Russia(gate/bot) Russia-Ukraine War Political Discussion

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mrttao

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And when enormous communist nations are backing their rivals?
1. The only communist nations right now are the western nations.
USA, EU, Canadia, etc
China and russia are imperialist capitalists slave states.

2. Let them fight each other.

3. Pretty ironic considering your own plan is to sacrifice all the young reproductive age/fighting age conservatives left in EU / USA in foreign wars. This is exactly how we got to the point where EU and USA are communist countries in the first place.

Currently the communists are slowly being beaten back on the basis of them not having as many children (if any), shifting the demographics. You want to sacrifice all those gains with another round of meatgrinder warfare that will kill of the young male conservatives and further cement communist control of usa and eu.
 

Marduk

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1. The only communist nations right now are the western nations.
USA, EU, Canadia, etc
China and russia are imperialist capitalists slave states.

2. Let them fight each other.
And then wonder why the oil from ME isn't flowing. Guess you have an idea how to make point 1 a self fulfilling prophecy.
3. Pretty ironic considering your own plan is to sacrifice all the young reproductive age/fighting age conservatives left in EU / USA in foreign wars. This is exactly how we got to the point where EU and USA are communist countries in the first place.
Lol? WTF? What kind of batshit insane dramatization of "proxy war support" is this?
Currently the communists are slowly being beaten back on the basis of them not having as many children (if any), shifting the demographics.
That's a background trend at best, and would take hundreds of years alone.
You want to sacrifice all those gains with another round of meatgrinder warfare that will kill of the young male conservatives and further cement communist control of usa and eu.
So you're just delusional then, because you think western countries not only will fight these wars with own armies, but will fight them like WW2 Soviet Union at that.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
3. Pretty ironic considering your own plan is to sacrifice all the young reproductive age/fighting age conservatives left in EU / USA in foreign wars. This is exactly how we got to the point where EU and USA are communist countries in the first place.

To chime in with Marduk here, not only are you putting words in my mouth, you are completely out of touch with reality.

First off, there is no current plan to send US forces in to fight the war, and unless things go nuclear, I wouldn't support such plans anyways.


And if we did get involved for some insane reason?

Do you know how many people the USA lost fighting in the Vietnam war, which lasted twenty years?

About 58,000, less than a year's worth lost to traffic accidents.

Do you know how many people the USA lost fighting in Korea, which lasted 4 years?

Roughly 36,500, or about two thirds as many as in the Vietnam war.

Do you know what casualty rates were like in Iraq and Afghanistan while the US was trying to nation-build in the ME?

You were more likely to be shot in Chicago than as a US soldier in those countries.


The US has an unparalleled ability to fight wars while taking minimal casualties, because we place an immense value on human life over war material or the land being fought over. This is something that's baked into our culture, and neither side of the culture war is willing to accept large scale losses, so our army is built around avoiding them. There are some flat-out traitors on the left who think American soldiers dying is good, but they don't have any meaningful control over the military.


The idea that the US is in danger of having its younger generation depopulated by getting involved in a shooting war is completely absurd, and supposing such just shows how out of touch you are with reality.
 

mrttao

Well-known member
Lol? WTF? What kind of batshit insane dramatization of "proxy war support" is this?
He explicitly was not talking about russia-ukraine conflict alone.
Where Russia defeated itself with corruption and incompetence.

He explicitly wants to extend this conflict to china as well.
The odds of a china-taiwan conflict being a repeat of the 2022 russia-ukraine war are slim.
He also wants it extended to other global conflicts.

Close the borders, bring all troops in foreign nations home, end financial aid to foreign nations, sell american weapons to all sides to pay back national debt. Stop playing world police
 

mrttao

Well-known member
Okay, so this is not a trick question.

This is a very serious question.

What do you think the consequences of the US going isolationist would be? Both for the US, and for the world at large?
Europe will stop parasitizing the USA and learn to fight its own wars. This will necessitate them stopping the mass emasculation and castration of the european men. This will be particularly devastating to the woke cult of europe.

China will fight india and probably lose, Russia will try to reclaim surrounding territories and lose.

Ukraine and surrounding nations will form a union of the eastern european nations to fight russia. probably eventually conquering it. Forming the EEU. alternatively they will join the regular EU.

