Warship Appreciation Thread

[Husky_Khan]

Diesel Electric Attack Submarines of the Colombian and Brazilian Navies Arriving in Florida for Naval Exercises. The Submarines are the Colombian ARC Tayrona, one of two 1970's era Type 209 Submarines operated by the Colombian Navy but underwent an extensive modernization between 2009-2013. The other vessel is the Brazilian BNS Tikuna. It too is a Type 209 style submarine but was domestically produced (Brazil's fourth) and launched just in 2005, their largest submarine built to date.



Also present is the USS Thomas Hudner, a Burke-class Destroyer named after a US Naval Aviator who was awarded the Medal of Honor during the Battle of Chosin Resevoir in the Korean War.

 

[bintananth]

Diesel Electric Attack Submarines of the Colombian and Brazilian Navies Arriving in Florida for Naval Exercises. The Submarines are the Colombian ARC Tayrona, one of two 1970's era Type 209 Submarines operated by the Colombian Navy but underwent an extensive modernization between 2009-2013. The other vessel is the Brazilian BNS Tikuna. It too is a Type 209 style submarine but was domestically produced (Brazil's fourth) and launched just in 2005, their largest submarine built to date.



Also present is the USS Thomas Hudner, a Burke-class Destroyer named after a US Naval Aviator who was awarded the Medal of Honor during the Battle of Chosin Resevoir in the Korean War.

Those two subs are going to be "fun" for the USN to track because, unlike a nuclear powered submarine, they can turn everything off and go completely silent.

EDIT: By everything, I mean everything. They can go so quiet that a sonarman will have to listen for things like the crew's heartbeats.

 

[paulobrito]

Well, if the USN really want fun times, just train against the much more advanced Type 214. All the advantages of these older 209, plus AIP, nonmagnetic hull, even more silent, and better sensors.

 

[bintananth]

Well, if the USN really want fun times, just train against the much more advanced Type 214. All the advantages of these older 209, plus AIP, nonmagnetic hull, even more silent, and better sensors.

The USN actually borrowed a Swedish Gotland-class diesel-electric sub with AIP and couldn't figure out how to track it once it went silent.

 

[Knowledgeispower]

The USN actually borrowed a Swedish Gotland-class diesel-electric sub with AIP and couldn't figure out how to track it once it went silent.

To be more accurate they couldn't do it with passive sonar not active and that was a fair few years ago. And diesel electric subs to be blunt aren't exactly dangerous outside being effectively mobile nines because the second they start moving with any speed....

 

[Bacle]

Sub 'stealth' only lasts so long as their target isn't doing active sonar pinging, which pretty much no one can evade if they are anywhere near the target.

 

[bintananth]

diesel electric subs to be blunt aren't exactly dangerous

Bullshit.

Keeping track of an obsolete sub which doesn't want to be found is an exercise in "where the fuck is she" because even a WWII-era sub can stay submerged and completely silent for, oh, I don't know, two days - possibly three - without making any noise.

 

[Knowledgeispower]

Bullshit.

Keeping track of an obsolete sub which doesn't want to be found is an exercise in "where the fuck is she" because even a WWII-era sub can stay submerged and completely silent for, oh, I don't know, two days - possibly three - without making any noise.

Hence why I said outside of being effectively at most a very very slow moving mine

 

[bintananth]

Hence why I said outside of being effectively at most a very very slow moving mine

Slow moving mines can't fire a spread of 4-10 torpedoes completely out of "Where the fuck did that come from?".

 

[paulobrito]

Depends on the play zone. Mid of an ocean? Yes, they are limited.
Baltic, Mediterranean, Persian Gulf, or Taiwan Strait? They are very, very deadly.

 

[LordSunhawk]

https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/06/16/Japan-Frigates.jpg?auto=webp&auto=webp&optimize=high&quality=70&width=1080

 

[BF110C4]

Sub 'stealth' only lasts so long as their target isn't doing active sonar pinging, which pretty much no one can evade if they are anywhere near the target.

But for many practical and enviromental reasons (active sonar + fish = sushi) ships don't go active without an actual threat. A diesel sub with good intel on a target can creep its way towards an expected route of a naval task force, go silent for a day or so and when it hears the ship coming they will have a chance to launch a good spread of torpedoes to the target and run the hell out of dodge.

Diesel subs are mostly defensive minded units intended to defend their home seas so in case of war they are intended to patrol their own sea lanes with the support of other aerial and naval assets so it increases the chances to do proper ambushes, as well as getting support so enemy ASW plataforms (helicopters and destroyers mostly) can't operate in the engagement area for long. Even on a sub vs sub action home advantage counts for a lot since its more probable that the diesel sub got better underwater surveys of their home seas and therefore they know the exact dept of their patrol areas as well as thermic layers to mask their sound.

 

[Sailor.X]

I will put this here.



Got to be better than the Train wreck that is the LCS Classes of ships.

 

[bintananth]

Even on a sub vs sub action

That's mostly drama.

The only time I know of where a submerged sub sank a submerged sub was when HMS Venturer sank U-864. It was mostly luck because if U-864 had been about 30ft deeper or shallower after evading three torpedoes the fourth one would have been a miss instead of a hit.

 

[Knowledgeispower]

That's mostly drama.

The only time I know of where a submerged sub sank a submerged sub was when HMS Venturer sank U-864. It was mostly luck because if U-864 had been about 30ft deeper or shallower after evading three torpedoes the fourth one would have been a miss instead of a hit.

To be fair that was with WWII era sonar and torpedoes

 

[paulobrito]

To be fair that was with WWII era sonar and torpedoes

If you take in consideration that in 1982 the UK nuclear submarine used WW2 torpedoes to kill the Belgrano...

 

[bintananth]

To be fair that was with WWII era sonar and torpedoes

The firing solution was also done by hand.

Sub-v-sub ain't what the movies portray.

 

[Knowledgeispower]

The firing solution was also done by hand.

Sub-v-sub ain't what the movies portray.

The best analogy I found was that its like two men in a pitch black room both armed with knives and have their ears(passive sonar) and a flashlight(active sonar) but using the flashlight tells both sides where the other is

 

[bintananth]

The best analogy I found was that its like two men in a pitch black room both armed with knives and have their ears(passive sonar) and a flashlight(active sonar) but using the flashlight tells both sides where the other is

Add a whole lot of clutter making the use of your flashight a terrible idea because you might be able to spot them while they can certainly see you when you turn it on because you just went "National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation" and lit up the entire ocean with "please shoot me".

EDIT: A British SSBN once collided with a French SSBN in the middle of the Atlantic because neither knew that the other one was nearby. Thankfully, it was a "fender bender" instead of "both are totalled".

 

[Bacle]