Meme Thread for Both Posting and Discussing Memes

bintananth

bintananth

behind a desk
LordsFire said:
This is utterly historically ignorant.

The Japanese leadership were racist ethno-supremacists. They believed they had a divine right to rule the world, and as they amply demonstrated, they were not willing to give up without being forced to give up.

Are you aware of just how ready they were to fight to their nation's absolute destruction?
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Yes, I am aware of how far some Japanese "leaders" were willing to go ... up to and including a plot to kidnap and replace the Emperor when they got wind of the pending Japanese nearly unconditional surrender.

Note my caveat: "without racisism"
 
Whitestrake Pelinal

Whitestrake Pelinal

Like a dream without a dreamer
mczglshejdw.png


In other news, some of Blizzard's rockstar gammabois are now accused of practicing the wrong sort of 'game':
www.pcgamer.com

Activision Blizzard lawsuit alleges discrimination, sexual harassment, and 'frat boy' culture

A spokesperson has responded to deny the accusations.
www.pcgamer.com www.pcgamer.com

Edit: realized there was an even better stonetoss for this one:
doom-slayer-story-time-comic.png
 
Husky_Khan

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
bintananth said:
History is weird.

Prior to and during WWI the Japanese were the best Asian ally a European power could hope for. They offered to join WWI on the British side less than a week after the British got dragged in, were at war with Germany within three, and sent the first naval airstrikes ever towards Germans in the Pacific roughly two weeks later.
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They also didn't offer any significant Naval Forces to the actual Western Front until 1916 at the earliest and that wasn't until extensive negotiations and angling for support and never, despite many requests, sending more substantial support like troops to the European theaters.

Japan did offer economic support to the Allies in WW1, like helping finance and arm the Russians most notably before the 1916 Brusilov Offensive, but the militarists and rest of the government during World War One spent more of their time arguing and bickering with each other trying to gain more influence and power in the Far East and China to the point of undercutting each others efforts.

And then American racisism basically went and said "Us, or them. You can't have both as allies." to the British.
Click to expand...

No it was called the Washington Treaty and Four Party Treaty, which averted any major conflict or Crisis in the Far East (or basically anywhere) for the next 15-20 years. Early discussions regarding the Washington Treaty had Japan desiring a ratio of 10-10-7 in warships while America wanted 10-10-5 because... hey... Britain and the United States are both two ocean Navies while Japan was a one ocean navy and yet Japan and Britain are allies... bit odd yes? And Britain, sensibly because they didn't want war with America or an Arms Race with them they couldn't afford, got everyone to sign the Washington Naval Treaty and setting the limits to 5-5-3. And then the Anglo-Japanese Treaty wasn't an "Us or Them" due to "Racism" or as you call it 'racisism' but replaced by something called the FOUR POWER TREATY where instead of having an Anglo-Japanese Alliance, you had the four major Imperialist Powers of the Far East (Britain, France, United States and Japan) agreeing to talk out shit and not making war on each other.

Peace is racism!!!

As for American RACISM causing the War with Japan, keep in mind despite Japan doing kinda the bare minimum militarily to support Britain (a lot of the Japanese militarists were pre-Wehraboos actually) they practically greeted the German POW's they captured at Tsingtao with 'Banzai' chants after that arduous eight week campaign in 1914, the Americans were actually extremely conciliatory towards Japan. They helped prevent further conflict with the Treaty of Portsmouth ending the Russo-Japanese War, the President of Taft and T. Roosevelt both had extensive military and cultural exchanges, and after World War One Theodore Roosevelt wrote a glowingly embellished (and somewhat non-factual) inflated account of how Japan helped in the Great War due to a large amount of questions popping up circling around the idea that Japan didn't do much called Japans Part.

