China ChiCom News Thread

King Arts

Well-known member
The *almost* however completely compromises the argument about race being special in that regard. If nationality, then also culture, if culture, then also ideologies that demand dramatic change of culture can be covered, in the end it boils down to individual times and places having their own "changeable" and "not really changeable" allegiances according to own changing needs, whims and interests, and related to how convincing someone may be in pretending, versus how trusting the other side is towards forced converts.
It's almost because there are some ethnicities that you can join, and others that you can't.

In practice the difference from slavery in average treatment was hard to tell and a lot of variation also happened between variations of slavery, and as the link shows, even the people of the age noticed that difference being mostly theoretical from the point of view of the victim.
No it's not the people noticed there was a differance the big one was that indentured servants were limited and were free afterwards while slaves were not.

And back then it covered free people only, so legalism wins you nothing.
It's a double standard not legalism. The US was built off the idea of all men being equal they had to lie and bullshit around the topic of blacks.

That's not what the other side thinks about themselves though, and if we humor such SJWish self-flagellation, that's only to their benefit through demoralization, hence i will remain hostile to such sentiments and treat any who promote them with scorn.
It's not self flagellation it's either recognizing something is bad or is not bad. If it's bad it was wrong when your people did it if it's not wrong it's not bad if the other side does it. I also look with scorn those who don't have a moral compass beyond "What is good for me in a certain instance."

I refuse to humor the temporal guilt jujitsu - "West was doing mean things 200 years ago like everyone else, so we should tolerate everyone doing mean things, even to us, now and in the future".
By that logic, we need to destroy CCP for things they will do in the future.
Besides, if you want to be cynical, those who had the martial power would do terrible things to those who back then did such mean things to their own, and that's a custom we should absolutely bring back.
Ironically that means India and other nations should destroy the west for what they do in the past, are doing now, and will do in the future.

And?
Who cares about some tokenism, except the usual suspects of course? Not me...
99.9% of peasant's sons in North Korea won't be getting a high status position either. And the handful who do, well who gives a fuck about them, it won't make the rest any less hungry or oppressed. I categorically refuse this whole framework which oh so coincidentally and conveniently makes the communist pattern of oppressing societies look "less bad" than the favorite "just listing bad things" historical western practices.
Screw that, let's make it reverse - if a society oppresses almost everyone, it's worse than oppressing just some.
So can you give me a moral argument assuming I was a black person or whatever to be against affirmative action or other things that hurt white westerners? After all it seems like your beliefs are whatever is good for you, or those that are somewhat like you in the moment. And black people can definitely get bennefits from affirmative action and taking things from whites and making them second class citizens.

Because freedom of navigation is a 24/7 operation....do you think pirates will not be out there when we arnt around?
The founding charter of the USN literally mentions protecting world trade aka freedom of navigation
The point is to protect OUR ships from pirates. We don't need to patrol EVERYWHERE. We can let other people patrol some places.

if we stagnate and get complacent we will lose anybadvantage we have.
Yes our tech is so far ahead right now.
But in 20 years if we don't make sure we are ahead we may nit be anymore and that is not good.
Because believe it or not, our adversaries would gladly make sure we are isolationists
If we were isolationists those nations would not be our adversaries would they?

.....yes our oldest ally is going to try and invade us with one of the weakest militaries in all of NATO....
Who isn't technically underneath them anymore and can operate by themselves....
None of our allies are starting wars to claim territory as thier own for them to have breathing room between them and an adversary.
They are our enemies because they have made it a point to teach thier entire population to hate us and despise us.
North Korea? Has games for thier kids where they stab bales if hay painted as Americans.
China is teaching its kids to hate America and want to see it destroyed.
Russia has been feeding its own people that we are a threat to them just for existing.
iran literally has chants fir death to america.
The Houthis flag has death to America on it!!
You don't know much about history do you? No the English are not our oldest allies the French are. Also if we bombed London and broke the British nation, or sanctioned them or made them a 3rd world shithole thats starving they'd teach their kids to hate us no shit.

i am saying if we let Ukraine fall, our allies in europe, not necessarily Ukraine, will not see us as capabke of helping them, and potentially willing to negotiate with having Russia be thier buddy buddy, and even letting NATO countries get given to russia to apease the bear.

