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Transgender Athletes in Sports

ShadowsOfParadox

Well-known member
If we made a competitive twenty inch diameter pipe crawling event, men would lose hard to toddlers. I find little merit in such efforts.
...Men's Gymnastics is about stuff like "how high can you get?" Women's Gymnastics is more "what angles can you get your body into". Both are valid interpretations, but also different.

And the Channel Swimming record is 42 hours of nonstop swimming for a consecutive triple cross.

Again, there's plenty of value in Women's Athletics even compared to Men's as soon as you go outside arena sports.
 

posh-goofiness

Well-known member
...Men's Gymnastics is about stuff like "how high can you get?" Women's Gymnastics is more "what angles can you get your body into". Both are valid interpretations, but also different.

And the Channel Swimming record is 42 hours of nonstop swimming for a consecutive triple cross.

Again, there's plenty of value in Women's Athletics even compared to Men's as soon as you go outside arena sports.
*shrug* Okay, that value is?
 
Even if men and women can't compete with each other on a 1:1 ratio there are men out there who enjoy seeing women function at peak capacity. Keep in mind that physical strength is not just used for combat, but also for working around the property and even for well...sex. Jessica Rabbit and Marolyn Manroe maybe nice fantasies to have when you need a bit of a release, but just because you have assets doesn't mean you'd be a good helpmate, especially when the field needs plowing, and the cows need milking. Remember that Gina Carano has an army of simps.... I mean fans. :LOL:
 
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Whitestrake Pelinal

Like a dream without a dreamer
...You literally ignored the entire context of that line including the rest of the post.

Nice bad faith debating, not gonna bother further.
You literally made no argument other than "literally the same value as in mens" and "some people like to see peak performance". It's like you're speaking in word salad, "something something context, something something bad faith", and figure if you just throw enough of them out there, your inability to articulate your position in a credible fashion will be forgotten.

Face it, almost nobody gives a damn about women's peak performance in athletics, and it shows when they start throwing leftist hissyfits over unequal pay. They can't get paid a fraction of what men do for the same activities, unless it is through political action.
 

Wilykit

Well-known member
Alot of people do "give a damn" about women's athletics. Now I'm not talking about at the professional level. At the amateur/High School level it's very important to alot of people.
 

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
Lia Thomas had that big preliminary race against NCAA Swimmers from across the country. This was a big deal since it was the first time she'd compete for a NCAA Swimming Title.

Here is Lia Thomas pictured with the first, second and third place winners in the Women's 500 meter swimming event on the right of the podium.

FOI0k73WUAMXhvT


Virginia Freshman/First Year Swimmer Emma Leyant (a silver medalist in the 2021 Olympics) was surpassed by Lia Thomas by a margin of 1.75 seconds with a time of 4:34.99. Erica Sullivan, a first year out of Texas (hence the hat) took third with a time of 4:35.92. In fourth place and also pictured above is Stanford swimmer Brooke Ford, a fifth year student and another Olympian.


 
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bintananth

behind a desk
Lia Thomas had that big preliminary race against NCAA Swimmers from across the country. This was a big deal since it was the first time she'd compete for a NCAA Swimming Title.

Here is Lia Thomas pictured with the first, second and third place winners in the Women's 500 meter swimming event on the right of the podium.

FOI0k73WUAMXhvT


Virginia Freshman/First Year Swimmer Emma Leyant (a silver medalist in the 2021 Olympics) was surpassed by Lia Thomas by a margin of 1.75 seconds with a time of 4:34.99. Erica Sullivan, a first year out of Texas (hence the hat) took third with a time of 4:35.92. In fourth place and also pictured above is Stanford swimmer Brooke Ford, a fifty year student and another Olympian.


He can't go toe-to-toe with men his size and prefers to "win" against athletic women who are probably about 4-5" shorter and 40lbs lighter ... on a good day.

A 12 year old boy is probably about the same size as his mom. He still has a long way to go before he's as big and strong as his dad.

I have no issues with someone saying "I'm trans" (one of my nephews is FtM trans). I have serious issues with someone trans competing in events where the biological differences between men and women do matter.

My trans nephew has been told that he is not allowed to compete in athletic competions. Practice with those who do compete? Sure. Go for the trophy? Nope, don't even think about it.
 
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Large_Farva

Liter-a cola
Lia Thomas had that big preliminary race against NCAA Swimmers from across the country. This was a big deal since it was the first time she'd compete for a NCAA Swimming Title.

Here is Lia Thomas pictured with the first, second and third place winners in the Women's 500 meter swimming event on the right of the podium.

FOI0k73WUAMXhvT


Virginia Freshman/First Year Swimmer Emma Leyant (a silver medalist in the 2021 Olympics) was surpassed by Lia Thomas by a margin of 1.75 seconds with a time of 4:34.99. Erica Sullivan, a first year out of Texas (hence the hat) took third with a time of 4:35.92. In fourth place and also pictured above is Stanford swimmer Brooke Ford, a fifty year student and another Olympian.



