Protecting And Serving: Cop (mis)behavior and consequences general discussion

WolfBear

Well-known member
Question about racial profiling: If someone argues with a cop and refuses to follow the cop's instructions and then reaches for something in their pocket or in their car, does the cop always have time to see what it is this person is grabbing before they shoot or would this approach sometimes result in this person being capable of shooting if what they're reaching for is a gun?
 

The Whispering Monk

Well-known member
Osaul
Question about racial profiling: If someone argues with a cop and refuses to follow the cop's instructions and then reaches for something in their pocket or in their car, does the cop always have time to see what it is this person is grabbing before they shoot or would this approach sometimes result in this person being capable of shooting if what they're reaching for is a gun?
This is dumb behavior by the person refusing to cooperate with LE. Don't reach for anything without the LEO's permission. If you do, and you get shot, you're behavior was kinda asking for it.
 

WolfBear

Well-known member
This is dumb behavior by the person refusing to cooperate with LE. Don't reach for anything without the LEO's permission. If you do, and you get shot, you're behavior was kinda asking for it.

Yeah, this is why I myself am actually sympathetic towards racial profiling by law enforcement (and airport security). I agree that the ideal should be colorblindness, but one can deviate from it if there is a sufficiently compelling state interest, such as saving lives, and there is no other non-colorblind way to achieve this compelling state interest ("strict scrutiny", if you will). If a cop is interacting with a young black man who is wearing ghetto clothes and who refuses to obey police instructions and instead argues with the police and reaches for something that the cops cannot see, then I suspect that it would be perfectly reasonable and sensible for this cop to be more eager to shoot them than if it was a well-dressed/upper-class old Asian woman who was doing the exact same things. At the very least, in the latter case, one would want to see what exactly she is grabbing before shooting since the risk of her reaching for a gun is probably considerably lower than in the former case.
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
Question about racial profiling: If someone argues with a cop and refuses to follow the cop's instructions and then reaches for something in their pocket or in their car, does the cop always have time to see what it is this person is grabbing before they shoot or would this approach sometimes result in this person being capable of shooting if what they're reaching for is a gun?
There's nothing relating to race here, making a sudden move after refusing instructions is going to get you shot/tazed/tackled no matter what your race is.
 

LordSunhawk

Das BOOT (literally)
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If you heard about the situation in El Mirage, AZ yesterday (school was locked down after an armed individual tried to gain access, he fled when police arrived less than a minute after the call was made, having never gotten inside, leaving behind a backpack) then you might here some people trying to equate this with Uvalde and condemn the cops for keeping the parents out of the school (to the point of tazing three of them and arresting them).

The situations are radically different. The El Mirage cops were inside the school and had fully cleared it, the students were safe, but there was a potential bomb (the backpack) outside the school. The police maintained the perimeter, moved the students to the far side of the school from the package, and were waiting for the bomb squad when the parents arrived. The police were maintaining a perimeter to protect the kids and keep the scene clear, and told the parents that A) Their kids were safe, B) they were waiting for the bomb squad before declaring the scene fully cleared, and C) once that happened they'd bring the kids out. The parents wouldn't accept this, 3 got physical with the police and had to be restrained.

This is a case of the cops actually doing their job right, there was no 'stand around while shots are fired', they immediately moved to engage and protect the kids, acting like we want cops to act. So in this case, the cops did good. Don't let media, either right or left wing, tell you different.
 

Hlaalu Agent

Nerevar going to let you down
Founder


Apparently asking a question is a death penalty.

Quick update: the kid is in critical condition at a hospital. Cop got fired, but needs to be charged with attempted murder (and murder if the kid doesn't make it).


I agree, entirely. It is attempted murder 100%. The man did not do his due diligence to check if this was the right guy...and also he went straight to firing. It reminds me of the time those cops shot up that Van, because they were spooked by Dorner. And, yes, if the kid doesn't make it, he should be charged with murder.

