"Woke" Franchises

Argent

Well-known member

"Comics are dead" article when?

It's both sad and funny watching these websites lambasting the very things that made them.


It's a CBR article. A junk site that does lists and calls anything from the before 2015 problematic that didn't age well.


Basically ignore any site that uses those words while mocking anyone that uses them. Back before I left SB pressing people that used those words led to pages of them never giving a straight answer about what was "problematic" just that we should have a conversation about it. It is a nonsense word used to shame people while virtue singling and nothing more.
 

Iconoclast

Perpetually Angry
Obozny
I'm not against woke fiction in principle. There are plenty of works out there that I would consider "woke" that I really like, because they're subtle and clever about it and being woke isn't the main point of the story, like Kill Six Billion Demons, for example.

What I don't like is when stories are deliberately written to be heavy-handed and preachy, prescribing certain morals to the audience. With a first-person narrator in a book, this isn't as much of a problem, because the narration literally contains the narrator's biases, so I can let it slide. But when a third-person omniscient narrator shows clear favor to some parties over others, that can get really irritating, really fast. This is what most people mean when they say "I don't want politics in my fiction". They don't actually mean that they don't want politics, because writing a story about people without politics is basically impossible. What they mean is that they don't want the whole thing to be some heavy-handed Aesop that prescribes morals and values without taking a balanced view and showing both sides.

What I really don't like is when unimaginative social justice turds take existing franchises and ride their coattails, bending the story's entire narrative towards their unbearably preachy shit. SJW entryism is garbage. They literally believe that the main purpose of fiction is didacticism, and that if you're not teaching moral lessons, then your story isn't really telling anything at all. That's not true. It is, in fact, patently false. For one thing, people read for pleasure and for aesthetics, too, not just for edification. For another, if it were the case that every story should contain good morals, then it would be impossible to depict acts of cruelty and lawlessness, or villainous protagonists. This is also why SJWs are terrible at writing villains. It's hard to maintain verisimilitude in a story when the antagonists never actually do anything evil. A typical SJW villain is either a mustache-twirling cardboard standup who never actually does anything to merit the title, or else they're hyper-sadistic cartoons, with nowhere in between, and in any case, they have very few rational motivations of their own, other than illustrating the moral of the work.

Over-woke stories are intrinsically propagandistic in structure, content, and plotting. They're not there to tell you an actual story, with interesting events, delightful turns of phrase, and aesthetic beauty. They exist only to pound a specific moral into your head like a hammer. Very often, they'll set up some cartoonish straw man villain who represents whatever the author finds to be evil in the real world, and then, they'll fill out the cast with a variety of special snowflake characters to go beat the villain up. In the end, the villain falls to his knees and he's like "Blast! I have been bested by the Rainbow Woke Troupe! They were just too special after all!"

A good story, in my book, is one that is not afraid to really, really fuck with the protagonists and put them through the wringer. Woke authors don't do that. They don't inflict real trauma on their characters at all, or challenge them with serious problems, or introduce any conflict between them. They carry their characters on a palanquin on their shoulders all the way to the climax and eventual denouement, coddling and babying them and showing them ridiculous favor. Woke characters are saccharine-sweet, unnaturally polite to one another, and shy away from conflict or cruelty of any kind. You wouldn't be able to write dark comedies like The Thick of It or It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia if the cast was woke, because the setup requires that the characters show polonium-level toxicity towards each other.

I happen to favor stories like that, where the protags are truly mean motherfuckers who swear, drink, smoke, and brawl a lot. How do you write Charles Bukowski or Bret Easton Ellis-style transgressive narratives if the protagonists are woke? It's not possible. I like me a dirty ol' blue-collar book. Give me crime, give me grime, give me sensationalistic accounts of people being crude assholes to each other, but don't give me this fucking prancing in a poppy field turbo-woke bullshit. I won't fucking have it.
 
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Iconoclast

Perpetually Angry
Obozny
"Problematic" is code for "This doesn't support my viewpoint but I can't insult it for that without revealing my biases, so I'm going to vaguely imply problems without specifying."

"Problematic" is code for "this made me weepy-eyed and deeply uncomfortable, but I know for a fact that *THASF* will snicker like Beavis while reading/watching/playing it".

 

Aldarion

Neoreactionary Monarchist
To be fair, I think about 90% of the Warhammer fandom either doesn't realize or forgets that it's supposed to be a parody of Extreme European Nationalism. (As per the original authors admition. If your own fanbase doesn't understand the source material it's kinda hard to expect these twitterites to understand it.

Eh, it started that way. But it hasn't really been a parody for a long time.
 

Circle of Willis

Well-known member
Just a theory but that old-time fan was a fellow geek and has the power of imagination. All these people who cannot see themseleves unless they are directly represented? These are the normies that have flooded our hobbies and lack imagination. They do not care for the spirit nor the concepts, they care for spectacle and action and love plots.
Frankly I'd love for the entertainment industry to focus on making stuff for normies again. Normies don't give a damn about politics, they just want to be entertained, and even they know to turn away from the raving hateful screeds trying to pass themselves off as entertainment today - that's why something like Top Gun: Maverick can succeed wildly while Lightyear or those bajillion woke remakes (ex. Terminator: Dark Fate) bombed, and why The CW (home of Batwoman among other woke 'greats') has just been sold not even for $0, but for -$100 million. That is, the buyer had to take on at least $100 million of the debts it accrued by going woke. As is, the industry's mostly crapping out products that pander to terminally online far-left psychopaths first & foremost and only to actual paying audiences a distant sixtieth or so.

Never thought I'd ever end up preferring to watch the second Bayformers movie 1000 times over than drop even one watch on the vast majority of today's entertainment offerings, but here we are.
 

