Trump Investigations Thread

bintananth

behind a desk
Now I didn't analyze all the facts (I may be incorrect so be free to correct the facts) but I'm pretty sure in a nutshell Hillary Broke some rules regarding confidential documents and failed at covering up then got away with no serious punishment.

Trump more or less did the same thing and because of the previous precedent more or less be similar to what Hillary did he would get off as well or at least with a slap of the wrist.


That's literally what case law is, similar facts to similar instances to allow similar legal outcomes. Context is the most important factor though
Hillary, Biden, Pence, and a lot of others did something Trump didn't do when found with classified documents they weren't supposed to have: "Oopsie, my bad. He're is all of it."

Trump wanted to and tried to keep the documents and that's why he and others have been charged with a shitload of felonies for classified documents alone.

If you do what the others I mentioned did you'll get, at worst, a slap on the wrist with a "Please don't do that again" admonishment akin to a TS friendly reminder.
 

bintananth

behind a desk
Burned and wiped hard drives say what?
Were the drives burned and wiped before (which is sorta normal, if a bit over the top, for the disposal of unneeded hardware) or after they were told "Hey guys, there might be some classified stuff on that."?

Either way the destruction of the hardware meant that anything stored on that hardware was gone forever and can't be shared with anyone.

That's quite different from the FBI executing a search warrant for classified documents they know you have.
 

Blasterbot

Well-known member
Were the drives burned and wiped before (which is sorta normal, if a bit over the top, for the disposal of unneeded hardware) or after they were told "Hey guys, there might be some classified stuff on that."?

Either way the destruction of the hardware meant that anything stored on that hardware was gone forever and can't be shared with anyone.

That's quite different from the FBI executing a search warrant for classified documents they know you have.
After. they found the guy asking reddit what he should do to erase very sensitive data for a VVIP. it is fucking wild what the Clintons have gotten away with while normies believe that the worst thing Bill did was fuck a not so hot intern in the oval office and give away some of the cigars he stuck in her snatch to foreign ambassadors.
 

Vyor

My influence grows!
Were the drives burned and wiped before (which is sorta normal, if a bit over the top, for the disposal of unneeded hardware) or after they were told "Hey guys, there might be some classified stuff on that."?

Either way the destruction of the hardware meant that anything stored on that hardware was gone forever and can't be shared with anyone.

That's quite different from the FBI executing a search warrant for classified documents they know you have.

After they were subpoenaed
 

S'task

Renegade Philosopher
Administrator
Staff Member
Founder
Were the drives burned and wiped before (which is sorta normal, if a bit over the top, for the disposal of unneeded hardware) or after they were told "Hey guys, there might be some classified stuff on that."?

Either way the destruction of the hardware meant that anything stored on that hardware was gone forever and can't be shared with anyone.

That's quite different from the FBI executing a search warrant for classified documents they know you have.
. . . You do know they recovered some of the emails from Anthony Weiner's wife's computers when she was arranged and her shit had been gone through and at that point they found that, yes indeed, Clinton had used her server to pass through confidential documents? And while the mainstream media tried to spin this as Clinton just passing documents from her unclassified State department email to her private email to make it easier to print out because that was easier than using the State department printers, there's two issues with this.

The first is, well, the State department network printers on the unclassified network have not ever been hard to set up or use. I know, I've literally worked on said network for nearly a decade.

Secondly, just because something is on the unclassified side of the State department network DOES NOT MEAN it is allowed to be sent to a private email. There's a level of classifications known as "Sensitive But Unclassified" (SBU) that is also controlled from being released and should not be sent outside the government's computer networks. Want to know the type of documents that are considered SBU but you'd not want to have outsiders see? Well, for instance, you have something called a "System Security Plan". These document the in place security, planned security, and security lapses in governmental computer systems, and they are only classified at a level commensurate to the data those systems handle. If the system doesn't handle Secret or higher data, only handling things that are considered SBU, those SSP are only classified as SBU.