If he skates, due to qualified immunity, I will be quite livid. Especially, since qualified immunity is meant to protect police and the like from actual mistakes they might make on the job. This is not a mistake, and actual wrongdoing from police should be prosecuted more heavily given the position of power and trust they have been given.
 

Abhorsen

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Osaul
If he skates, due to qualified immunity, I will be quite livid. Especially, since qualified immunity is meant to protect police and the like from actual mistakes they might make on the job. This is not a mistake, and actual wrongdoing from police should be prosecuted more heavily given the position of power and trust they have been given.
Fortunately qualified immunity applies to civil cases, not criminal. Don't get me wrong, things will still be heavily favored his way (to start with, he hasn't even been charged with anything yet, so that might never happen), but qualified immunity is for once not a problem.

What that will mean, however, is that he likely won't be able to be sued (or more accurately, the lawsuit will be dismissed due to qualified immunity), as the exact circumstance might not have been reached before.
 
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bintananth

behind a desk


This woman is like someone gave Karen a badge.

Karen isn't that much of a bitch and 90mph is basically Tuesday for a y2k-ish Toyota Camry (137mph) or Honda Accord (132mph) ... both of which can outrun and outmaneuver a '65 Porsche 911 (131mph) while being a whole hell of a lot safer, much roomier, and at least 575lbs heavier.

EDIT: Almost everyone will drive at what they consider to be a safe speed, speed limits be damned. Speed limits are basically either "here's what the engineer thinks is safe in bad weather" or "the local government wants that sweet sweet speeding ticket revenue".

EDIT2: My brother-in-laws '08 Koenigsegg can hit 245mph. F1 cars aren't that fast - they top out at around 230mph - and the CCX is somehow street legal while an F1 car is not.
 
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Carrot of Truth

War is Peace
Karen isn't that much of a bitch and 90mph is basically Tuesday for a y2k-ish Toyota Camry (137mph) or Honda Accord (132mph) ... both of which can outrun and outmaneuver a '65 Porsche 911 (131mph) while being a whole hell of a lot safer, much roomier, and at least 575lbs heavier.

EDIT: Almost everyone will drive at what they consider to be a safe speed, speed limits be damned. Speed limits are basically either "here's what the engineer thinks is safe in bad weather" or "the local government wants that sweet sweet speeding ticket revenue".


That's fine but she's still acting like an entitled bitch on a power trip.
 

bintananth

behind a desk
That's fine but she's still acting like an entitled bitch on a power trip.
The easiest way to get rid of someone like her is to stick them behind a desk and nit-pick about how they aren't doing the paperwork correctly while documenting the screw-ups so you can fire them with cause.

I don't mind when our office secretary doesn't get everything right because she's more highly paid than Biden and riding herd on nine engineers.

With someone like her, I would bitch about every typo in what comes back from the several hundred page long sea of red ink I dumped on her desk yesterday at around 4:30PM with a post-it note saying "I need this by 8AM".
 

Carrot of Truth

War is Peace
The easiest way to get rid of someone like her is to stick them behind a desk and nit-pick about how they aren't doing the paperwork correctly while documenting the screw-ups so you can fire them with cause.

I don't mind when our office secretary doesn't get everything right because she's more highly paid than Biden and riding herd on nine engineers.

With someone like her, I would bitch about every typo in what comes back from the several hundred page long sea of red ink I dumped on her desk yesterday at around 4:30PM with a post-it note saying "I need this by 8AM".

Holy shit, Satan is that you?
 

bintananth

behind a desk
Holy shit, Satan is that you?
I am not the Devil's Ken Copeland Suit.



When I spot someone's money falling from a pocket my immediate response is "Sir (or Miss), you just dropped some money" because that's not my money. The last time that happened it was a $50 and the guy told me that I could have picked it up without anyone noticing.

With our secretary? The typos don't matter unless it's a company name ... which only comes up when we specify a Big Ass Fan.
 

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