Still a level playing field, the advantage in limb length and muscle mass is counterbalanced by the hydrodynamic dick drag.

He can't go toe-to-toe with men his size and prefers to "win" against athletic women who are probably about 4-5" shorter and 40lbs lighter ... on a good day.

A 12 year old boy is probably about the same size as his mom. He still has a long way to go before he's as big and strong as his dad.

I have no issues with someone saying "I'm trans" (one of my nephews is FtM trans). I have serious issues with someone trans competing in events where the biological differences between men and women do matter.

My trans nephew has been told that he is not allowed to compete in athletic competions. Practice with those who do compete? Sure. Go for the trophy? Nope, don't even think about it.

Your first sentence is something that I've seen people say before and it's just not something that I can buy into. The changes that transition wreaks on the body isn't something I can imagine any male who liked being male would be willing to undergo in order to be competitive in a lesser field. Reduce his performance as a whole, in order to join a group of competitors who aren't as strong or as fast, in a league that gets less attention than the one he left. And all it will cost him is his body, his face his voice and his cock'n'balls. It just doesn't make any sense.

To the second point, about FtM trans people, I don't really see any issue with them competing in male leagues. They're coming in at a disadvantage, which might not be great for them but it's not like they're throwing off the curve by coming in from a higher average level of performance.
 

ShadowsOfParadox

Well-known member
Your first sentence is something that I've seen people say before and it's just not something that I can buy into.
I see that you've never had the pleasure of playing an MMO with open world PvP where a max level player can wander into low-mid level zones and oneshot all the nublets trying to quest. Some people cannot be reasoned with, they just want to win, and the level of competition does not matter.

Are any of the current MtF athletes MtF purely to win... I mean, a suprising number of them are, well, kind of old. I dunno if they are, I'm not sure how'd you'd prove it without violating medical ethics, and I don't think there's any reason to actually bother with proving it because the simple fact is, they shouldn't be permitted regardless.
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
Still a level playing field, the advantage in limb length and muscle mass is counterbalanced by the hydrodynamic dick drag.



Your first sentence is something that I've seen people say before and it's just not something that I can buy into. The changes that transition wreaks on the body isn't something I can imagine any male who liked being male would be willing to undergo in order to be competitive in a lesser field. Reduce his performance as a whole, in order to join a group of competitors who aren't as strong or as fast, in a league that gets less attention than the one he left. And all it will cost him is his body, his face his voice and his cock'n'balls. It just doesn't make any sense.

To the second point, about FtM trans people, I don't really see any issue with them competing in male leagues. They're coming in at a disadvantage, which might not be great for them but it's not like they're throwing off the curve by coming in from a higher average level of performance.
Goldman's Dilemma. This is a classic question and its results have been repeated many, many times over several decades. More than half of athletes questioned said they would take a drug guaranteed to kill them in five years if it also guaranteed gold medals along the way. The idea that at least some of those people would be willing to suffer merely the effects of transition for a guaranteed win isn't remotely a stretcher.
 
This is a classic question and its results have been repeated many, many times over several decades. More than half of athletes questioned said they would take a drug guaranteed to kill them in five years if it also guaranteed gold medals along the way. The idea that at least some of those people would be willing to suffer merely the effects of transition for a guaranteed win isn't remotely a stretcher.

Crap like that is part of the reason why I have a hard time taking most sports seriously when it comes to a religious following. Call me a skeptic but I can't help but think that many of the same people poo pa women's sports would not care about drug use among athletes if it wasn't out in the open and impossible to ignore
 

ShadowsOfParadox

Well-known member
Goldman's Dilemma. This is a classic question and its results have been repeated many, many times over several decades. More than half of athletes questioned said they would take a drug guaranteed to kill them in five years if it also guaranteed gold medals along the way. The idea that at least some of those people would be willing to suffer merely the effects of transition for a guaranteed win isn't remotely a stretcher.
...Did you actually read the article you posted? Back when the question was first asked, yes. When they repeated it in recent years it dropped down to "12% would take it if it was illegal and otherwise harmless" and far less would take it if it was lethal.
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
...Did you actually read the article you posted? Back when the question was first asked, yes. When they repeated it in recent years it dropped down to "12% would take it if it was illegal and otherwise harmless" and far less would take it if it was lethal.
Please, please tell me you're joking and not actually that naive. Please tell me you didn't take everything in a Wikipedia article at face value without investigating. Please?

The Connor study is a laughingstock, nevermind that they manage to decide fewer people were willing to dope consequence-free than we know actually dope in real life. They somehow concluded that athletes don't become shyer about admitting to doping when the results aren't anonymous, which is the kind of thing that should raise any statistician's eyebrows up past their hairline and immediately question what's wrong with their methodology (specifically, the Connor Methodology wasn't designed at all to give anonymity to the respondents compared with the one I linked above, which naturally wrecked any chance of honesty from respondents). This isn't too surprising, that study wasn't done by people associated with sports or medicine but by a business school. But the results fit the narrative of athletes somehow having moved past doping (just ignore the steady stream of scandals) so...
 

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