kherson to fall either, but ran with it as it made the Odessa Feint last far longer than they had hoped it would.

What actually happened in Kherson? There are to many conflicting information about it.

 

[Marduk]

There you go, reeing again.
Right Sector and their buddies have been an integral part of the post-Coup power structure in Ukraine, that is a fact.

So? They aren't any more nazi than the likes of Dugin fanclub and company, who are very much accepted in Russia. Probably less at that point.

I will read whatever news and Telegram channels I want and I will post them, but you keep gulping out the Western lugenpresse's watery diarrhea.

I told you to keep your sexual fetishes out of this part of the forum.

If Russia had actually wanted Kyiv, it would have had set up collaborators and weighed all its offensive power to it.

But then there would be no landgrab to rubberstamp...
Also they did the collaborator scheme, but as traditional for Russian officials the money got disappeared in mysterious circumstances.

That's one of reasons why some highest ranking FSB officers are under house arrest now.

Trouble in Paradise: Putin Arrests Senior FSB Officers Over Ukraine Fiasco

redstate.com

They did not, the units there were not reinforced, they made no actual attempts to close pockets, or even get the few who collaborated out, leaving them at the mercy of Azov. Their job was to draw all the UkA Reserves north, destroy the Main Depots, and Repair Shops of UkA, and do so long enough for Izium to be breached. They accomplished that, successfully broke contact, and redeployed south. UkA was unable to pursue and its famed KORD units largely dropped off the scene after the 2nd Week where as in the first week they were constantly posting social media bits. That's because they got annihilated and were unable to report the withdrawal or harass it. It took Azov 4 days from Russia abandoning Bucha to them reaching it, because the transport networks and logistical support is shot.

Inb4 "everyone in UAF who does anything ever except surrendering is Azov" crazy ass propaganda pieces.

Compare to the south where Collaborators were placed in governing control, civil administration is being coopted and they are trying to set up a civil police force to enforce civil laws. These units also have victory banners with them unlike in the North around Kyiv.

Trying doesn't get a medal. They tried in the north too.

This should have clued everyone in from the start what the real plan was. Russia never expected Kyiv to fall,

And they bumrushed the very valuable, rare quality troops like various spetsnaz and VDV to get decimated there as a distraction, yeah, sure.

They likely never expected Kherson to fall either, but ran with it as it made the Odessa Feint last far longer than they had hoped it would.

Dream on, Odessa feint? The forces meant for Odessa got redirected to Mariupol a long time ago. Not because it was a feint, but because of a downshift to less ambitious plan variant. Probably not the last one.

But its main thrust was for the Sea of Azov and Mariupol which is in the bag and opens the way for the Donbass battle to begin. Victory here, pushes Ukraine into an economic and demographic death spiral they won't recover from.

And then the frog turns into a prince...

 

[Agent23]

There was a reason I was skeptical about the possibility of a Russian invasion in earlier SB threads because I actually believe 200, 000 troops in not enough to invade Ukraine since they have at least 500,000 troops. Russian need a least 3 times the number of troops to actually invade a country like Ukraine so I was so fucking surprised when they actually invaded with only 200k troops.

TBH I didn't know or care about things like the size of Kiev or the current Ukrainian population before this war started.
Much smaller and poorer than Russia, was the gist of my knowledge.
Turns out they were somewhat better prepared where numbers and tech were concerned, but that still doesn't stop the Russians, just slows them down.

Hey,I wanted to post that, no fair.
Got sidetracked by loud reeing, though.

 

[Chiron]

But then there would be no landgrab to rubberstamp...

You think they care one iota about what Kyiv says? They don't, they will simply have a "referendum," set up a new security force of collaborators and flip off the rest of the world which will forget about it in time.

Also they did the collaborator scheme, but as traditional for Russian officials the money got disappeared in mysterious circumstances.

Not in the north though, the Russians didn't set up collaborators to run things.

Trying doesn't get a medal. They tried in the north too.

The north never received the support the South got as they were never intended to hold. Russia has completely different objectives and a different way of doing things. Your opinions are irrelevant to them, how many wars have you won?

None.

Russia's Generals have won in Chechnya, Georgia, Crimea, and Syria and a number of other policing actions. They know what they are doing and are executing their plan.

And they bumrushed the very valuable, rare quality troops like various spetsnaz and VDV to get decimated there as a distraction, yeah, sure.

The bulk of the VDV is in the south. And yes Russia would use the VDV for this purpose as a matter of historical and doctrinal reasons. Even then, the bulk of the VDV deployed for Kyiv Operations made it out and are now on the Kharkiv Front. They did the historical job they were meant for in accordance with doctrine born of WW2.

Dream on, Odessa feint? The forces meant for Odessa got redirected to Mariupol a long time ago. Not because it was a feint, but because of a downshift to less ambitious plan variant. Probably not the last one.

Yes, they never intended to land at Odessa, its mere threat served to tie down valuable UkA reserves and waste resources there. Kherson's fall made it more believable. Once the UkA realized it had been had, the Odessa Feint Forces unloaded and redeployed.

US Marines did the same in the First Gulf War.

 

[Megadeath]

If you had paid any attention you would have noticed that your beloved Ukronazis are using people as human shields, and that they are obstructing humanitarian evacuations, not the Russians.

Also, the Chechens are clearing out Mariupol mostly building by building, not simply calling in artillery and air strikes.
Sure, I posted all of that stuff long ago, but obviously you can't be bothered to read it.

Uh huh. It's the red cross and other international humanitarian groups plus the entirety of the press and every other nation on earth lying. Definitely not the Russians. If mad vlad says the Ukrainians are the reason red cross can't get in, who cares what they say themselves?

As to carefully clearing house by house in Mariupol, try harder. Have you not seen any pictures? Here I'll even save you the effort:

mariupol now - Google Search

www.google.com

Does that look like a city that's being carefully and systematically cleared?

 

[Agent23]

Uh huh. It's the red cross and other international humanitarian groups plus the entirety of the press and every other nation on earth lying. Definitely not the Russians. If mad vlad says the Ukrainians are the reason red cross can't get in, who cares what they say themselves?

As to carefully clearing house by house in Mariupol, try harder. Have you not seen any pictures? Here I'll even save you the effort:

mariupol now - Google Search

www.google.com

Does that look like a city that's being carefully and systematically cleared?

I have seen, and posted, enough pictures of Mariupol getting cleared building by building, the problem is that the nazis are like cockroaches, hard to stomp out.