In defense of pedophiles

The Immortal Watch Dog

Well-known member
Hetman
What happens when someone accuses you of doing that? How do you prove that someone does or does not fantasize about something?
Yeah, this is a bad idea to base any law off of.

People who fantasize often have a lot of material on their servers and I would approach it that way, find the evidence first, persecute second but the evidence must always been ironclad.. But I'll concede the point that a mere accusation should never be enough, especially with how accusations are weaponized..Metoo being a great example. I do believe that calumny laws should carry with them prison time..Make an accusation like this tantamount to an attempted murder beef if it can be proven that they're conspiring to maliciously fabricate shit to destroy someone's life.

Or just bring back dueling.

]Secondly, there is the problem that a law that is disproportionally punishing is in fact counterproductive in its own goals, as it corners even people guilty of slight offenses into a position where they have nothing to lose, so they may aswell go all the way, as illustrated in this example from Ancient China, in short form:
-What's the penalty for being late?
-Death.
-What's the penalty for rebellion?
-Death.
-Well -- we're late.

Except that pedophiles always offend..eventually.

No matter what you do.


In practice, to keep pedophiles from victimizing anyone is technically easier than with some other kinds of mental illnesses. They aren't out to victimize just about anyone, like it is the case with come crazy murderers or absolute nutjobs, only children. Hence, the main goal here should be to physically isolate them from access to any children. Various ways to do that, prison being the most obvious, but full reliance on that option has some downsides - most notably, being reliant on legal procedure getting them there, and quite motivating for all of them to avoid outing themselves in the first place, and if they can't avoid that, well, they may think that they could aswell go all the way - abuse a child and\or eliminate witnesses.

Most "CSA" happens in communities that are designated protected classes any way, IE the legal scrutiny is non existent. I can't tell you how many LGBT friends of mine have said they were told from a very young age "its totally healthy and normal for older LGBT adults to come onto you..stop internalizing -insertphobia here- this is how you find yourself and feel comfortable in your own skin!" merely bringing this reality up is enough to lose your job now a days.

And then you have Twitter and a few other social media sites pushing pedoacceptance and allowing "MAPS" to organize. I'm not certain the law is capable of addressing this issue anymore without a total overhaul of our criminal justice system returning it to an era where criminal justice was about deterrence rather than rehabilitation.
As such, i think the most reasonable position would be to create more of a proportional system, with the primary objective of encouraging pedophiles, especially the not (yet) child rapists, to out themselves to the authorities. Nothing makes it impossible, it's just a matter of politically and legally setting up the right compromise. The basis of it would be to limit their freedoms in some way, making them live in some sort of house arrest, mandatory, somewhat controlled housing location, or limiting and assisting them with getting into jobs in which by their very nature they would restrict them from access to children - after all, no children on an oil rig, cargo freighter, or a lumber yard in deep Siberian tundra.

I mean..we tried this as a society, well the first part..not the preemptive quarantining but the "come out into the light"

our tolerance of their existence got us the pedo acceptance movement.
What does the society get out of this? Less pedophiles playing cat and mouse with the legal and mental health systems, less expenses feeding and protecting them in prison, or alternatively catching and legally sentencing people who know that they will be killed if caught, in fact pedophiles can still work and pay taxes.
What do the pedophiles get out of this? Safety from execution or imprisonment for something they can't change or fully control, and yet still far more freedom and comfort than they would get in prison.
Wouldn't that be a fair deal for everyone?

On paper it sounds..acceptable, in practice..well...

Actually, I am saying the same standards that you apply to their case, could be applied to your case. That the same standard could be used against you without much of a stretch. You know what, maybe the logic only makes sense to me, because it is something that stems from an internal train of logic in my mind- or more than one. I'll get back to you when I am less tired. Or maybe someone will ease me of the burden of explaining my own argument, if I am lucky. Because, it seems that other people might have apprehended my meaning.


No, I get what you're saying, it makes logical sense in a world where things work as they should it would be an entirely legitimate slippery slope argument.

Problem is we've fallen off the slope so hard in that direction already we're half way down the mountain.

Maybe. But I'd rather not fantasize about it, or take pleasure from the idea. If some people deserve a bullet, then so be it.]