Other examples of American racist conciliatory nature towards Japan include overlooking the genro elder statesmen on the Japanese cabinet were publicly advocating war against the United States, such as the infamous statements by Tanaka Giichi, the real foreign minister during World War One, who planned as early as 1907 in the Basic War Plan advocating an early strike on the United States, a 1916 forum of Japanese political and military leaders discussing the inevitability of war due to American "belligerence" in China and the Philippines, forgiving Japan for multiple "friendly fire" incidents/accidents on American troops in Siberia in the 1920's, escalate a diplomatic crisis during the dispute of ownership over the island of Yap when the Japanese made a large naval demonstration to intimidate the Americans but thankfully resulted in a 1922 Treaty of Cooperation and so on and so forth.

And Japan would've been a terrible ally, especially post-1926.

Could you imagine if the Anglo-British Alliance held after that?
May 1928
Japan: Oh Hai Friends!
Britain: Oh hey Japan. How are you doing?
Japan: Doing okay. The Chinese... they uhhh... they uhhh... attacked us so we retaliated.
Britain: Oh dear. That sounds dreadful.
Japan: Ya it's okay now though. Only a few people died... and a Chinese diplomat was hurt.
Britain: Hurt?
Japan: Uhhhh yeah he accidentally had his nose, ears and eyes cut out... and was machine gunned to death on the lawn of the negotiation headquarters.
Britain: ...
Japan: His staff died too... and all of the soldiers with them. It made negotiations difficult since they are all dead. 😢
Britain: That's inexcusable-
Japan: We also bombarded the city of Jinan with artillery.
Britain: ?!
Japan: Don't worry, the Chinese apologized to us already for their transgressions! No harm, no foul! 😁

September 1931
Japan: Hey Britain... you awake?
Britain: Oh Japan... what is it?
Japan: Chinese attacked our railroad in Manchuko. Thankfully there were no casualties.
Britain: Well that's good. Let me send a delegation to-
Japan: So we invaded Manchuria and annexed it! 😁
Britain: WHAT?

October 1932
Japan: Why you hurt my feelings with Lytton Commission best friends?
Britain: Manchuria should be returned to China Japan.
Japan: Oh we can't best friends. It is independent country of Manchukuo now. :sneaky:
Britain: *sighs*

June 1935
Japan: Hello best friends! We support your new treaty with zee Germans. 35:100 sounds good. Fuck those French amirite?

November 1935
Britain: We want you to support us against Italy for invading Ethiopia.
Japan: Oh hai friends! Okay!
Britain: Really?
Japan: We will have Imperial Guards regiment ready to take Italian Concession in Shanghai!
Britain: No. No. Sanctions!
Japan: Sanct-tions? That sounds like bad word. How about we invade Somalia... 2gether uWu?
Britain: You know if you gave back Manchuria this wouldn't of happened.
Japan: How dare you turn this on us. We could crush your puny Empire in the Far East in six months best friends!
Britain: What?!
Japan: I love you! xoxoxoxo

July 1937
Japan: Oh no friends! Horrible Chinese attacked us at Marco Polo bridge! I think we need to declare war on them best friends!
Britain: We have some issues in Europe atm. I don't think a war with China is in our best interests right now?
Japan: Ohhhhh I see. We're not Western Allies. Fine we go alone then. What is 35 years of friendship anyways right allies? 🤷‍♀️

December 1937
Britain: Japan. Did you just Rape Nanking?
Japan: Oh sorry... this is an A vs B conflict. C you later. *CLICK*

December 1937
Japan: Oh no Britain! Britain! Wake up best friend allies!
Britain: What now?
Japan: You would support us if America attacks us right.
Britain: What did you do?
Japan: We kinda shot a US Gunboat. 😰
Britain: ...
Japan: And by kinda I mean repeatedly... and by shot I mean strafed and bombed repeatedly including lifeboats.
Britain: *sighs*
Japan: Can we have more oil please? uWu

May 1939
Britain/Japan: I need your help now!
Japan: Sorry best friends. You go first!
Britain: Can you sign an alliance with France and us against Germany?
Japan: YES!
Britain: Oh... kay... that was easy. What did you need help with?
Japan: Can you declare war on Soviet Union with us? 🤪
Britain: WHAT?
Japan: Maybe just give us like five thousand trucks. And a thousand tanks? And a couple railroads? And several million barrels of oil then?