Culsu

Agent of the Central Plasma
Founder
Oh, thank goodness that WoTC gives GMs permission to roleplay characters of different cultures, for now. As long as they follow their standards that are just broad & vague enough that anyone they don't like can still be accused of a hate crime.

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Read that second to last sentence again. So, in a roleplaying game, you're not allowed to roleplay a character if said character has
  • a different skin color than yourself
  • different features
  • different hairstyle
if doing so makes them appear like a real-world ethnicity. You also can't use "stereotypical" clothing or accents. You know, stereotypes? The things that are one because broadly, they correspond with the actual thing? Nope, can't do that.

So, if you're a white dude with blond hair or no hair at all, seems you're all out of luck if you want to roleplay as a veiled, swashbuckling female pirate from a desert realm with an accent like Shohreh Aghdashloo. Because you can't play pretend (a.k.a. roleplay) in a roleplaying game. Because, racism, I guess. Or cultural appropriation. Whatever empty term fits best, I suppose.

"You can't use real world ethnicities as a base," how is that even supposed to work? If you're staying within the parameters of a human character, how else are you going to do that?! Desert culture garb and practices are the way they are because they've proven to work. Black people have curly hair... and dark skin. Saying this, using this for your own characters... I just can't grasp where the problem is?!

I think this all came about because someone somewhere got their feathers ruffled about the old-school depiction of gypsies in the Curse of Strahd module - utterly missing the point that it's an incredibly positive and romaticized-by-Hollywood stereotype compared to what actual Romani culture is.
 
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Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
Daily Show Alumus Samantha Bee's Full Frontal Late Night Comedy Show has been tragically cancelled after seven years on TBS.


This apparently follows TBS also cancelling the Conan show after many years, NBC cancelling "Digital Influencer" Lilly Singh's show after two seasons and Comedy Central cancelling spinoffs it had with Larry Wilmore and Jordan Klepper, deciding to stick with an hour long Daily Show with Trevor Noah. Both Netflix and Hulu also failed with Liberal Comedians like Sarah Silverman, Michelle Wolfe and Chelsea Handler. Even James Corden is retiring soon from the Late, Late Show on CBS that follows Colbert's show.

It appears one of the few new comedy news shows that is successful to the point of eclipsing even Major Network Late Shows is Gutfeld! on Fox News which has eclipsed both NBC's Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon and ABC's Jimmy Kimmel Live! despite being on a Cable News Network as opposed to a regular television network.

 

Skallagrim

Well-known member
Daily Show Alumus Samantha Bee's Full Frontal Late Night Comedy Show has been tragically cancelled after seven years on TBS.


This apparently follows TBS also cancelling the Conan show after many years, NBC cancelling "Digital Influencer" Lilly Singh's show after two seasons and Comedy Central cancelling spinoffs it had with Larry Wilmore and Jordan Klepper, deciding to stick with an hour long Daily Show with Trevor Noah. Both Netflix and Hulu also failed with Liberal Comedians like Sarah Silverman, Michelle Wolfe and Chelsea Handler. Even James Corden is retiring soon from the Late, Late Show on CBS that follows Colbert's show.

It appears one of the few new comedy news shows that is successful to the point of eclipsing even Major Network Late Shows is Gutfeld! on Fox News which has eclipsed both NBC's Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon and ABC's Jimmy Kimmel Live! despite being on a Cable News Network as opposed to a regular television network.

It's almost like people don't enjoy being patronised by smug, unfunny jackals...
 

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
It's almost like people don't enjoy being patronised by smug, unfunny jackals...

Yeah Norm MacDonald had a comment on that actually. There's a lot of comedians who want to be seen as smart and intellectual as opposed to most importantly being 'funny.'


He cites Bill Maher and Dennis Miller as the "smart" comedians but I think it applies to almost all of the Daily Show Alumus and their ilk obviously. Now many of them are successful, but a lot of them focus more on their political commentary then actually being funny and require loads of comedy writers to keep them even marginally interesting as they're outraged. Plus with these "smart" comedians, being smug and seeing themselves as 'elitist' almost goes hand in hand with it.

Norm also cites folks like David Letterman (who is liberal) as being smart, but not acting like it. Instead they play the 'Everyman' role which is more relatable. I'd probably say Comedians like Bill Burr, Dave Chappelle and even Conan O'Brien (who has perfected the medium of being geeky and hapless) kinda fall into that category as well. They are smart but don't present themselves as such in their acts.
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
The Cleveland Indians went woke, changed their name to "Guardians," and promptly went broke, losing some 30% of their TV ratings.

Note this is limited to them, Baseball ratings overall have been flat with other teams ganing.
 
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at this point, I'm gaining as much Ire for Anti-SJWs as I am the SJWs themselves. Both have done their fair of NPC screeching and neither one of them has done anything to actually support their cause. Well...this is what happens when the only thing uniting you is hate and the desire for destruction as opposed to trying to build something. Let it all burn to the ground at this point I say. Enjoy your Tic-Tok suckers! to quote the Joker, "YOU GET WHAT YOU FREAKING DESERVE!"

Honestly part of me hopes we are forced back to the days of playing dominos and cards for entertainment. If you can't keep somthing, you don't deserve to have it.
 
What have we done, exactly, to earn your ire?

Nobody has seemingly put effort into actually building anything, just cheering with Glee as everything gets burned down while chanting get woke go broke like it's some sort of mantra or spell. I get it we hate the left and want to see everything they built get burned down. Great, now can we start focusing on building something in it's place now or are we just going to sit on our hands while the left moves on to other fandoms and ruin those too?
 

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