Transgender Athletes in Sports

[KilroywasNOTHere]

I predict a round of "see, being transgender doesn't give them an unfair advantage" from the identity politics crowd.

fair but admittedly this still feels sweet. I should note this is an exception to the rule. remember the trans MMA fighter that nearly killed his female opponent.

 

[Captain X]

Oh anyone with a brain knows that, and the vast majority of examples show this, but I'm going to predict that as much as people are going to laugh at this guy for getting the Cartman treatment (if you remember that episode where he competed in the Special Olympics), this is now going to be the example the other side points at to prove their point while they continue to ignore literally every other example.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Oh anyone with a brain knows that, and the vast majority of examples show this, but I'm going to predict that as much as people are going to laugh at this guy for getting the Cartman treatment (if you remember that episode where he competed in the Special Olympics), this is now going to be the example the other side points at to prove their point while they continue to ignore literally every other example.

Honestly props to this exceptional woman who beat the guy. Shame she's transitioning herself. Fortunately, it looks like statistically FtM trans are much more likely to want to reverse and it's apparently much easier to reverse compared to MtF transitions.

 

[Jormungandr]

fair but admittedly this still feels sweet. I should note this is an exception to the rule. remember the trans MMA fighter that nearly killed his female opponent.

I think I remember seeing clips of that on YouTube: Man, shit was brutal.

This is also why you'd never see a male v female boxing match or a male v female rugby match, the latter especially. They'd need ambulances on standby.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

I think I remember seeing clips of that on YouTube: Man, shit was brutal.

This is also why you'd never see a male v female boxing match or a male v female rugby match, the latter especially. They'd need ambulances on standby.

yeah, there is a reason why the only intergender fights that exist in real life are in professional wrestling. That's choreographed specifically to entertain and let people indulge in fantasy. Props to the big women that can make it look legit though.

Also this is the fight I was thinking of: Fallon Fox vs Allanna Jones CFA11 Full Fight - YouTube

Props to Allana for being able to hold as much as she did.

 

[Rocinante]

Guys, this is still totally unfair. Yeah a biological woman beat the biological male, but the biological woman is on a bunch of TRT, and under normal non trans circumstances, that's cheating.

It took someone who is essentially a cheater, to beat the man pretending to be a woman.

This is STILL FUCKED UP.

Ruining women's sports.

 

[Jormungandr]

Guys, this is still totally unfair. Yeah a biological woman beat the biological male, but the biological woman is on a bunch of TRT, and under normal non trans circumstances, that's cheating.

It took someone who is essentially a cheater, to beat the man pretending to be a woman.

This is STILL FUCKED UP.

Ruining women's sports.

Mate, at this point I'm just watching the whole hilarity with a sense of morbid fascination -- like seeing a slow-mo, ongoing train-wreck in real-life.

 

[Cherico]

Mate, at this point I'm just watching the whole hilarity with a sense of morbid fascination -- like seeing a slow-mo, ongoing train-wreck in real-life.

I've been running low on popcorn.

 

[Typhonis]

I've been running low on popcorn.

*Hands Cherico a bag from Subway* It'll last longer.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Guys, this is still totally unfair. Yeah a biological woman beat the biological male, but the biological woman is on a bunch of TRT, and under normal non trans circumstances, that's cheating.

It took someone who is essentially a cheater, to beat the man pretending to be a woman.

This is STILL FUCKED UP.

Ruining women's sports.

Juicing is cheating that being said it's still not as messed up as a man mutilating his genitals (in many cases irreversibly) trying to pretend to be a woman. and as Jormungandr says, at this point, we are just enjoying the train wreck. (I am legit impressed with Allana Jones performance against Fox givin the circumstances of that fight. Unlike "Issac" I don't see anything about Allana juicing before the fight)

When this conversation was first brought up, one of the first things I was thinking is "Why don't Trans people have thier own leagues/division. It'd be a compromise on the LGBTQs part granted but it'd be about as fair as you'd reasonably get. Logically I still ask this question but givin my experance with the LGBTQ as of late, I don't think these people as a whole are mentally stable enough to think logically.

 

[LordsFire]

When this conversation was first brought up, one of the first things I was thinking is "Why don't Trans people have thier own leagues/division. It'd be a compromise on the LGBTQs part granted but it'd be about as fair as you'd reasonably get. Logically I still ask this question but givin my experance with the LGBTQ as of late, I don't think these people as a whole are mentally stable enough to think logically.

That entire political activist movement is about rejecting reality, to try and force their fantasies about how reality should be, into becoming the new reality.

For most of them, any compromise is unacceptable, because it is admitting that reality isn't actually what they pretend it is, and once one crack in the delusion is allowed, reality will come pouring through like a dam with a hole in it.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

The entire political activist movement is about rejecting reality, to try and force their fantasies about how reality should be, into becoming the new reality.

For most of them, any compromise is unacceptable, because it is admitting that reality isn't actually what they pretend it is, and once one crack in the delusion is allowed, reality will come pouring through like a dam with a hole in it.