September 3rd 1939
Japan: We declared war on Nazi Germany for you best friends! uWu
Britain: Thank you Japan. We could use all the help we can get.
Japan: Yes we have plan to capture Vladivostok! It is called Hokushin-ron! Royal Marines can help us! uWu
Britain: We're at war with Germany, not Soviet Union.

September 17th 1939
Japan: Oh HAI friends. About that War with the Soviet Union...
Britain: Japan... not now... please!
Japan: Bomb-Bomb-Bomb Bomb-Bomb Baku?
Britain: *click*

December 1939
Japan: Oh no! Soviet Union attacked Finland best friends? What should we do? 🤭
Britain: Just send an expeditionary force to France please.

April 1940
Britain: We could really use that Carrier Division you have in the North Atlantic for supporting our Narvik Operations.
Japan: What Carrier Division?
Britain: The one we sighted docked in Greenland.
Japan: Oh that's not a Carrier Division. That's a Seaplane Tender Task Force. We're building a Seaplane base in Greenland for our British best friends.
Britain: Well Denmark should appreciate the protection.
Japan: Denmark???

May 1940
Britain: We're invading Iceland. If you could send your seaplanes to scout out-
Japan: Tell your Iceland Ambassador to look out his window and tell me what he sees.
Britain: IS THAT A CARRIER DIVISION?
Japan: No it's a SEAPLANE TENDER TASK FORCE! We already invaded Iceland and made another Seaplane base! Go home friends. We got this!
Britain: *&#%!

July 3rd 1940
Japan: Nice work at Mers el-Kebir best friends!

August 1940
Japan: We invaded French Indochina!
Britain: WHAT?
Japan: It was owned by Vichy France. They are allies of Nazi Germany. We thought you would be happy best friends. We did this for you!
Britain: DeGaulle won't like this.
Japan: Who?
Britain: The Leader of the Free French?
Japan: WHO??
Britain: THE FRENCH THAT ARE ON OUR SIDE!
Japan: Also we build a seaplane base in New Caledonia. Don't worry, there was no resistance this time!
Britain: New Caledonia is Free French!
Japan: Yeah I know, we just liberated them. 😎

July 1941
Britain: So if you could send just a single armored brigade to North Africa that would be great...
Japan: Too late! We send a whole Army to Africa!
Britain: You did??
Japan: uWu we landed in Somaliland! Surprise best friends! We are going to liberate East Africa for us!
Britain: With us you mean?
Japan: What did I say?

December 1941
Japan: Great news best buddies! I got you a big Christmas gift!
Britain: A division of mechanized troops?
Japan: NO. Thailand is on our side now.
Britain: Uhhhh okay...? That's good.
Japan: Yeah lol. They barely fought back when we invaded! uWu
Britain: Japan...

May 1942
Britain: So we're thinking of an Invasion of French North Africa. Think you could free up some of your eight million man Army and two hundred ship Navy to help us?
Japan: Our forces are already in the Indian Ocean.
Britain: Oh really?
Japan: Yes we are already invading French Africa!
Britain: That's great! A surprise attack?
Japan: YUS! Madagascar fell before they even knew what hit them.
Britain: I said NORTH AFRICA.
Japan: If your going to act like that then no Martinique for you!
Britain: You didn't...
Japan: It's our best Seaplane Base YET! We can wave at America from our floatplanes now! uWu

May 1945
Britain: Thank you everybody for all of the help in defeating Nazi Germany. America. Soviet Union. France.
Japan: OH HAI EVERYBODY!
Britain: Japan. Thanks for liberating Svalberd by the way. Bet it's a lovely seaplane base you made there... 😒
Japan: uWu! Your funny! It's only a Weather Station! Anyways now that we defeated Germany, now we only have one more foe to finish the fight against.
Britain: What are you talking about?
Japan: CHINA!
Britain: Wait. You were at War with them the ENTIRE TIME?
Japan: Oh best friends! We've been waiting so patiently while helping you! If only you helped us when we asked, we could've helped you even more. Now it is time for you to reciprocate! 🤗
Britain: ...
 