Or the other possibility is that Ukraine falls, Poland and the Baltic states gear up for war because Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania would not be able to do whta Ukraine did, and NATO may not be able to react in time and now Russia has 4 mkre countries under its claws.
poland is not almost completely surrounded by Russia and we are getting closer to the USSR returning....
This is delusional, also if they would abandon us because we lost a war in Ukraine then Trump was right and we should abandon NATO.

the guard only obeys the fedd if the governor allows them to be activated on title 10 orders... learn how yhis works....
and what is the reason? Them saying it is legal doesn't mean it is legal, and are we at war, we're we attacked? Was congress involved?
And we wouldmt attack UK....maybe france but they might deserve it.
because they are literally a ling standing ally.
unless they attack us we wouldt attack them because that is how it works.
or if an ally calls for aide against one if them....
So you are saying you'd disobey orders to attack an enemy? Zach that's pretty treasonous you don't get to decide if the UK is an ally or not our political leaders do. If congress gives the president military authorization to do something and the president issues a lawful order(not a warcrime or something) you must follow it. If you are ordered to artillery strike a concentration of British soldiers you fucking follow it. Not decide that the British are good allies, and the French aren't. Shit like this makes me think the army needs to be neutered and lose power and funding. Soldiers job is not to think or question orders(unless they are unlawful) if you get a lawful order you follow it. It doesen't matter if you like it or not.

the governor can use his troops how ever he wants. Ifbhe wants tobinvade another state sure.
national guard troops are and are not apart of the federal chain or command. Because national guard troops are not federal troops. Thier command and chief unless on active orders, is thier governor. They have thier own state leaders and everything.
If NG and Federal troops get into a fight si be it.
Federal government can only force NG into being federal under certain circumstances. Most states don't turn it down because more money and training for thier troops.
The state has to approve the use of thier soldiers....

This isn't some thing where the NG are all federal being loaned to the state. No, national guard are strictly states having thier own armies that the feds get loaned to them every now and then
I seriously doubt that, National Guards would obey that when they know that they can be nationalized against the wishes of the governor. After all the national guard did not fire on the army when desegregation was imposed in Little Rock.

Okay, curiosity got the better of me, so I decided to click on "show ignore" to see what was going on.

Glad to see @King Arts' rabid Anglophobia is on full display again. 😮‍💨 FYI, the British Empire legally ended in 1997, but de facto it ended pretty much a decade or so after the Second World War.

Please stop being retarded. Browse Wikipedia (of all places) once in a while for basic knowledge.
Just because the British don't call what they have an empire doesen't mean it's not an empire. Britain has a commonwealth and it has territories outside of the island of Britain you have Gibraltar you have islands in the Caribbean, you have the Maldives/Falklands.

I mean all the shit you say I can also turn around and argue towards China. Oh you have "sinophobia" you are just using liberal arguments, because you want to build yourself as a victim.
This, once again, shows that you are fundamentally not someone to be taken seriously when it comes to world politics and military affairs, and that your screen name is poorly chosen.

It is basic bitch understanding to know that if you only post a watchman a fraction of the day, that's worse than useless for detering theft. You have to pay the watchman, but the thieves will always wait until the watch has ended to commit their dirty deeds.

Do you think that banks leave their doors and safes unlocked all night?
LordsFire listen to me. We are debating about the Watchman position itself. I'm saying we should not be the watchman we don't want to be world policemen enforcing "international law" We don't need to guard everyone's sea lanes 24/7 We can guard important ones that we consider strategic, and have our partners guard other ones. Let others be the watchmen in some parts of the world.
 
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Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
It's almost because there are some ethnicities that you can join, and others that you can't.
No, you can't join any really, as i've demonstrated. You can larp, and if they are nice they may even recognize that, but you can't join truly. You will never be raised in a culture you weren't raised in, you will never be a native speaker of a language you aren't yet.
No it's not the people noticed there was a differance the big one was that indentured servants were limited and were free afterwards while slaves were not.
Much good that was to those who were dead or wrecks health wise by the time it hypothetically ended. Slaves could also be freed if they convinced the owner, or bought themselves out, or were bought out by someone else. At this point we are talking contractual difference...
If anything a slave was a more long term investment for the master, while an indenture, if he gets sickly or crippled around the end of the term from abuse or owerwork, whatever, not the owner's problem, while a crippled slave is a major loss of value.
It's a double standard not legalism. The US was built off the idea of all men being equal they had to lie and bullshit around the topic of blacks.
The obsessive connection between slavery and equality came with modern-ish politicking around that subject. Back in the time this was written, the person who signed it seems to have reconciled it.
I suspect it's the same logic commies use now to complain that non-citizens do not have equal right to citizens.
It's not self flagellation it's either recognizing something is bad or is not bad. If it's bad it was wrong when your people did it if it's not wrong it's not bad if the other side does it. I also look with scorn those who don't have a moral compass beyond "What is good for me in a certain instance."
It's virtue signalling to leftist mores. These mores should be attacked as aggressively as progressives themselves enjoy violating other's social norms, not catered to.
There is no use for self-flagellating over the past of your people, your nation when you're not a leftist - after all, a leftist wants to create a "year zero", hates the past culture and people, and want to create a "new man" who is completely separated from the past and condemns it as much as possible, in other words it's what Mao did.
But if you're not a leftist, a more nuanced reconciliation with history is a better solution.

