United States Another Suicidal Democrat Maneuver: Relief Bill Blocked

Bacle · Mar 25, 2020

prinCZess said:
Not passed yet (in fact, doesn't seem to even be a finalized bill available for the public to see), but there's apparently been ultra late-night/early-morning agreements reached by all the folks in Washington over how it should look--and it seems to be built around the previously-bipartisan, then-Republican, now-bipartisan-again plan of 'Trump bucks' and business loans rather than the Pelosi-plan.

Caution warranted and called for, and I too wait to see what wonders of pork-barrel or rights-restricting prickery congressmen snuck-in because the bill was guaranteed passage. But at the moment, can't say much on details.

Floridaman said:
given how even Twitter was attacking Pelosi over this until those hashtags were shut down, I think they figured they had no choice, and couldn’t blame it failing on Trump. But yeah, 20 bucks says whatever stupid riders are attached will be terrible for the country as a whole.

Oh FFS, can you all wait and see what is in it before spouting off a lot of negativity about it.

Seriously, we have more than enough negativity in this world and in this thread right now.

Bitching about what riders "might" be in said bill, before it is even finalized, is unhelpful and unneeded.

Terthna · Mar 25, 2020

Bacle said:
Oh FFS, can you all wait and see what is in it before spouting off a lot of negativity about it.

Seriously, we have more than enough negativity in this world and in this thread right now.

Bitching about what riders "might" be in said bill, before it is even finalized, is unhelpful and unneeded.

If we're lucky, the Dems had a random fit of sanity and decided to back down after realizing how trying to used this crisis to push their agenda would damage their reputation for years to come, if not permanently.

Airedale260 · Mar 25, 2020

Terthna said:
If we're lucky, the Dems had a random fit of sanity and decided to back down after realizing how trying to used this crisis to push their agenda would damage their reputation for years to come, if not permanently.

It seems like the big change was increased oversight on the bailout fund, i.e. more than usual and upping the grant threshold to $75,000 from $60,000 according to National Review. So it's a bit irritating (even though I personally benefit now), but overall it seems like they killed the stupid stuff. Or at least severely neutered it.

Floridaman · Mar 25, 2020

Welp that happened, Pelosi decided to shoot herself in the foot..... again.

Doomsought · Mar 25, 2020

how quickly can Pelosi be impeached?

Airedale260 · Mar 25, 2020

Doomsought said:
how quickly can Pelosi be impeached?

That would require a 2/3 majority of the House, I believe, and that isn’t going to happen.

This is breathtakingly idiotic, even for her.

Edit: Although our distant cousins are claiming that she is a political mastermind by getting what she wanted, despite the fact that this hasn't even passed.

Lord Sovereign · Mar 25, 2020

Are...are the Democrats mad? This is all essentially a political death wish for them. Even the Labour Party in the UK would never be this stupid.

Tzeentchean Perspective · Mar 25, 2020

Looks like the Chain Reaction has already begun: Last-minute complaints threaten $2T Senate coronavirus emergency aid

Terthna · Mar 25, 2020

Airedale260 said:
That would require a 2/3 majority of the House, I believe, and that isn’t going to happen.

This is breathtakingly idiotic, even for her.

Edit: Although our distant cousins are claiming that she is a political mastermind by getting what she wanted, despite the fact that this hasn't even passed.

Just goes to show where their priorities are; all they care about is "winning".

Lord Sovereign said:
Are...are the Democrats mad? This is all essentially a political death wish for them. Even the Labour Party in the UK would never be this stupid.

They seem to believe that if they continue to sabotage any attempt to help the American people during this crisis, they can get everything they want, while shifting the blame entirely onto Trump and the Republicans. Again; all these people care about, is "winning".

Lord Sovereign · Mar 26, 2020

Terthna said:
They seem to believe that if they continue to sabotage any attempt to help the American people during this crisis, they can get everything they want, while shifting the blame entirely onto Trump and the Republicans. Again; all these people care about, is "winning".

...they are aware that no one is blaming Trump for any of this? And at the very best all they are doing is galvanizing Republican voters whilst totally alienating the Independents? There's no strategists left in the Democrats.

Terthna · Mar 26, 2020

Well they're blaming Trump, and everyone agrees with them; right? Or at least, everyone else inside their echo chamber does; and nothing exists outside of the echo chamber. Seriously, the Dems lost touch with reality years ago, and they seem to just be getting worse over time; their plans are not just madness and insanity, but they in fact transcend them and become the shape of a lawnmower.

Lord Sovereign · Mar 26, 2020

Terthna said:
Well they're blaming Trump, and everyone agrees with them; right? Or at least, everyone else inside their echo chamber does; and nothing exists outside of the echo chamber. Seriously, the Dems lost touch with reality years ago, and they seem to just be getting worse over time; their plans are not just madness and insanity, but they in fact transcend them and become the shape of a lawnmower.