It certainly isn't healthy to sit around fantasizing about butchering people all day, no. Buuut "I'd love to rip this animals guts out" in response to Jeffrey Epsteins existence..or really the corrupt District attorneys who allowed him to be murdered to cover for their friends...is sort of a natural guttural response.

Dwelling on it for months after the fact though..Better uses of mental energy.

I'd rather not bay for blood, but be calm and rational about it. And plus, I'd rather give them a proper trial, to ensure order is preserved and that injustice is not being committed. Let me, explain something about my personal views, that I am the type of person to support corporal punishment in certain cases, for the reason of seeing it as being less brutal than imprisonment, and more effective to boot.

Again I certainly wasn't advocating for vigilantism in any of the stances I've taken in regards to any group I've mentioned here. Change the law first...execute second.


No, he isn't at all. And I don't think what he is arguing is at all advocacy. Though, I can understand, I think, why you see it that way. Calling him regressive left is actually quite laughable really.

The argument is a defense for these people on grounds that they deserve or are entitled to human rights and compassion...And then he talks about it being a fetish and other things.

That's fairly social justice cultish.
 
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ShieldWife

Marchioness
I’m open minded about draconian punishments for child molesters, like the death penalty, castration, etc. BUT if you are going to have severe punishments, then due process of law becomes even more important. Everyone, no matter what they are accused of, deserve a fair trial and a presumption of innocence. That is the bedrock of our legal system that protects us all from being persecuted. How could such a system even work for thought crimes?

A nation where people are executed for what they think or when they voice their opinions about their thoughts is one where nearly anybody could be vulnerable. A civilized society punishes people for what they do, not for what they think or say. Child molestation is terrible, but it’s still not worth throwing away our freedom of speech or our legal protections for.

Even advocating for legalized child molestation, as odious as such a policy is, should be legal. Advocating for changing the laws is a fundamental aspect of freedom of speech and any sort of policy that people advocate for could be considered destructive by many who oppose it.

Imagine if we took that standard and applied it to other crimes? How much activity on sci-fi and fantasy forums like ours is dedicated to thinking about ways to kill people with more dakka? Isn’t that stuff a bunch of fantasies about killing people? Who among us would want to be judged by the things we discuss or imagine? I know that I wouldn’t.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
People who fantasize often have a lot of material on their servers and I would approach it that way, find the evidence first, persecute second but the evidence must always been ironclad.. But I'll concede the point that a mere accusation should never be enough, especially with how accusations are weaponized..Metoo being a great example. I do believe that calumny laws should carry with them prison time..Make an accusation like this tantamount to an attempted murder beef if it can be proven that they're conspiring to maliciously fabricate shit to destroy someone's life.

Or just bring back dueling.
So no functional solutions... Just get lots of semi-random people dead or in prison for various reasons. A functional society that does not make.

Except that pedophiles always offend..eventually.

No matter what you do.
Pedophiles don't have supernatural abilities. Keep them isolated from children for life before they offend, and they physically cannot offend.
Most "CSA" happens in communities that are designated protected classes any way, IE the legal scrutiny is non existent. I can't tell you how many LGBT friends of mine have said they were told from a very young age "its totally healthy and normal for older LGBT adults to come onto you..stop internalizing -insertphobia here- this is how you find yourself and feel comfortable in your own skin!" merely bringing this reality up is enough to lose your job now a days.
Well here's your problem...
I for one think that the very concept of protected classes needs to be nuked out of any civilized legal system. And any professional who has a problem with that also doesn't belong anywhere near the legal system.

And then you have Twitter and a few other social media sites pushing pedoacceptance and allowing "MAPS" to organize. I'm not certain the law is capable of addressing this issue anymore without a total overhaul of our criminal justice system returning it to an era where criminal justice was about deterrence rather than rehabilitation.
Well my proposed system addresses that. Let them organize, hell, help them organize, just make sure they get organized in some place away from normal people and can't leave unsupervised. Yes, pedos are mentally ill and some of them will craft elaborate theories according to which they should be allowed to molest children to some degree or another, but there is no reason for sane people to concern themselves with the delusions of the mentally ill.


