Military US Military Is Scared Americans Won't Fight For Globalism

Ixian

Well-known member
Please never tell them that, we have enough interservice dick waving as is.

Right, which is why we need to put it all aside, and just acknowledge that the US Navy really should be considered the best branch.

We are all surely tired of this topic, lets just come together and agree. 😁
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder



This is the fundamental issue with the US military at the moment, that underpins so many issues: the US public do not trust US military leaders/the Pentagon with their lives anymore.

It's also something no recruiting campaign seems willing to address; the campaign is never military leaders asking the US public to trust them with their lives or their families lives, again, when that is where most of the issues originate.
 

Ixian

Well-known member



This is the fundamental issue with the US military at the moment, that underpins so many issues: the US public do not trust US military leaders/the Pentagon with their lives anymore.

It's also something no recruiting campaign seems willing to address; the campaign is never military leaders asking the US public to trust them with their lives or their families lives, again, when that is where most of the issues originate.


Agreed.

It seems the militaries big plan is to flood tiktoc and youtube shorts with "Totally Not Paid" vets to do stupid tiktoc trends with a military twist. They have absolutely been swamping those platforms the last few weeks.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
Let's be honest, most young people who would traditionally be interested in military service aren't using tiktok or youtube shorts that much anyway.

In short the idiots at the Pentagon are advising to the wrong people.
The military doesn't have the luxury of trying to just cater to it's 'traditional' recruit pool anymore, if it wants to keep up force numbers.

Trying to preach to a smaller and smaller choir won't produce the desired results, and well...the Air Force isn't hurting that bad, compared to the Army and Navy.

Plus, well, a lot of young people have no desire to deal with enlisted-level bullshit, and want to be officers; that's why enlisted heavy services are suffering more than officer heavy services like the Air Force. Officers have better posting options, better retirement security, better QoL, and are able to segway in to politics or public office much easier than enlisted, if they learn to play the game of officer level politics correctly.

There is just more earning and power potential in officer tracks than in being even senior enlisted.

Add in corportism taking hold in the military with regards to promotions and qualifications, and it the military life has lost most of the old glory and glamor it used to have.

The US military's PR and self-image is based on a lot of people telling generals what they want to hear about why recruiting numbers are down, blaming the populace for not being patriotic enough or too fat or what-have-you, and they never want to look in the mirror or across the Potomac to the real reasons.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
The military doesn't have the luxury of trying to just cater to it's 'traditional' recruit pool anymore, if it wants to keep up force numbers.

Trying to preach to a smaller and smaller choir won't produce the desired results, and well...the Air Force isn't hurting that bad, compared to the Army and Navy.

Plus, well, a lot of young people have no desire to deal with enlisted-level bullshit, and want to be officers; that's why enlisted heavy services are suffering more than officer heavy services like the Air Force. Officers have better posting options, better retirement security, better QoL, and are able to segway in to politics or public office much easier than enlisted, if they learn to play the game of officer level politics correctly.

There is just more earning and power potential in officer tracks than in being even senior enlisted.
Obviously... But there is this saying, too many chiefs and not enough Indians...

That sounds like less of an enlisted problem in itself but more of a general money problem.
Let's be honest, 99% of officers will never get into politics anyway, and in the end, someone in the military has to do the "enlisted jobs" anyway (at least many of them, there could be some potential for automation or reorganization), no matter what you call them.

Point in case, back in the days of larger aircraft numbers there were many enlisted pilots. If there was such an option now, i'm sure there would be many volunteers, and they wouldn't give a damn if they get an officer rank or not.
Add in corportism taking hold in the military with regards to promotions and qualifications, and it the military life has lost most of the old glory and glamor it used to have.
I think that one is an even bigger problem than the above. If the military was willing to offer a career path free of the more annoying modern civilian workplace annoyances, particularly of legal and political nature, it would have its own niche of interested people just by nature of that. That's a politician solvable problem.
The US military's PR and self-image is based on a lot of people telling generals what they want to hear about why recruiting numbers are down, blaming the populace for not being patriotic enough or too fat or what-have-you, and they never want to look in the mirror or across the Potomac to the real reasons.
Nothing says it can't be both.
 