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bintananth

bintananth

behind a desk
@Husky_Khan,

Japan, from c.1610-ish onwards was sorta the country equivalent of a hermit who would prefer it if you didn't stop by to say "hi" unannounced and who only heads into town when he needs to buy something.

Do not bother him and he will not bother you.

In the 1850s the US knocked on the front door and effectively said "you're letting us in and we are 'the thing that will not leave'."

The kinds of unequal treaties the West was able to force on China were not forced on Japan because they effectively joined the party instead of being subjected to it.
 
S'task

S'task

Renegade Philosopher
Administrator
Staff Member
Founder
bintananth said:
@Husky_Khan,

Japan, from c.1610-ish onwards was sorta the country equivalent of a hermit who would prefer it if you didn't stop by to say "hi" unannounced and who only heads into town when he needs to buy something.

Do not bother him and he will not bother you.

In the 1850s the US knocked on the front door and effectively said "you're letting us in and we are 'the thing that will not leave'."

The kinds of unequal treaties the West was able to force on China were not forced on Japan because they effectively joined the party instead of being subjected to it.
Click to expand...
It's a lot more nuanced than that, and one of the major reasons the unequal treaties Japan had (and they did have some) were not as bad as the ones with China is that the US' offer to open Japan were so good that the Europeans actively complained to the US that they were being to nice to Japan.

Heck, the initial reaction to the United State's overtures to Japan via Perry and later were actually not all that hostile, even the strident isolationists conceded some of what America wanted were perfectly legitimate things to come asking for they just wanted to work within the already existing framework for dealing with foreign powers that was already in place.

Because, in most respects, the idea that Japan was a hermit kingdom completely cut off from the outside world is completely wrong. Japan actually had a longstanding regular European trading partner that was fully allowed to trade in Japan: the Netherlands. They were limited to a few cities, but they regularly traded with the Japanese and brought news and information from around the world to the Japanese, who kept careful track of it. The Japanese were WELL informed of what was happening in China via these trade links, and knew they wanted to avoid it.

Heck, what the US wanted from the Japanese was actually not even that onerous. They wanted guaranteed safety and aid for shipwrecked sailors*, a series of coaling stations along the coast that the US would pay for and build (remember, pre-oil ships, so coaling stations were required for long distance trading and the US, unlike Europeans, was coming the long way across the Pacific), being allowed to trade in the foreign trading cities, and finally that American citizens not be subject to local laws**. They didn't try and carve out exclusivity deals (after all, they couldn't anyway, the Dutch already had longstanding treaties), didn't try and force the government to change to accommodate them, and didn't try to force them to buy opium.

To say that the relationship between the US and Japan was heavily based on American racism seems... counterfactual to history. The US tended to treat Japan very well throughout the late 19th and first couple of decades of the 20th century, and up until the 1930s the relationship between the two countries was actually considered very good, though I will grant many in California did not want them immigrating to the US. But from the 1870s to the 1920s there were many major overtures of friendship and cultural exchange between the two countries that belie the idea that the US' relationship with Japan was dominated by racism, with considerable gift exchanges and agreements at high levels.

-------------
* No joke, even the most strident isolationists in the the government took one look at this and basically said: "oh sure, guarantee that, we'll even help get them to the trading ports and hand them over to the Dutch who can get them back home!"

** This last one sounds onerous and terrible, but bear in mind the Japanese legal system at the time included more than a few things that would cause ANY government to balk at allowing its citizens to go there: Samurai being allowed to randomly execute anyone of lower caste at their whim, and strict prohibitions against Christianity (to say nothing of what would be considered Due Process). Understandable, the US balked at letting American citizens be subject to such laws, but at the same time, such exceptions were easily (and often) abused.
 
VicSage

VicSage

Carpenter, Cobbler, Chirugeon, Dataminer.
Who uses plasma anymore? It's all about LCD's these days, and you can get them near 60 inches for less than half a grand.
 
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