Look I'm all about breaking the the natural barriers, augmenting reality and actually progressing (Nobody thought the sound barrier could be broken till it was and all that jazz) but the thing about progress is you actually have to get to that point before you can integrate it and make it the norm.

As of now we don't have the capabilities to alter people at the chromosomal level to allow them to change their sex. We don't have cybernetics or genetic engineering techniques that can make women (As a whole) as strong as men (as a whole) (I do the parathesis because I know there is going to be that one guy in the comment section that goes "but but but") Maybe in some far future we may get to such points. But until then, the LGBTQ are going to deal with the reality they currently got. That reality being as of right now and for the foreseeable future there is still a significant strength difference between men and women even after transitioning. It is what it is. No amount of denial and calling people phobics or isms is going to change that.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Look I'm all about breaking the the natural barriers, augmenting reality and actually progressing (Nobody thought the sound barrier could be broken till it was and all that jazz) but the thing about progress is you actually have to get to that point before you can integrate it and make it the norm.

As of now we don't have the capabilities to alter people at the chromosomal level to allow them to change their sex. We don't have cybernetics or genetic engineering techniques that can make women (As a whole) as strong as men (as a whole) (I do the parathesis because I know there is going to be that one guy in the comment section that goes "but but but") Maybe in some far future we may get to such points. But until then, the LGBTQ are going to deal with the reality they currently got. That reality being as of right now and for the foreseeable future there is still a significant strength difference between men and women even after transitioning. It is what it is. No amount of denial and calling people phobics or isms is going to change that.

Just to add, I'm not convinced even an actual transition would help most of these people. It seems like many who suffer from gender disphoria also have a slew of other mental health issues. whether this is due to a birth defect or environmental trauma I don't know.

I do question America's view of femininity Pre and post feminism as in the best-case scenario it encourages women to be self-centered, vain, and dependent (scarlet from gone with the wind anybody) and at worst. it creates an environment that makes both men AND women insecure and question everything about themselves including their own sexuality.

I believe it was @Cherico that pointed out to me that a lot of America's cultural views of women (Especially in terms of pop culture) were certainly not the norm and i'm honestly wondering if were (and are) out of vogue on that just as we were out of vogue on slavery at the time of our founding. (Europe was already starting to outlaw slavery even before America even declared independence.) and just like with slavery cultural Marxist have been able to use that cultural deficiency as an exploit.

but back to the original point. I don't think Transpeople are going to find the acceptance (Social or self) that they desire.

 

[LordsFire]

but back to the original point. I don't think Transpeople are going to find the acceptance (Social or self) that they desire.

It's just another unhealthy way of trying to find identity, that is playing out in a particularly destructive manner.

Everyone wants a sense of identity, and until they find one that satisfies them, they'll either keep looking for a new one, or try to push harder on the one(s) they've chosen to invest in.

This kind of madness was inevitable consequence of large-scale rejection of God. Nothing else in life can fill that hole.

 

[Captain X]

This kind of madness was inevitable consequence of large-scale rejection of God. Nothing else in life can fill that hole.

I'm not having any problems.

 

[Cherico]

Just to add, I'm not convinced even an actual transition would help most of these people. It seems like many who suffer from gender disphoria also have a slew of other mental health issues. whether this is due to a birth defect or environmental trauma I don't know.

I do question America's view of femininity Pre and post feminism as in the best-case scenario it encourages women to be self-centered, vain, and dependent (scarlet from gone with the wind anybody) and at worst. it creates an environment that makes both men AND women insecure and question everything about themselves including their own sexuality.

I believe it was @Cherico that pointed out to me that a lot of America's cultural views of women (Especially in terms of pop culture) were certainly not the norm and i'm honestly wondering if were (and are) out of vogue on that just as we were out of vogue on slavery at the time of our founding. (Europe was already starting to outlaw slavery even before America even declared independence.) and just like with slavery cultural Marxist have been able to use that cultural deficiency as an exploit.

but back to the original point. I don't think Transpeople are going to find the acceptance (Social or self) that they desire.

Male female interactions are complex and change across history, culture, time and geography that shit is complex.


As for transpeople.

That's a complex issue in and of itself.

Modernity is a time of social experiements and that time is ending. The experiements that work will become added to tradition the ones that dont will be purged. So there is a time limit on who gets through before the lock is in.

Racial equality I think is already through the lock, the end of modernity is a return to tradition and the christian traditon isn't actually a big fan of racial segergation. So I think blacks, hispanics, asians, ect will all be just fine.

Gay marrage I think gives the gay community a chance to get in and become assimulated, the pride parades and the exesses will be a thing of the past but gay people I think have a chance of getting through.

Transpeople though...that is a sticky one their on the tail end right at the end of modernity and are allied to an establishment that is pissing off pretty much every one with their activists being the vanguard of this establishment. There is a chance they will be fine but I think those odds are slim.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

Male female interactions are complex and change across history, culture, time and geography that shit is complex.


As for transpeople.