With the internet at your finger tips it should be impossible to get stuck in an echo chamber, but mankind will always find a way I suppose. Regardless, if they keep this up they'll get one of the worst electoral results in their history come November. And I'm talking "Labour's worst defeat since 1935" levels of results.

DarthOne · Mar 26, 2020

Lord Sovereign said:
With the internet at your finger tips it should be impossible to get stuck in an echo chamber, but mankind will always find a way I suppose. Regardless, if they keep this up they'll get one of the worst electoral results in their history come November. And I'm talking "Labour's worst defeat since 1935" levels of results.

We can be amazingly stupid like that as a species...

Lanmandragon · Mar 26, 2020

Terthna said:
Just goes to show where their priorities are; all they care about is "winning".

They seem to believe that if they continue to sabotage any attempt to help the American people during this crisis, they can get everything they want, while shifting the blame entirely onto Trump and the Republicans. Again; all these people care about, is "winning".

Well to he fair 10 years ago they tottally could've and did whenever they wanted. I think alot of them still don't realize fully that's not the case anymore. Hell alot of the Russia stuff was likely because of that very thing. "How could we possibly lose we control all the information people see". Something like that being tue thought process maybe. Then again they could just arrogantly believe they're untouchable.

Cherico · Mar 26, 2020

Terthna said:
Well they're blaming Trump, and everyone agrees with them; right? Or at least, everyone else inside their echo chamber does; and nothing exists outside of the echo chamber. Seriously, the Dems lost touch with reality years ago, and they seem to just be getting worse over time; their plans are not just madness and insanity, but they in fact transcend them and become the shape of a lawnmower.

Son Tzu said that if you know your self and not your enemy you will win and lose, if you know your self and your enemy you will win every battle if you don't understand yourself or your enemy your essentially doomed to be defeated.

The democratic party has willfully blinded itself that will have conquences.

Floridaman · Mar 27, 2020

Update: the bill was just passed, now the question is what will the bill do to help, and what consequences will there be to the economy in the long run.

Colorado’s Ken Buck among few to oppose newly signed $2 trillion stimulus

With the support of all but one Coloradan, the U.S. House passed the largest economic stimulus package in American history Friday, a more than $2 trillion agreement to boost a national economy rava…

www.denverpost.com

Bacle · Mar 27, 2020

Floridaman said:
Update: the bill was just passed, now the question is what will the bill do to help, and what consequences will there be to the economy in the long run.

Colorado’s Ken Buck among few to oppose newly signed $2 trillion stimulus

With the support of all but one Coloradan, the U.S. House passed the largest economic stimulus package in American history Friday, a more than $2 trillion agreement to boost a national economy rava…

www.denverpost.com

I doubt Ken Buck is likely to last after this.

As much as the Dems screwed around too much here, the GOP also has a few members it would now be better off without.

Floridaman · Mar 27, 2020

Bacle said:
I doubt Ken Buck is likely to last after this.

As much as the Dems screwed around too much here, the GOP also has a few members it would now be better off without.

To be honest I only picked that article because the WSJ one I read is paywalled, so I don’t really know Ken Buck.

The Immortal Watch Dog · Mar 27, 2020

Floridaman said:
Update: the bill was just passed, now the question is what will the bill do to help, and what consequences will there be to the economy in the long run.

Colorado’s Ken Buck among few to oppose newly signed $2 trillion stimulus

With the support of all but one Coloradan, the U.S. House passed the largest economic stimulus package in American history Friday, a more than $2 trillion agreement to boost a national economy rava…

www.denverpost.com

What economy in the long run? The precedent this set is going to do far more damage than the virus ever could and as much as they're sandbagging the guy for his haggling over procedure. He's absolutely right, the Republic has just been knifed in the kidney in the name of saving lives.

We've set a deadly precedent...One that we're either going to have to amend the constitution to prevent from being enacted again, or accept the fact that we just became the EU.

Deleted member · Mar 27, 2020

The Immortal Watch Dog said:
What economy in the long run? The precedent this set is going to do far more damage than the virus ever could and as much as they're sandbagging the guy for his haggling over procedure. He's absolutely right, the Republic has just been knifed in the kidney in the name of saving lives.

We've set a deadly precedent...One that we're either going to have to amend the constitution to prevent from being enacted again, or accept the fact that we just became the EU.

We are taking extraordinary measures in a State of Exception to control the tide of plague and disease in the country. That is one of the core very definitions of the function of a government in classical terms, and is a fundamental conservative function of Government. It has guns and arms and police powers to protect the body politic (the nation as a total whole) from threats foreign and domestic--crime, invasion, plague. Even a Minarchist should support the Declaration of a State of Siege in these circumstances. It's liberalism that hems and haws about civil rights in times of war and plague and famine. It's conservative strictness and adherence to the old maxim of "In times of War, the Law falls silent" which saves lives. That is why we have the concept of a State of Exception in the first place.

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