Cherico

Well-known member
The military doesn't have the luxury of trying to just cater to it's 'traditional' recruit pool anymore, if it wants to keep up force numbers.

Trying to preach to a smaller and smaller choir won't produce the desired results, and well...the Air Force isn't hurting that bad, compared to the Army and Navy.

Plus, well, a lot of young people have no desire to deal with enlisted-level bullshit, and want to be officers; that's why enlisted heavy services are suffering more than officer heavy services like the Air Force. Officers have better posting options, better retirement security, better QoL, and are able to segway in to politics or public office much easier than enlisted, if they learn to play the game of officer level politics correctly.

There is just more earning and power potential in officer tracks than in being even senior enlisted.

Add in corportism taking hold in the military with regards to promotions and qualifications, and it the military life has lost most of the old glory and glamor it used to have.

The US military's PR and self-image is based on a lot of people telling generals what they want to hear about why recruiting numbers are down, blaming the populace for not being patriotic enough or too fat or what-have-you, and they never want to look in the mirror or across the Potomac to the real reasons.

Quite simply put america just had a 20 year plus long war, the country is pretty tried of conflict right now because of that.

Another factor is that the veterans of said 20 year conflict are having their benfits fucked with and pretty much everyone has a story about the green weiny. Add to that as has been said the Biden adminstration is pretty fucking horrible and you have a lot of people who just are not going to sign up.
 

TheRomanSlayer

Unipolarity is for Subhuman Trogdolytes
I wonder if even the migrants that are coming to the US would not want to sign up in exchange for a green card as well. Legally or illegally.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
Obviously... But there is this saying, too many chiefs and not enough Indians...

That sounds like less of an enlisted problem in itself but more of a general money problem.
Let's be honest, 99% of officers will never get into politics anyway, and in the end, someone in the military has to do the "enlisted jobs" anyway (at least many of them, there could be some potential for automation or reorganization), no matter what you call them.

Point in case, back in the days of larger aircraft numbers there were many enlisted pilots. If there was such an option now, i'm sure there would be many volunteers, and they wouldn't give a damn if they get an officer rank or not.
Enlisted pilots, even enlisted transport pilots, threaten the country club mentality of most Air Force pilot ranks and the credential-ism of of the Air Force command structure. Air Force Enlisted are the ground crews and security personnel, and the backseaters sometimes on the large planes.

Lots more wannabe-pilots than open slots, even with the bad recruiting numbers for the military, and you can trust enlisted with a lot of things, but aircraft aren't so simple anymore that Congress wants enlisted flyers.
I think that one is an even bigger problem than the above. If the military was willing to offer a career path free of the more annoying modern civilian workplace annoyances, particularly of legal and political nature, it would have its own niche of interested people just by nature of that. That's a politician solvable problem.
The politicians in DC generally don't want to change things like the military going corporate, due to contractors and contractor donations to campaigns, or the 'up or out' issues, and definitely aren't trying to slow the woken-ing/trans-ing of the US military.

So anything that requires a political wind change in DC effectively is 'unfixable', and thus likely to remain a systemic level issue.
Nothing says it can't be both.
Oh, it's a wide range of factors, but a lot of them are not ones the generals and admirals and Congresscritters want to hear from the PR people when they ask why recruiting is down.

Until DC and the US military stop trying to live in the woke and PR illusions the DC and Pentagon bubbles have built for themselves, recruiting will continue to fall.

If you cannot say the emperor has no clothes, then you cannot tell the emperor why he is feeling a draft.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
I wonder if even the migrants that are coming to the US would not want to sign up in exchange for a green card as well. Legally or illegally.
If the military and the politicians were willing to lower their standards so much that many of those would qualify, they wouldn't have the problem in the first place.
Most of them would struggle to even talk with the rest of military personnel, and that's besides the issues with criminality and people who don't really want the job, just the green card.
Enlisted pilots, even enlisted transport pilots, threaten the country club mentality of most Air Force pilot ranks and the credential-ism of of the Air Force command structure. Air Force Enlisted are the ground crews and security personnel, and the backseaters sometimes on the large planes.