Isis and iran will either merge, fight until one absorbs the other, or stalemate as two competing caliphates. Will probably get nuked by israel

There will be a bunch of wars between india, china, EU or WEU/EEU, ISIS, caliphate or ISIS/Iran.

And none of it will be our problem.

Meanwhile the USA will finally recover its conservative demographic in peace without constantly killing them off. rebuild its economy. and start dealing with its critical existential threats it faces domestically.
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
Let them.
Those countries can fight their own wars.
Bye Saudi Arabia.
Bye South Korea. Which has a large amount of the tech base used by the West.
Good bye being independent from China.
you would basically be giving china the world on a platter and saying "Here, own us and take control over everything we once had, since we have given up on being the strongest and are becoming thw new Russsia"
@LordsFire
out of curiosity. are you a usa servicemen? and which foreign wars did you volunteer for? did you serve in iraq maybe? afghanistan?
I am, and I have been wanting to serve since I was I years old and interested in war.
I am considered a war monger among peers and yet we all agreed to go to war should the orders come from in high
Hell, almost every prior service member on here would say we need to step in should nukes be used, some say now.
Ask @Sailor.X , ask @Tiamat , ask @The Whispering Monk . I am sure I am missing more but all these I mentioned? Vets. Diffrent branches diffrent times.
Hell, Spartan is a vet.

As LordsFire pointed, the US goes to mitigate losses. Our goal is long range and as much ways to protect our soldiers. We owned the night to make our soldiers lives earlier.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
Yes.
Also good effects for europe too.

Then you're in a realm of pure fantasy.

Every decision has downsides as well as upsides, especially in international politics.

If you can't look at your proposed political shift, and see what the downsides would be, you're not being honest with yourself. Until you do that, you're never going to be capable of making constructive change, because you see only what you want, with none of the downsides or destructive unintended consequences.

Same problem the leftists have, really.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
He explicitly was not talking about russia-ukraine conflict alone.
Where Russia defeated itself with corruption and incompetence.

He explicitly wants to extend this conflict to china as well.
In that scenario it's also batshit insane.
If that one get to the stage where USA might lose demographically significant amounts of soldiers, that means USA has lost.
News at eleven, you can't make ships out of conscripts, and in case of modern ones, even crew or build them with conscripts, and you can't make the conscripts walk to Taiwan.
The odds of a china-taiwan conflict being a repeat of the 2022 russia-ukraine war are slim.
He also wants it extended to other global conflicts.
They are humongous compared to the chances of it turning into a WW2 Eastern Front scenario for US side like you're implying.
Close the borders, bring all troops in foreign nations home, end financial aid to foreign nations, sell american weapons to all sides to pay back national debt. Stop playing world police
Then OPEC decides to stop selling oil to you for some silly reason again while democrats fuck up domestic production, economy goes game over. 19th century called, it wants its isolationism back.
@LordsFire
out of curiosity. are you a usa servicemen? and which foreign wars did you volunteer for? did you serve in iraq maybe? afghanistan?
How much foreign oil products and electronics did you use?
How many of the electronic components you are using to write these posts were made in Taiwan or South Korea?
 
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mrttao

Well-known member
Then OPEC decides to stop selling oil to you for some silly reason again while democrats fuck up domestic production, economy goes game over. 19th century called, it wants its isolationism back.
USA has local oilfields, it just refuses to use them
biden actually shut down local oil production.
also, usa should move to all nuclear
The US tried isolationism back in the lead-up to WWII. How'd that work out? After all, Hitler taking over all those countries wasn't America's problem... :sneaky:
1. it wasn't america's problem
2. USA mass slaughtered its own citizens in WW2. via an illegal draft at that. And all that achieved is propping up stalin and mao.
3. isolationism my ass. first they mass slaughtered their own citizens by joining WW1. then they have been massively supporting UK and USSR for years prior to actually going to war
I am, and I have been wanting to serve since I was I years old and interested in war.
Just to clarify, you haven't actually participated in a war yet. but you want to?
 
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Marduk

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USA has local oilfields, it just refuses to use them
Quantity, location, quality, internal politics, global market...
To ignore all that and get away with it would require stable levels of competence from US government that are not anywhere near the recent experience.
Unless you expect isolationism to be magic and make US politicians so competent and patriotic just because you wish so.
 
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