Oh... that doesn't sound to bad, now does it? But, you know what's considered SBU? Things like all your Personally Identifiable Information... your SSN, your address, photos of you, little things like that. And you know who has all that information on you? Well, if you happen to have a passport... and for you non-Americans if you've ever visited the US or gotten a US visa, the US State Department does.

So, as you can imagine, someone who has access to those SSPs isn't allowed to put them on a personal computer or send them to their personal email accounts, even though those documents are just SBU. Doing so would be a major violation, and would, at a minimum, get them fired, if not prosecuted.

In other words, what Clinton was doing by passing through even non-classified emails to her private server to print them out is such a list of security violations that had any rank and file member of the State Department done it they would not have just been out on their ear, but likely locked up for decades.
 

bintananth

behind a desk
. . . You do know they recovered some of the emails from Anthony Weiner's wife's computers when she was arranged and her shit had been gone through and at that point they found that, yes indeed, Clinton had used her server to pass through confidential documents? And while the mainstream media tried to spin this as Clinton just passing documents from her unclassified State department email to her private email to make it easier to print out because that was easier than using the State department printers, there's two issues with this.

The first is, well, the State department network printers on the unclassified network have not ever been hard to set up or use. I know, I've literally worked on said network for nearly a decade.

Secondly, just because something is on the unclassified side of the State department network DOES NOT MEAN it is allowed to be sent to a private email. There's a level of classifications known as "Sensitive But Unclassified" (SBU) that is also controlled from being released and should not be sent outside the government's computer networks. Want to know the type of documents that are considered SBU but you'd not want to have outsiders see? Well, for instance, you have something called a "System Security Plan". These document the in place security, planned security, and security lapses in governmental computer systems, and they are only classified at a level commensurate to the data those systems handle. If the system doesn't handle Secret or higher data, only handling things that are considered SBU, those SSP are only classified as SBU.

Oh... that doesn't sound to bad, now does it? But, you know what's considered SBU? Things like all your Personally Identifiable Information... your SSN, your address, photos of you, little things like that. And you know who has all that information on you? Well, if you happen to have a passport... and for you non-Americans if you've ever visited the US or gotten a US visa, the US State Department does.

So, as you can imagine, someone who has access to those SSPs isn't allowed to put them on a personal computer or send them to their personal email accounts, even though those documents are just SBU. Doing so would be a major violation, and would, at a minimum, get them fired, if not prosecuted.

In other words, what Clinton was doing by passing through even non-classified emails to her private server to print them out is such a list of security violations that had any rank and file member of the State Department done it they would not have just been out on their ear, but likely locked up for decades.
You are nit-picking.

Did Hillary do everything "by the book" while she was Secretary of State? No, and I will not get dragged into a discussion about where the line was crossed.

She didn't cross it. Trump did. There's a reason why she isn't facing criminal charges while Trump has been charged with over 90 felonies.

It ain't a political witch hunt no matter how much the right screams "It's a witch hunt."
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
. . . You do know they recovered some of the emails from Anthony Weiner's wife's computers when she was arranged and her shit had been gone through and at that point they found that, yes indeed, Clinton had used her server to pass through confidential documents? And while the mainstream media tried to spin this as Clinton just passing documents from her unclassified State department email to her private email to make it easier to print out because that was easier than using the State department printers, there's two issues with this.

The first is, well, the State department network printers on the unclassified network have not ever been hard to set up or use. I know, I've literally worked on said network for nearly a decade.

Secondly, just because something is on the unclassified side of the State department network DOES NOT MEAN it is allowed to be sent to a private email. There's a level of classifications known as "Sensitive But Unclassified" (SBU) that is also controlled from being released and should not be sent outside the government's computer networks. Want to know the type of documents that are considered SBU but you'd not want to have outsiders see? Well, for instance, you have something called a "System Security Plan". These document the in place security, planned security, and security lapses in governmental computer systems, and they are only classified at a level commensurate to the data those systems handle. If the system doesn't handle Secret or higher data, only handling things that are considered SBU, those SSP are only classified as SBU.