I mean..we tried this as a society, well the first part..not the preemptive quarantining but the "come out into the light"

our tolerance of their existence got us the pedo acceptance movement.
Because that obviously is a completely different thing. It's not a functional system, it does nothing to prevent crime, it's just a thinly veiled attempt at social engineering.

Also quotes got mixed up in your post.
 

The Immortal Watch Dog

Well-known member
Hetman
So no functional solutions... Just get lots of semi-random people dead or in prison for various reasons. A functional society that does not make.

Are you saying that people who maliciously slander someone as a sex offender shouldn't face serious repercussions due to it being a logistical clusterfuck?

Pedophiles don't have supernatural abilities. Keep them isolated from children for life before they offend, and they physically cannot offend.

No they don't but billeting a bunch of depraved animals in one gated community and you're going to have all manner of people setting up shop to cater to their selective needs.

This is what happened in Florida when they tried to set up a pedo commune, it just resulted in them using proxies to import child prostitutes into their little colony.
Well here's your problem...
I for one think that the very concept of protected classes needs to be nuked out of any civilized legal system. And any professional who has a problem with that also doesn't belong anywhere near the legal system.

Amen brother.

Well my proposed system addresses that. Let them organize, hell, help them organize, just make sure they get organized in some place away from normal people and can't leave unsupervised. Yes, pedos are mentally ill and some of them will craft elaborate theories according to which they should be allowed to molest children to some degree or another, but there is no reason for sane people to concern themselves with the delusions of the mentally ill.

the problem is social justice activists...most of which are misguided and dumb but not deluded will craft an advocacy narrative arguing that to do such a thing would be a discriminatory practice that would segregate and dehumanize. You'd have plenty of legal pushback from advocates thereof.


Because that obviously is a completely different thing. It's not a functional system, it does nothing to prevent crime, it's just a thinly veiled attempt at social engineering.

that's what Western justice systems have degenerated into yes.
Also quotes got mixed up in your post.

I did!

Corrected it.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
Are you saying that people who maliciously slander someone as a sex offender shouldn't face serious repercussions due to it being a logistical clusterfuck?
They should. However, proving guilt in this sort of thing is generally a clusterfuck.

No they don't but billeting a bunch of depraved animals in one gated community and you're going to have all manner of people setting up shop to cater to their selective needs.

This is what happened in Florida when they tried to set up a pedo commune, it just resulted in them using proxies to import child prostitutes into their little colony.
That's why it should be more or less isolated locations, rather than places a taxi ride away from slums or other organized crime center. Places where normal, law abiding adults would also be in on business (like said oil rigs) would be even better, as their presence would make such business much riskier and harder to hide.

the problem is social justice activists...most of which are misguided and dumb but not deluded will craft an advocacy narrative arguing that to do such a thing would be a discriminatory practice that would segregate and dehumanize. You'd have plenty of legal pushback from advocates thereof.
They are zealots of a very radical and weird ideology, creed, way of life...
Sure, "discrimination" may be a big badword in the social justice thought, but as we have established, that shouldn't have a place in law anyway. The very nature of law is to discriminate against criminals...
 

Terthna

Professional Lurker
They are zealots of a very radical and weird ideology, creed, way of life...
Sure, "discrimination" may be a big badword in the social justice thought, but as we have established, that shouldn't have a place in law anyway. The very nature of law is to discriminate against criminals...
True, but the issue here is who should be considered a criminal; and I don't think that should be determined based on what goes on in someone's head.
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
True, but the issue here is who should be considered a criminal; and I don't think that should be determined based on what goes on in someone's head.

Otherwise you’re repeating Carl Manvers in Civil War II, yes I know it’s based off some inhumans abilities to see the future, still sorta using it
 

DarthOne

☦️
Post-modernists don't care about pedophilia the way you think they do.