Secondly, what is now is now, what is the past is the past. If you want to justify certain barbaric practices now because "our ancestors used to do it too sometime somewhere", well, why the hell aren't you saying we would be right to do whatever our ancestors did in the past to people who did those things to us, like war slavery, pillaging, raiding, starving enemies or razing cities?
If you want to justify the barbaric practices of our enemies on the basis of the past, well then we should have as much right to do any historical barbaric practices to them in return, as some form of eternal precedent traditionalism.
Ironically that means India and other nations should destroy the west for what they do in the past, are doing now, and will do in the future.
Well then, if that is so, we have no choice but to destroy them first. Is this the conclusion you wanted to arrive to with your attempts at moralizing?
So can you give me a moral argument assuming I was a black person or whatever to be against affirmative action or other things that hurt white westerners? After all it seems like your beliefs are whatever is good for you, or those that are somewhat like you in the moment. And black people can definitely get bennefits from affirmative action and taking things from whites and making them second class citizens.
It is a question of framing. Are you "black people" or US citizens who happen to be of African descent? Are you "white people" or US citizens who happen to be of European descent?
Which "allegiance" is real, which is fictional, and which ranks higher if both are real? If white and black Americans were to be trying to get one over each group for own benefit, then one would have to conclude the Americans as a people are a fiction, which would have its own implications, some quite terrible. If Americans were however to be real as a people, a nation, then such actions are detrimental to its cohesion and future prospects, which makes them quite unpatriotic. Is treason or actively destroying your country and nation moral? Different philosophies disagree on that question, and so your answer will depend on where you stand on such philosophies and the nation in question, and i don't know what it is even if i have suspicions.

Expanding it beyond certain categories of people and geography, one can get even more benefits than that by taking from 99.9% of other people and making them second class citizens, and call himself the Supreme Leader or something like that.
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
The point is to protect OUR ships from pirates. We don't need to patrol EVERYWHERE. We can let other people patrol some places.
They do patrol. We just have the capability to have sp much it helps the smaller nations nit bankrupt themselves.
And we have been fighting pirates protecting freedom of navigation since age of fucking sail.
If we were isolationists those nations would not be our adversaries would they?
No they still would be. We could shut our selves off today and they would still hate us
You don't know much about history do you? No the English are not our oldest allies the French are. Also if we bombed London and broke the British nation, or sanctioned them or made them a 3rd world shithole thats starving they'd teach their kids to hate us no shit.
The French are partners. Allies is a little touchy with them as after 1812 we grew closer to the Brits then the French.
We are closer and friendlier towards the brits then the french thats ehy I say that.

Japan isn't taught to hate us...neither is South Korea or Vietnam even.
This is delusional, also if they would abandon us because we lost a war in Ukraine then Trump was right and we should abandon NATO.
Not NATO. countries within NATO.
Because how can they be sure we would support them?
So you are saying you'd disobey orders to attack an enemy? Zach that's pretty treasonous you don't get to decide if the UK is an ally or not our political leaders do. If congress gives the president military authorization to do something and the president issues a lawful order(not a warcrime or something) you must follow it. If you are ordered to artillery strike a concentration of British soldiers you fucking follow it. Not decide that the British are good allies, and the French aren't. Shit like this makes me think the army needs to be neutered and lose power and funding. Soldiers job is not to think or question orders(unless they are unlawful) if you get a lawful order you follow it. It doesen't matter if you like it or not.
.....that is how you get forces that are not willing to fight because commanders don't care because they know the soldiers will follow without question.
We are to think and question the orders in ways to make sure we understand what is being told.
And asking why is one if the things we are often told to do
Because the why is important.
That is how you know if it is lawful or not.