Oh... that doesn't sound to bad, now does it? But, you know what's considered SBU? Things like all your Personally Identifiable Information... your SSN, your address, photos of you, little things like that. And you know who has all that information on you? Well, if you happen to have a passport... and for you non-Americans if you've ever visited the US or gotten a US visa, the US State Department does.

So, as you can imagine, someone who has access to those SSPs isn't allowed to put them on a personal computer or send them to their personal email accounts, even though those documents are just SBU. Doing so would be a major violation, and would, at a minimum, get them fired, if not prosecuted.

In other words, what Clinton was doing by passing through even non-classified emails to her private server to print them out is such a list of security violations that had any rank and file member of the State Department done it they would not have just been out on their ear, but likely locked up for decades.
It's CUI now
You are nit-picking.

Did Hillary do everything "by the book" while she was Secretary of State? No, and I will not get dragged into a discussion about where the line was crossed.

She didn't cross it. Trump did. There's a reason why she isn't facing criminal charges while Trump has been charged with over 90 felonies.

It ain't a political witch hunt no matter how much the right screams "It's a witch hunt."
He literally knows this field better then damn near anyone I have met...
 

The Whispering Monk

Well-known member
Osaul
She didn't cross it. Trump did. There's a reason why she isn't facing criminal charges while Trump has been charged with over 90 felonies.
AGAIN, she DID cross that river simply by mishandling info. She wasn't charged because the DOJ chose not to enforce the law. It's that simple. ANY OTHER INTERPRETATION IS WRONG. She broke a law the does NOT require intent for prosecution. That's it.
 

S'task

Renegade Philosopher
Administrator
Staff Member
Founder
It's CUI now
State is still using SBU as of... oh, right, today, emblazoned all over the documents and emails I drafted and worked on today...
You are nit-picking.
And no I'm not. This is, quite literally my day job. If I did a quarter of what Clinton did, I would be out on my ear and likely in jail pending trial. She got special handling because of who she was, that's the long and short of it, anyone who knows anything about the handling and dispensation of government documents knows it. This stuff is drilled into you on an annual basis, sometimes more, and the penalties and laws are made quite explicit for spillage, even unintentional spillage, and what Clinton did was INTENTIONAL spillage.
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
State is still using SBU as of... oh, right, today, emblazoned all over the documents and emails I drafted and worked on today...

And no I'm not. This is, quite literally my day job. If I did a quarter of what Clinton did, I would be out on my ear and likely in jail pending trial. She got special handling because of who she was, that's the long and short of it, anyone who knows anything about the handling and dispensation of government documents knows it. This stuff is drilled into you on an annual basis, sometimes more, and the penalties and laws are made quite explicit for spillage, even unintentional spillage, and what Clinton did was INTENTIONAL spillage.
I thought the whole point of classification is for it to be universal.
I miss Unclassified term
 

bintananth

behind a desk

That is not the win for Trump you think or the guy in the video thinks it is.

It's paused because Jack Smith asked SCOTUS to weigh in on the immunity issue. SCOTUS' reply was "We'll look at it" while telling Trump's lawyers "You have nine days to file a briefing." ... to which Trump and his defense team basically went "Oh, shit." because their delay via appealling everything tactic just got tossed out the window.
 

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
That is not the win for Trump you think or the guy in the video thinks it is.

It's paused because Jack Smith asked SCOTUS to weigh in on the immunity issue. SCOTUS' reply was "We'll look at it" while telling Trump's lawyers "You have nine days to file a briefing." ... to which Trump and his defense team basically went "Oh, shit." because their delay via appealling everything tactic just got tossed out the window.
And the video goes over how bullshit that is, and how it is very much election interference, and even cites another example of this happening as done by the same prosecutor, also against a Republican. Naturally, you're all for this obvious corruption, because "orange man bad."
 

Scooby Doo

Well-known member
I haven't kept up with the case but I've been reading two things consistently

The conservatives say the Banks said there was no fraud but the Libs are saying there is and that he lied about his assets.

Can someone summarize which is it actually?
 

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