Like communists and homosexuals in the 1950s, boylovers are so stigmatized that it is difficult to find defenders for their civil liberties, let alone for their erotic orientation.
-Gayle Rubin, Thinking Sex


It is not necessary to figure parent-child incest as a unilateral impingement on the child by the parent, since whatever impingement takes place will also be registered within the sphere of fantasy. In fact, to understand the violation that incest can be and also to distinguish between those occasions of incest that are violation and those that are not it is unnecessary to figure the body of the child exclusively as a surface imposed upon from the outside... The reification of the child’s body as passive surface would thus constitute, at a theoretical level, a further deprivation of the child: the deprivation of psychic life.
-Judith Butler, Undoing Gender


But, after all, listening to a child, hearing him speak, hearing him explain what his relations actually were with someone, adult or not, provided one listens with enough sympathy, must allow one to establish more or less what degree of violence if any was used or what degree of consent was given. And to assume that a child is incapable of explaining what happened and was incapable of giving his consent are two abuses that are intolerable, quite unacceptable.
-Michel Foucault, The Danger of Child Sexuality


tl;dr From their perspective, not fucking children is child abuse.
 

Terthna

Professional Lurker
Post-modernists don't care about pedophilia the way you think they do.


Like communists and homosexuals in the 1950s, boylovers are so stigmatized that it is difficult to find defenders for their civil liberties, let alone for their erotic orientation.
-Gayle Rubin, Thinking Sex


It is not necessary to figure parent-child incest as a unilateral impingement on the child by the parent, since whatever impingement takes place will also be registered within the sphere of fantasy. In fact, to understand the violation that incest can be and also to distinguish between those occasions of incest that are violation and those that are not it is unnecessary to figure the body of the child exclusively as a surface imposed upon from the outside... The reification of the child’s body as passive surface would thus constitute, at a theoretical level, a further deprivation of the child: the deprivation of psychic life.
-Judith Butler, Undoing Gender


But, after all, listening to a child, hearing him speak, hearing him explain what his relations actually were with someone, adult or not, provided one listens with enough sympathy, must allow one to establish more or less what degree of violence if any was used or what degree of consent was given. And to assume that a child is incapable of explaining what happened and was incapable of giving his consent are two abuses that are intolerable, quite unacceptable.
-Michel Foucault, The Danger of Child Sexuality


tl;dr From their perspective, not fucking children is child abuse.
I'm sorry, but what relevance do post-modernists have to the topic at hand; besides to serve as an example of an extreme position that has already been thoroughly denounced by everyone, including myself, in this thread?
 

The Immortal Watch Dog

Well-known member
Hetman
...Undoing Gender....Abhorrent.

Not to defend Nazi's (since I revile welfare grabbing, teen mom venerating, neo-Pagan, cuckolded, snow ape, drug addicts), but it is a reality that a lot of the books they burned were books that defended pedophilia and creating eunuchs...

No offense, but that dead horse is essentially vapor at this point.

And yet your side gleefully repeats the arguments and you made a sympathetic one in the opening post?
 

The Immortal Watch Dog

Well-known member
Hetman
Considering it's still being preached out in the world, it's not dead enough for me.

See academic papers on the merits of "post birth abortion" and "Why it's important to make CIS normativity extinct" and "a child belongs to the community not the parents" being the motto of NYC's biggest teachers Union.

Also..the fact that the term CIS exists at all..its a slur.

The proper term is "normal"
 

CarlManvers2019

Writers Blocked Douchebag
The proper term is "normal"

That's basically it, they want to destroy "normal" and even the stuff that was already sorta considered mainstream but reviled even by prudish religious right types count as "normal" and needs to be removed or modified.

They really dislike the desires of straight non-trans dudes

And will embrace whatever is "weird" or simply put JUST "different"
 

The Immortal Watch Dog

Well-known member
Hetman
I'm reviving this thread to bring to your collective attention this..abomination.


And before anyone hyperventilates and claims this is an op by channers, no..as has been proven in this very thread. The pedo acceptance movement has existed for nearly a century.

And this is why issue with the OP..you do not give these people an inch and when leftists see a victim class they can exploit for endorphins and votes they jump.

Never compromise, never give in...destroy this movement down to its very foundations and beyond.
 

Abhorsen

Local Degenerate
Moderator
Staff Member
Comrade
Osaul
Some of the gems of these abominations


Thing is, the part you quoted seems accurate. There is no 'cure' for pedophilia. There are stories I've heard about handling it through consensual age play (no children involved. Age play is where an adult acts as if they were younger, and maybe has sex with another adult), but no cure. And denying that you are X just means you are more likely to offend and stops you from getting help.

But then I read the rest of the stuff on the twitter, and they are crazy. You just quoted where they were acting sane.
 

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