If they think tanks will be able to catch up to the VDV fairly quick, it makes a bit of sense; a gamble for sure, but not an unreasonable one.
Dropping troops so that they end up in freezing water and drowning is a whole other sort of fuck-up.
Russian Invasion of Ukraine 2022
- Thread starter killerofa23
- Start date
Dropping troops so that they end up in freezing water and drowning is a whole other sort of fuck-up.
King Arts
Well-known member
Is there a source on that? Aren’t the VDV elite like our rangers? I mean do they even have 1000 of them? Losing 50 would be a big deal.
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
So you lost your faith over propaganda claims that were never proven? Rather unsurprising I must say.
There was stuff about it...maybe 10 pages ago at this point.
VDV are Russian paratroopers, not exactly a Ranger analog, more of a 82nd Airborne analog.
They've lost a few planes full of paratroopers on ingress, and the bad drop off the Black Sea coast, plus whatever losses they've had on the ground. So I do expect the VDV have seen their highest losses in a while, but how big the unit is and how much they've lost is still unknown.
Another Twitter Sperg!
Apparently destroyed Ukrainian military vehicles in the Donbass.
Farmers allegedly towing away a Russian Buk Air Defense Missile System.
Alledged aftermath of an ambush of Russian vehicles by Ukrainian SOF. Video in the comments.
A Ukranian military base in West Central Ukraine burning after Russian missile strikes.
Russian State Media supposedly alledging the Ukranians struck their own building in Kharkov
Apparently destroyed Ukrainian military vehicles in the Donbass.
Farmers allegedly towing away a Russian Buk Air Defense Missile System.
Alledged aftermath of an ambush of Russian vehicles by Ukrainian SOF. Video in the comments.
A Ukranian military base in West Central Ukraine burning after Russian missile strikes.
Russian State Media supposedly alledging the Ukranians struck their own building in Kharkov
I think Glenn's overstating the risk a bit. People feel upset and helpless and want to do something to address that, and will look to what they can control to try to and restore a sense of control. In most cases, that's something trivial, the world will go on just fine if there's two fewer films at some film festival in Scotland or whatever. At worst, that kind of behavior just leads to people changing thier FB profile picture and then not doing anything more useful, because they feel like they're already doing thier part.
Corporate censorship is a bit different, but there's still a difference between youtube blocking state owned Russian media as a punative response to Russia's actions, and them clamping down on what private citizens say in order to fight "misinformation".
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
And somehow nobody is able to find the crash sites.
Which despite supposed multiple eyewitnesses, no one has filmed or photographed and nothing at all has been recovered.
Except it's more than that; it's literally punishing people for being Russian, regardless of what they think about what Putin has done, regardless of where they are living, and disinviting them from events/cutting them off from their international associations for things they have no control over.
Do I need to explain how that sort of mentality, in the current times, seems rather worrying and could lead to it being used against more than just Russia or Russian citizens?
Because of things like the trucker protests getting cut off from their bank accounts, people being censored for outing info about the Wu Flu that goes against Fauci's narrative, etc.
We can condemn what Putin is doing without punishing innocent people or increasing censorship/info control.
I mean shit, we are seeing Russia and Russians being treated far worse than the CCP and Uighyr situation, despite that being an actual genocide, for which China got the fucking Olympic games.
Because the drop happend at night. I have yet to see Russia deny these claims.
The US confirmed two full IL-76s destroyed in the air
It makes people turn further against thier government.
Maybe it can turn the Russian people against Putin, but I would not count on it; I think that is a gamble that is likely to not pan out and hurt a lot of innocents in the mean time.
These sorts of actions, when were ares till dealing with the Wu Flu bullshit/lies pushed by Fauci, and have just watched a trucker protest cause Trudeau to debank them and declare a state of emergency to justify treating said truckers like terrorists, while seeing the likes of FB and Twitter bury the shit about Hunter Biden's laptop over 'hacked materials', yet they let 'hacked materials' stay up if it hurt their ideological opponents.
Trying to justify increasing censorship, info control, collective punishment, and destruction of civil rights/liberties in the name of 'Putin bad' is not acceptable.
Edit: Not to mention that frankly with the amount of propaganda being thrown around these days by 'official' sources, no one should trust any government or media with dictating 'truth' or 'facts'.
I mean, there have been plenty of kids killed
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
So nobody saw it, everybody knows about it because Ukraine pulled it out of the ass like the Ghost of Kiev and Russians don't bother denying because it's ludicrous and you can't prove the negative.
The US intelligence will confirm everything it is told to confirm, be it Iraqi WMDs or Trump being Russian puppet.
There have been plenty of kids killed in Iraq and Bush still got the second term.
Apparently the VDV attempted a heliborbe operation at Mykolaiv which is on the way to Odessa IIRC.
Alleged picture of some of the POWs taken.