Lots more wannabe-pilots than open slots, even with the bad recruiting numbers for the military, and you can trust enlisted with a lot of things, but aircraft aren't so simple anymore that Congress wants enlisted flyers.
Still, that's an example of MOS that doesn't struggle for volunteers at all. It's less about rank, more the job, associated benefits and pay.
The politicians in DC generally don't want to change things like the military going corporate, due to contractors and contractor donations to campaigns, or the 'up or out' issues, and definitely aren't trying to slow the woken-ing/trans-ing of the US military.

So anything that requires a political wind change in DC effectively is 'unfixable', and thus likely to remain a systemic level issue.
GOP could afford to do some of it politically.
 
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Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
Still, that's an example of MOS that doesn't struggle for volunteers at all. It's less about rank, more the job, associated benefits and pay.
Pilot's license qualification is also the big draw; cheaper, sometimes faster, to get it via the military, who pay for you to learn, than civie channels in many regards, where you pay to learn out of pocket.
GOP could afford to do some of it politically.
That would require the GOP to have control of all three branches at once.

You saw what happened last time the GOP had that in the first half of Trump's term; the establishment GOP did nothing, despite having the votes to do so, because Ryan didn't want to upset the apple cart and uniparty establishment.

So those needed political changes are likely at least 2 year from even being possible to consider, assuming an unrealistic sweep of the House, Senate, and Oval, and more realistically, the GOp may never get all 3 under lock again in our lifetimes.

So realistically, the GOP could only accomplish any of the needed changes by swaying Blue Dog Dems to join them in the vote and having a large enough voting margin to override any POTUS veto, regardless of party.

Long story short, the political problems behind recruitment falling are unlikely to be fixed any time soon, and are far more likely to get even worse, not better, for the foreseeable future, regardless of ad campaigns.

Short of Iran doing something stupid like sinking one of our ships in the Gulf, or Russia going full retard and trying something in Alaska or NATO with uniformed troops, the national unifying impetus just won't be there to make up for the political fuckery that has gutted DoD recruiting.

And we've both seen how supporting something as truly righteous and worthy as helping Ukraine is still a rather controversial issue with some people, where many thought it would be a bipartisan/non-partisan issue. So fixing the issues that are the root of recruiting shortfall is likely to be much, much harder than it should, even if the GoP got the stars to align again and grab all 3 branches.
 

bintananth

behind a desk
Pilot's license qualification is also the big draw; cheaper, sometimes faster, to get it via the military, who pay for you to learn, than civie channels in many regards, where you pay to learn out of pocket.
Yeah, getting a pilots licence is not cheap. It's $15-20k for a private pilots licence.

Then there's the airplane once you've got the licence ... if you aren't renting one by the hour you're well into "I could buy a nice house for that" before ongoing stuff like maintenence, hanger space at an airport, insurance, landing fees, fuel, &c gets tacked on.

Someone with a private pilots licence is not hard up for cash because they're spending thousands of dollars every year just to keep the licence even if they don't own an airplane.
 

Simonbob

Well-known member
And we've both seen how supporting something as truly righteous and worthy as helping Ukraine is still a rather controversial issue with some people, where many thought it would be a bipartisan/non-partisan issue. So fixing the issues that are the root of recruiting shortfall is likely to be much, much harder than it should, even if the GoP got the stars to align again and grab all 3 branches.

That, I disagree with. But, I'll stick to the most basic issue, when we're talking about this Thread.


The first thing the US military should be about is protecting the US and it's people. The more the US gets involved with Ukraine, the more likely that goes wrong. This it textbook World Policing, with all the issues that entails, and could create. Worse, Russia is Nuke capable, and Ukraine wasn't a formal ally.


Messy. And it suggests to many prospective recruits that you'll be sent to die in far off lands for nothing that will help or protect your own.
 

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