Ans a soldier has to be able to think because squad level tactics is a thing and what makes the US military so powerful with its NCO corp...
I seriously doubt that, National Guards would obey that when they know that they can be nationalized against the wishes of the governor. After all the national guard did not fire on the army when desegregation was imposed in Little Rock.
Did you read at all about what he used to invoke that? He had to write an EO, and used the Insurection act.
It wasn't just a simple "your federalized".
The state NG leadership had to also allow it.

Remember, during the inauguration in 2020 NG troops were voluntarily sent to DC and were not federalized because they couldnt be.....
the federlization if troops in the 50s was basically forcing then to stand down.
Just because the British don't call what they have an empire doesen't mean it's not an empire. Britain has a commonwealth and it has territories outside of the island of Britain you have Gibraltar you have islands in the Caribbean, you have the Maldives/Falklands.
That isn't an empire.
It is a commonwealth. The British have no direct control over any of those nations.
I mean all the shit you say I can also turn around and argue towards China. Oh you have "sinophobia" you are just using liberal arguments, because you want to build yourself as a victim.
I am not scared of China so it isn't a phobia. I know they are a threat to the freedoms in which we were founded on and should they have the capability they would make sure everyone in the world who isn't Han has to suffer to make them superior.
LordsFire listen to me. We are debating about the Watchman position itself. I'm saying we should not be the watchman we don't want to be world policemen enforcing "international law" We don't need to guard everyone's sea lanes 24/7 We can guard important ones that we consider strategic, and have our partners guard other ones. Let others be the watchmen in some parts of the world.
Do you know how big the oceans are and the amount of sea lanes there are?
We have the capability to do what we do and many countries do nit.
Freedom of navigation is something we have a thrive to ensure.
Having our ships always able to support rhat freedom is key to making sure trade is good.

The ocean is big
 

Jormungandr

The Midgard Wyrm
Founder
You still have those!? Your defense ministry held replacement trials in the mid 90s! WTH?
Yeah, we do. :( Even new variants and modifications, too. smh

@King Arts ...Those countries are independent. Completely.

Hell, Canada is more America's 51st state by this point than they are part of a "British Empire".

Countries in the Commonwealth are not under British control. We trade. We share shit. We have a common monarch. We have exclusive sports leagues you non-Commonwealthers can't access. :p

Unless, you know, you're saying Canada, Australia, New Zealand, et cetera, et cetera, still take orders from London. :rolleyes:

I legitimately wonder if you're a troll or are just fucking brain damaged by this point.
 

UberIguana

Well-known member
I've heard there were still reliability issues, though? Squaddies still complain about it.
I'm mostly getting this from online anecdotes. You can see the arrse wiki on the SA80 and judge for yourself. Most of it is complaints about the original, but the last few paragraphs say the latest versions aren't bad.

Yes, I know it's a wiki, but it's run by people who use the thing, rather than an official website that swears blind all the problems are fixed this time.
 

Jormungandr

The Midgard Wyrm
Founder
I'm mostly getting this from online anecdotes. You can see the arrse wiki on the SA80 and judge for yourself. Most of it is complaints about the original, but the last few paragraphs say the latest versions aren't bad.

Yes, I know it's a wiki, but it's run by people who use the thing, rather than an official website that swears blind all the problems are fixed this time.
I tend to trust anecdotes by people who've personally experienced something/an event than "official" statements/figures. :) Looks like they've ironed out the technical problems; still, the design of the gun itself is still pretty crap.

It's like the gunsmiths prototyping it got drunk and couldn't decide what it supposed to be.
 

King Arts

Well-known member
No, you can't join any really, as i've demonstrated. You can larp, and if they are nice they may even recognize that, but you can't join truly. You will never be raised in a culture you weren't raised in, you will never be a native speaker of a language you aren't yet.
America. That disproves your whole point. You make these claims that aren't true because ethnicity isn't black and white.

Much good that was to those who were dead or wrecks health wise by the time it hypothetically ended. Slaves could also be freed if they convinced the owner, or bought themselves out, or were bought out by someone else. At this point we are talking contractual difference...
If anything a slave was a more long term investment for the master, while an indenture, if he gets sickly or crippled around the end of the term from abuse or owerwork, whatever, not the owner's problem, while a crippled slave is a major loss of value.
Indentured servants were treated much better than slaves. There are a few black people on this site who would tell you to fuck off for you saying slaves were not treated worse than indentured servants.