That's a complex issue in and of itself.

Modernity is a time of social experiements and that time is ending. The experiements that work will become added to tradition the ones that dont will be purged. So there is a time limit on who gets through before the lock is in.

Racial equality I think is already through the lock, the end of modernity is a return to tradition and the christian traditon isn't actually a big fan of racial segergation. So I think blacks, hispanics, asians, ect will all be just fine.

Gay marrage I think gives the gay community a chance to get in and become assimulated, the pride parades and the exesses will be a thing of the past but gay people I think have a chance of getting through.

Transpeople though...that is a sticky one their on the tail end right at the end of modernity and are allied to an establishment that is pissing off pretty much every one with their activists being the vanguard of this establishment. There is a chance they will be fine but I think those odds are slim.

honestly it's not the end of modernity i'm afraid of so much as the beginning of bizzaro-Modernity where we will see people so desperate to course correct they will try to return to what they think is tradition but ends up being it's own set of social expermentation or worse yet the (same old cultural marxism) in a nostalgic skin suit appealing to a different demographic.

Basically, i'm afraid that it's not a question of if we are doomed or not, it's a question of do you want to or be made into a vegetable. Neither option is appealing. (Though frankly I would rather go out swinging than live in slavery while being told "Hey at least our boot is more comfortaable than the other guys. Do you want to go back to those times?"

Basically if modernity is 1984 my fear is the post modernity backlash is going to be animal farm. "Sure, your crushed under our boot, and we'll throw you away like garbage when it politically or socially suits us, but things are so much better than we were when under Mr Jones (modernity)." We all know how that story goes. Or at least we should. if not, I'll quote it.

"The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which."

As far as trangenderism goes, I think the issue is that the ones who are very loud about being a trans tend to be very hostile to the ones who are not openly praising them. I think the ones whom are stable and want to integrate probably just want to pass as the gender they transitioned. There is no telling how many trans people i've actually met on the street because I just assumed they were the gender they transitioned to. That's probably how they prefer it.

The that I fear maybe on the rise is that the rainbow warriors have rubbed everyone so raw, there is going to be an inherit since of paranoia and social distrust. Which hey I've said myself that humans are tribal creatures not social creatures (At least social in the modern sense) but just because humans are inherently animals when left to their own devices doesn't mean that we should embrace said animal tendencies. If we did, we would have never gotten out of the caves and kept our sense of self. We've seen how easy it is to manipulate people and make them lose their self-awareness when in social isolation. heck I've had that experance when you are so isolated time and space kind of all blends together in a dreamlike blob. IT'S NOT FUN!!!

 

[Cherico]

honestly it's not the end of modernity i'm afraid of so much as the beginning of bizzaro-Modernity where we will see people so desperate to course correct they will try to return to what they think is tradition but ends up being it's own set of social expermentation or worse yet the (same old cultural marxism) in a nostalgic skin suit appealing to a different demographic.

Basically, i'm afraid that it's not a question of if we are doomed or not, it's a question of do you want to or be made into a vegetable. Neither option is appealing. (Though frankly I would rather go out swinging than live in slavery while being told "Hey at least our boot is more comfortaable than the other guys. Do you want to go back to those times?"

Basically if modernity is 1984 my fear is the post modernity backlash is going to be animal farm. "Sure, your crushed under our boot, and we'll throw you away like garbage when it politically or socially suits us, but things are so much better than we were when under Mr Jones (modernity)." We all know how that story goes. Or at least we should. if not, I'll quote it.




As far as trangenderism goes, I think the issue is that the ones who are very loud about being a trans tend to be very hostile to the ones who are not openly praising them. I think the ones whom are stable and want to integrate probably just want to pass as the gender they transitioned. There is no telling how many trans people i've actually met on the street because I just assumed they were the gender they transitioned to. That's probably how they prefer it.

The that I fear maybe on the rise is that the rainbow warriors have rubbed everyone so raw, there is going to be an inherit since of paranoia and social distrust. Which hey I've said myself that humans are tribal creatures not social creatures (At least social in the modern sense) but just because humans are inherently animals when left to their own devices doesn't mean that we should embrace said animal tendencies. If we did, we would have never gotten out of the caves and kept our sense of self. We've seen how easy it is to manipulate people and make them lose their self-awareness when in social isolation. heck I've had that experance when you are so isolated time and space kind of all blends together in a dreamlike blob. IT'S NOT FUN!!!

the end of the roman republic was sad and depressing but it was not the end of rome.

The next age will have problems it will not be perfect, there will be good things and bad things about it.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

the end of the roman republic was sad and depressing but it was not the end of rome.

The next age will have problems it will not be perfect, there will be good things and bad things about it.

true but here's a dirty little secret. the world ends when you die. From there it's judgment day and either an eternity in Hell or Heaven.

 

[Cherico]

true but here's a dirty little secret. the world ends when you die.

death comes for all of us Kilroy, you make the best of what time your given, personally if my life has helped make some one elses life less shit then it will have been worth it.