Trump's Attempt at Middle East Peace Plan for Palestine and Israel

Arch Dornan

Arch Dornan

Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
www.bbc.co.uk

Trump releases long-awaited Middle-East peace plan

The peace plan offers a Palestinian state but also hints at recognition of Israeli settlements.
www.bbc.co.uk

Another US president having another go at the quagmire of Israel and Palestine.

Points outlined as follows:

  • The US will recognise Israeli sovereignty over territory that Mr Trump's plan envisages being part of Israel. The plan includes a conceptual map that Mr Trump says illustrates the territorial compromises that Israel is willing to make
  • The map will "more than double the Palestinian territory and provide a Palestinian capital in eastern Jerusalem", where Mr Trump says the US would open an embassy. The Palestine Liberation Organisation (PLO) said Mr Trump's plan would give Palestinians control over 15% of what it called "historic Palestine".
  • Jerusalem "will remain Israel's undivided capital". Both Israel and the Palestinians hold competing claims to the holy city. The Palestinians insist that East Jerusalem, which Israel occupied in the 1967 Middle East war, be the capital of their future state.
  • An opportunity for Palestinians to "achieve an independent state of their very own" - however, he gave few details.
  • "No Palestinians or Israelis will be uprooted from their homes" - suggesting that existing Jewish settlements in the Israeli-occupied West Bank will remain.
  • Israel will work with the king of Jordan to ensure that the status quo governing the key holy site in Jerusalem known to Jews as the Temple Mount and al-Haram al-Sharif to Muslims is preserved. Jordan runs the religious trust that administers the site.
  • Territory allocated to Palestinians in Mr Trump's map "will remain open and undeveloped for a period of four years". During that time, Palestinians can study the deal, negotiate with Israel, and "achieve the criteria for statehood".
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@GoldRanger what's your take? I know the Palestinians are very stubborn like a gambler going for all or nothing with the Three No's but now their position is untenable. Former supporters in using them as a catspaw see them as more of a hindrance.

It looks like Trump's method in how he negotiates. Put out a list of points and wait for their response. When they inevitably disagree with the plan, Trump does something to twist their arm and finally bring them to the negotiating table.
 
Well, the current plan is seriously disadvantegous towards Palestinians, my guess is that this is intended to make the later compromise plan more palatable to them. The problem is that coruptocrats in Gaza and West Bank tied their legitimacy to resistance against Israel and indoctrinated the masses into fuhrtering the hatred, so they will turn it down, unless Trump manages to cut their (already dwindling) foreign funding.
 
Well, having watch the press conference where this was announced, I feel this has a better chance than not of succeeding.

My guess on the map is that Israel will give up land along the southern border with Egypt to expand Gaza south-eastwards, while retaining the West Bank and creating a permanent eastern border.

Or it could be a...very convoluted border with very weird contortions.

It will be interesting to see what the map looks like when it's released.
 
It won't work; for the simple reason that the "Palestinians" still think they can "win" the war of attrition they've been conducting for generations. In order for any attempt at peace between them and the Israelis to succeed, their will to fight must first be broken; unfortunately, nobody in the west has to stomach to allow such a thing to happen, even if more lives could be saved in the long run by doing so, and so this conflict will go on forever.

This is what happens when you let diplomats continue to make the decisions, when the time for diplomacy has long since been over.
 
It's quite simple, cut the foreign funding of Palestinian Authority. Their economy is soley based on foreign aid, without it they will kill eachother for remaining scraps, while leaders will flee to enjoy their rightfully stolen millions (what was Arafat's net worth, 1,5 billion$?) and rant about betrayal of the cause. After the killing is done the survivors will have to make a deal with Israel, to start economy almost from scratch.
 
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PsihoKekec said:
It's quite simple, cut the foreign funding of Palestinian Authority. Their economy is soley based on foreign aid, without it they will kill eachother for remaining scraps, while leaders will flee to enjoy their rightfully stolen millions (what was Arafat's net worth, 1,5 billion?) and rant about betrayal of the cause. After the killing is done the survivors will have to make a deal with Israel, to start economy almost from scratch.
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It's what I think of as well. Continuing an eternal war with no more gibs will cut down on the stubbornness.
 
You know Abbas is getting up there in years and it’s predicted there’ll be some sort of power struggle or civil war when he dies.

Or at least Hamas will retake control of the PA.

Once another round of fighting happens-the Palestinians will in a worse negotiating position and thus will likely be more willing to agree to a settlement.