The obsessive connection between slavery and equality came with modern-ish politicking around that subject. Back in the time this was written, the person who signed it seems to have reconciled it.
No they did not. It was always a sore spot. I respect those who are consistent. An American can be a mysoginist and still be consistent "All MEN are created equal" but they have to invent bullshit science to make racism square itself into America's round peg. "Muh blacks are a diffrent species and not human!"

That's why I can't have anything but contempt towards American racists, those who agree with the constitution and founding fathers on equality but say no to blacks.

It's virtue signalling to leftist mores. These mores should be attacked as aggressively as progressives themselves enjoy violating other's social norms, not catered to.
There is no use for self-flagellating over the past of your people, your nation when you're not a leftist - after all, a leftist wants to create a "year zero", hates the past culture and people, and want to create a "new man" who is completely separated from the past and condemns it as much as possible, in other words it's what Mao did.
But if you're not a leftist, a more nuanced reconciliation with history is a better solution.

Secondly, what is now is now, what is the past is the past. If you want to justify certain barbaric practices now because "our ancestors used to do it too sometime somewhere", well, why the hell aren't you saying we would be right to do whatever our ancestors did in the past to people who did those things to us, like war slavery, pillaging, raiding, starving enemies or razing cities?
If you want to justify the barbaric practices of our enemies on the basis of the past, well then we should have as much right to do any historical barbaric practices to them in return, as some form of eternal precedent traditionalism.
It's not going to leftist mores. The left does not have a monopoly on morality. Tell me if leftists started saying child rape and suicide was bad would you say it was good?

Also for your last sentence I actually agree on threating people the way they treat others. So sure.

Well then, if that is so, we have no choice but to destroy them first. Is this the conclusion you wanted to arrive to with your attempts at moralizing?
Good luck on beating the whole world, it's not the 1800's anymore. China and India can blow up Europe.

It is a question of framing. Are you "black people" or US citizens who happen to be of African descent? Are you "white people" or US citizens who happen to be of European descent?
Which "allegiance" is real, which is fictional, and which ranks higher if both are real? If white and black Americans were to be trying to get one over each group for own benefit, then one would have to conclude the Americans as a people are a fiction, which would have its own implications, some quite terrible. If Americans were however to be real as a people, a nation, then such actions are detrimental to its cohesion and future prospects, which makes them quite unpatriotic. Is treason or actively destroying your country and nation moral? Different philosophies disagree on that question, and so your answer will depend on where you stand on such philosophies and the nation in question, and i don't know what it is even if i have suspicions.

Expanding it beyond certain categories of people and geography, one can get even more benefits than that by taking from 99.9% of other people and making them second class citizens, and call himself the Supreme Leader or something like that.
But a nation can be unequal. Why not have blacks be in power and oppress whites? If we can get away with it and still be a super power why should a black man not fuck you over?

They do patrol. We just have the capability to have sp much it helps the smaller nations nit bankrupt themselves.
And we have been fighting pirates protecting freedom of navigation since age of fucking sail.
Yes everyone hunts Pirates Zach because they cause headaches to almost everyone. That's why the Romans called them enemies of mankind because all nations were angry at them. Then Anglo larpers started spouting it and adding slavery to that, which makes no sense as the majority of humanity has had slavery so how can the majority of humanity be enemies to themselves.

No they still would be. We could shut our selves off today and they would still hate us
Why do you think this? This is as stupid as saying Iraqi's hate us for our freedom. Again in the war with Germany, and Japan and Vietnam they hated us also. They don't anymore but that's because there has been decades since there was conflict.

The French are partners. Allies is a little touchy with them as after 1812 we grew closer to the Brits then the French.
We are closer and friendlier towards the brits then the french thats ehy I say that.

Japan isn't taught to hate us...neither is South Korea or Vietnam even.
We grew closer to them because of Anglophiles who were traitors to America. They were the same progressives in the early 1900's who got us into world war 1 and such and also brought about prohibition.

Not NATO. countries within NATO.
Because how can they be sure we would support them?
Because we went into a war we lost to protect a non NATO member. Do you understand the scenario I brought up or are you misunderstanding it?

.....that is how you get forces that are not willing to fight because commanders don't care because they know the soldiers will follow without question.
We are to think and question the orders in ways to make sure we understand what is being told.
And asking why is one if the things we are often told to do
Because the why is important.
That is how you know if it is lawful or not.

