United States Trump 2nd Term - Planning and Beyond
- Thread starter bullethead
- Start date
> A top aide to Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky met Wednesday with Keith Kellogg, Trump's choice as special envoy for Russia and Ukraine, and Mike Waltz, the incoming national-security adviser, according to a Trump transition official and several people familiar with the discussions.
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> Vice president-elect JD Vance joined in the discussions.
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> Kellogg has signaled support for the Biden administration's efforts to rush weapons to Ukraine, saying it will give Trump leverage with Moscow in negotiating a settlement. But the Trump team has shown little interest in offering Ukraine membership in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, which Zelensky has said he considers a vital security guarantee against future Russian aggression.
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> Andriy Yermak, Zelensky's closest adviser, is visiting Washington to forge relationships with Trump aides, according to people familiar with the planning. He met with the incoming White House chief of staff, Susie Wiles, in Florida earlier Wednesday. Worn down by waging the nearly three-year war against Russia, Ukraine plans to communicate its readiness for peace.
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> "But that needs to be a sustainable peace," said a person familiar with Kyiv's thinking. "An unstable, temporary peace doesn't serve U.S. or Ukrainian interests."
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> Zelensky has recently signaled Ukraine could agree to a cease-fire if Ukraine were permitted to join NATO. Kyiv would seek to win back Ukrainian territory occupied by Russia through diplomatic pressure, he said, rather than force, as he has long insisted.
(backup:Ukraine to Talk With Trump Team About Ending War With Russia - WSJ)
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> Vice president-elect JD Vance joined in the discussions.
>
> Kellogg has signaled support for the Biden administration's efforts to rush weapons to Ukraine, saying it will give Trump leverage with Moscow in negotiating a settlement. But the Trump team has shown little interest in offering Ukraine membership in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, which Zelensky has said he considers a vital security guarantee against future Russian aggression.
>
> Andriy Yermak, Zelensky's closest adviser, is visiting Washington to forge relationships with Trump aides, according to people familiar with the planning. He met with the incoming White House chief of staff, Susie Wiles, in Florida earlier Wednesday. Worn down by waging the nearly three-year war against Russia, Ukraine plans to communicate its readiness for peace.
>
> "But that needs to be a sustainable peace," said a person familiar with Kyiv's thinking. "An unstable, temporary peace doesn't serve U.S. or Ukrainian interests."
>
> Zelensky has recently signaled Ukraine could agree to a cease-fire if Ukraine were permitted to join NATO. Kyiv would seek to win back Ukrainian territory occupied by Russia through diplomatic pressure, he said, rather than force, as he has long insisted.
(backup:Ukraine to Talk With Trump Team About Ending War With Russia - WSJ)
Yep, that one, and as far as I'm aware it by itself was not that big of problem. It killed like ~800 people, over a two year period.
The panic over it was massively overblown and looking back at it most probably manufactured.
It was a problem in hospitals, but not outside of them. It's killed far more in china and africa for obvious reasons.
If you want to claim that you should give me a solid number and a source to go with it. As far as I know SARS just wasn't that infectious it had like 8000 recorded infections worldwide in its heyday and killed maybe 10% of that.
The main damage caused by SARS is the panic, but in reality it's a fucking paper tiger. People made it a problem by losing their goddamn minds over it.
The seasonal flu kills way more people, it's not even close. And on the list of problems in hospitals SARS probably doesn't even make the top 100.
Doomsought
Well-known member
Remember the Spanish Flu didn't even manage to put a pause on WWI. The panic is worse than the disease.
Yeah, I got "more deadly on average" mixed up with kill count.
uhh... the Spanish flu killed between 50 and 100 million people.
Because it didn't come about until the war was essentially over and didn't spike until it was over. It did kill more than twice as many people as that war though.
Buba
A total creep
I suspect that the above figure is off by one zero too many.
Go to the mass graves and tell that to the dead.
Skallagrim
Well-known member
50 million is a very high estimate, 100 million is a bullshit number that often gets mentioned but has no serious rationale behind it. Conversely, 5 million and 10 million ("one zero dropped") are clearly under-estimating the death toll. The typically cited low-end estimate is 17 million, with a serious high-end estimate being more like 25 million.
Pretty consistently, the Spanish Flu killed about 1,1% of the population. Considering the world population at the time, that would be about 19,8 million dead. Call it 20 million to be on the safe side, and that's about as credible a figure as you're likely to get.
Buba
A total creep
Don't get your panties in a knot. I'm just calling our your hysterical bullshit.
BTW - one of the graves is my grandmother's brother - he survived about a year on the Isonzo front and died to the 'flu just after the war ended.
Terthna
Professional Lurker
Problem is, since he's also arguing the pardon for Hunter Biden was warranted, he is effectively saying that the political class and anyone connected to them should be considered above the law, because any court case brought against them would be politically motivated. And if there's an entire class of people who cannot be brought to justice for their crimes, our criminal justice system is entirely meaningless; and becomes little more than a tool to oppress everyone not a member of said class.
To the Dems, the Hunter stuff is a 'farce' of a political prosecution, as much as the stuff against Trump.
I don't like it or agree with it, however I also understand that the power of pardons was built into the US system because of the possibility of biased political prosecutions happening.
Cat's out of the bag in terms of how much the Dems will pardon their allies, to keep the GOP from being able to go after them after Trump takes office, and it does now mean Trump has no reason not to pardon every non-glowie Jan 6th prisoner and frankly he could probably help unfuck Alex Jone's situation to a degree with a pardon.
This is the way the Dems have chosen to play the game, now it's on the GOP to act in kind when possible.
Terthna
Professional Lurker
Feels like we're almost at a point where both political parties pardon everyone on their team whenever they get into power.
No need, those laws don't apply to Congress.
Odds Pelosi retires so that her daughter can replace her in Congress in 2028 ?