But I could be wrong.
 
Lord Invictus said:
You know Abbas is getting up there in years and it’s predicted there’ll be some sort of power struggle or civil war when he dies.

Or at least Hamas will retake control of the PA.

Once another round of fighting happens-the Palestinians will in a worse negotiating position and thus will likely be more willing to agree to a settlement.

But I could be wrong.
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As long as they get UN funding for their infinite refugees Camp/indoctrination camp, the Palestinian will have the strength to keep going ad infinitum.
I understand that once upon a time, Nato nations didn’t wish to offend countries from the Middle-east by fear of pushing them into communists arms, but what is the excuse for leaving the mess as is nowadays?
 
Arlos said:
As long as they get UN funding for their infinite refugees Camp/indoctrination camp, the Palestinian will have the strength to keep going ad infinitum.
I understand that once upon a time, Nato nations didn’t wish to offend countries from the Middle-east by fear of pushing them into communists arms, but what is the excuse for leaving the mess as is nowadays?
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Oil.
 
Lord Invictus said:
But who gives a toss about the Palestinian cause these days?

Not Saudi Arabia and the people on top of Arab street.

Private donors? From where? Europe?
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The United Nations. I wish I was kidding. A huge part of the problem is that the UN peacekeepers run schools to help educate Palestinians, and the education is, well... not sure how long this will stay available, YouTube likes deleting accounts that broadcast these kinds of things.



This whole video can be enlightening but the part about education begins at about 0:50. "Neutral" UN teachers have their first-grade students chant "Palestine is an Arab land from the river to the sea" the way an American class might have the kids chanting "remember to say please and thank you" while teaching manners, then goes on to teach the kids "The Jew is the wolf" and other slurs. It goes in depth into the matter from there.

I'm of the opinion that this is actually one of, possibly the biggest obstacle to peace. The Palestinians act like complete boneheads and keep performing attacks that can't possibly succeed because they've been taught to do so, by the UN, since they were in the first grade and that kind of deep childhood indoctrination is really hard to throw off. Somebody cleaning out the educational system wouldn't fix all the deep systemic issues but in a generation it could produce people willing to actually talk and negotiate.
 
But the UN and UNRWA are made up of people, non Palestinians that is. What is their agenda? What is their aim?
 
Seriously, I don't expect much. Clinton gave them 95% of what they wanted. Israel was prepared to sign off on that and the Palestinians said no and then launched the Intifada and then brought nothing more than a decade plus of death and destruction. They were never going to get a better deal than that and they rejected it.
 
In the first place, calling it an attempt at peace in the middle east is strange; while it’s true some of the problems come from here, the middle east has a LOT more problems than the Israelo-Palestinian conflict, getting a peace deal here isn’t going to make the middle east peaceful.

Lord Invictus said:
But the UN and UNRWA are made up of people, non Palestinians that is. What is their agenda? What is their aim?
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Beat me, I always thought it was a fire and forget thing.
50 years of war because of administrative laziness, that would certainly make sense considering it is the UN we are talking about.

Spartan303 said:
Seriously, I don't expect much. Clinton gave them 95% of what they wanted. Israel was prepared to sign off on that and the Palestinians said no and then launched the Intifada and then brought nothing more than a decade plus of death and destruction. They were never going to get a better deal than that and they rejected it.
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I think this stem from a fundamental misunderstanding about the nature of the conflict; the people in charge of Palestine do no want a Palestinian country, they want Israel gone(with all that imply), and it’s not a bargaining chip, but very much the core of their negotiations.
Starting from there, no matter how much you give, they will always say no.
 
Lord Invictus said:
But the UN and UNRWA are made up of people, non Palestinians that is. What is their agenda? What is their aim?
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You note that the UNRWA teachers are arabs, just perhaps not ethnic Palestinians.

For much of the middle east when the government screws up, and there's an embarrassment, a coronavirus outbreak, a famine, or the like, the standard get of jail free card is pointing at Israel and screaming: "Those vile dirty Jews did it!"
 
Spartan303 said:
Seriously, I don't expect much. Clinton gave them 95% of what they wanted. Israel was prepared to sign off on that and the Palestinians said no and then launched the Intifada and then brought nothing more than a decade plus of death and destruction. They were never going to get a better deal than that and they rejected it.
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My fear is eventually Hamas will do something so bad so vile that it will make Israel go full beast mode on them beyond anything that has happened before and effectively eject them from the territory. That region has a history of that happening every few centuries.
 
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