Some of my favorite Tim Pool takes was how he loathes "Appeals to Emotion" in an earlier Zelensky speech. Or how Zelensky may have been doing a Black Power or Fascist Salute when all Zelensky did was raise a fist in the air. Imma gonna have to look those up.
Alleged picture of some of the POWs taken.
Some of my favorite Tim Pool takes was how he loathes "Appeals to Emotion" in an earlier Zelensky speech. Or how Zelensky may have been doing a Black Power or Fascist Salute when all Zelensky did was raise a fist in the air. Imma gonna have to look those up.
Chiron
Well-known member
None of which was proven, and rapidly disproven by fact checkers and other videos.
Fact is the VDV Hostomel Assault was a success and held on till relieved. Ukraine failed to show any evidence to the contrary.
Westerners have been spoiled by the experiences of the US Colonial Wars fought post-Vietnam. They place way too much emphasis on tactical brilliance by fireteams and less emphasis on Operational Art needed to defeat an Industrial State with a large professional conscript army trained in mass maneuver warfare.
Russian Generals are not stupid, they played the Counter-Insurgency game in Afghanistan and won and built a capable state that actually outlived the Soviet State unlike the one we built which collapsed before we even left. They also won every proxy war they fought against the US in South East Asia and Africa. And if the Arab States had had competent leaders, probably would have won the proxy wars there as well. The current crop of Russian Generals all fought in that war and saw the mess of 1st Chechnya when the cohesion of the Army was broken by the breakup of the Soviet Union. They then rebuilt the Russian Army and won 2nd Chechnya and went on to win Georgia and rescue Assad and seize Crimea and leave Ukraine weak.
They also know the Ukrainian Generals attended the same Soviet Academies they did.
So they accepted losses in the 1st echelons in order to keep the Ukrainians from mobilizing which would have pushed the death tolls higher on both sides.
Tactical reverses in their mind are irrelevant so long as operational objectives were achieved. The propaganda war was also irrelevant and in fact aided them. both pre-war and during the war.
Fact is, the Russians are winning the war where it matters. On the battlefield and in the heads of the only people who matter, the Ukrainians.
US Military lost all credibility with Iraq and Afghanistan. Their word is worthless and MSM should stop putting retired and current US Generals who lost their wars on air to talk about the Ukrainian War. Especially Petraeus.
Wargamer08
Well-known member
Here is three dudes from what should be a couple dozen. Also they have zero identification patches or anything totally trust us they are what they say? Man at least with the equipment tweets, they are mostly actually the equipment they say. Sometimes the wrong year, but no one is perfect.
Yeah, it sucks to be them right now, sure. So what? Are they living hand to mouth, desperately hoping they'll make enough money at this film festival so thry can afford to eat this month? Because if they're not, I don't care. A few people getting temporarily inconvenienced because other people needed a punching bag isn't a big deal.
Glenn's own example bears this out, pointing to anti-French sentiment in the US back in 2003. How long did that last? A couple months, maybe a year?
All the stuff you're complaining about is different (top-down authoritharian attempts to stifle dissent vs grassroots attempt to resolve a sense of helplessness), and predates the anti-russian stuff to boot, so I'm not clear on how it's supposed to relate at all.
No, we can't. This sort of behavior has been a constant throughout history, the desire to feel like you're empowered and in control of your life is deeply embedded into the human psyche.
Sure they are Timmy. The "it's just US warmongering, we gotta stop the warmongering" drumbeat was annoying enough before the invasion, it's gotten orders of magnitude more insufferable now that Russia has actually invaded and the West has repeatedly and at length insisted they will not intervene.
Russia either didn't win at COIN in Afghanistan, since the insurgency survived and toppled the government after the Russian's left, unless you define the goal of COIN to be merely suppressing the insurgents rather than eradicating them, in which case the US also won.
State building has nothing to do with military capabilities.
Er, not really. Militarily, the US consistently dominated, the issue was a lack of political will to continue, not a practical inability to keep fighting, a contest Russia won because they were an authoritarian state that didn't need to care about things like "do people actually want this", and since they were mostly providing weapons, equipment, and training rather than boots on the ground like the US, they faced even less pressure. But a victory due to political exhaustion is not at all the same thing as actual military success.
When they were thecones fighting our proxies in Afghanistan, it didn't exactly work out for them, now did it?
EDIT:
So when you win a proxy war, it's because Russia is great. When you lose one, it's because your proxies suck. Nice consistent standard you've got there.
If you're counting the 10+year long fiasco of syria a success for Russia, that explains a lot of your "Russia always won" rethoric, but also your poor judgement. No sane human being would look at Syria and go "yeah, this goes in the W column, big win for us here".
The US military accomplished everything it was asked to in the middle east. The US's failures at it's political projects doew not magically transform it's battlefield success into failure as a result.
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Floridaman
Well-known member
The same ioc that sucks off Beijing and helps cover up their atrocities? Forgive me for not caring about their ethics opinions.