Ans a soldier has to be able to think because squad level tactics is a thing and what makes the US military so powerful with its NCO corp...
Do you know why very effective leaders in the US like Henry Kissinger have called military men dumb pawns? Because their role is to obey orders. You are an NCO right? Sure you want your privates to have some initiative in a firefight or doing their job. But if you get orders to deploy to Niger in Africa. We want to restore the old president to power to "bring back democracy from the dictatorship that took it" :rolleyes: . If one of your privates decides to "think for himself" and say "You know this war is both unjust and is not helpful to the American people, in fact I think it might be harmful to our interests as a whole to be seen as colonizers and damage relations with other nations. So Sargent Zach I'm not going to obey the orders to participate in the invasion."

What would you do?

Did you read at all about what he used to invoke that? He had to write an EO, and used the Insurection act.
It wasn't just a simple "your federalized".
The state NG leadership had to also allow it.

Remember, during the inauguration in 2020 NG troops were voluntarily sent to DC and were not federalized because they couldnt be.....
the federlization if troops in the 50s was basically forcing then to stand down.
The president can invoke the insurrection act at his will. He can claim that the National Guard obeying the governor's order to go into another state is an insurrection. Yes it's easy to be federalized, because there is no mechanism to prevent and punish the president from doing that.

That isn't an empire.
It is a commonwealth. The British have no direct control over any of those nations.
An empire does not have to be centrally controlled. The empire can give autonomy to it's regions. I see an empire as a nation with large land, population, and resources. The British if they get into a war with France or Germany can call upon it's commonwealth. That's why in world war 2 even if America stayed out of it the British might still have outproduced the Germans.

I am not scared of China so it isn't a phobia. I know they are a threat to the freedoms in which we were founded on and should they have the capability they would make sure everyone in the world who isn't Han has to suffer to make them superior.
Zach I'm not scared of England either, so I guess I don't have Anglophobia. I just have antipathy towards the English for their past crimes, their double standard of pointing fingers at other European colonial powers and America while they themselves are proud of their empire and say it did nothing wrong, and their current misdeeds.

Also I don't think the Chinese are a threat to our freedoms. No nation in the world is able to take away our freedom of speech, right to bear arms, 5th ammendment, etc. The only one that could do it is our own. That's why I don't want it to be too strong because an army that can be sent abroad can be sent home to enforce the government's rules. China and Russia can't come to American shores go into American houses take our guns away, or arrest people for insulting Putin, or whoever. The U.S. government has the ability to do that if you said something.
Do you know how big the oceans are and the amount of sea lanes there are?
We have the capability to do what we do and many countries do nit.
Freedom of navigation is something we have a thrive to ensure.
Having our ships always able to support rhat freedom is key to making sure trade is good.

The ocean is big
I get the ocean is big Zach, but a carrier is not needed for anti piracy operations. We have radar and sonar and all sorts of stuff so that frigates could just be used for that. It's not the age of sail where pirates can fight warships and win.

Yeah, we do. :( Even new variants and modifications, too. smh

@King Arts ...Those countries are independent. Completely.

Hell, Canada is more America's 51st state by this point than they are part of a "British Empire".

Countries in the Commonwealth are not under British control. We trade. We share shit. We have a common monarch. We have exclusive sports leagues you non-Commonwealthers can't access. :p

Unless, you know, you're saying Canada, Australia, New Zealand, et cetera, et cetera, still take orders from London. :rolleyes:

I legitimately wonder if you're a troll or are just fucking brain damaged by this point.
I'm not really a troll because I do have a heavy dislike of the English people and almost everything they have done, so me saying it or insulting English I don't think qualifies as trolling. Though I should probably try to be more civil.

As for brain damaged not at all again only a fool would be trusting of English people it's perfectly reasonable to dislike the English and their power and influence and want to do what you can to weaken the wealth, and power of Anglos. Since the Anglos are one of the most powerful groups around today. I'm just applying what you did in Europe in the past today to you. Always support the weaker party in a conflict since every conflict you've been in has been picking on those weaker than you. It makes sense that I would support them over you.

Umm Jormungandr I said that the UK has a commonwealth which makes it an empire. I did not say Canada, or New Zealand or Australia are lands that were wrongly taken.

You did not respond to the lands that should not be part of the British though like Gibraltar which should be given to Spain. You only keep it so that you have control over the med.

Also there is the Chagos Islands. That is in modern times, tell me why British soldiers don't deserve to be spit on and called theives and rapists when your military kicks people out of their homes and lands, and then when called out on it tries to give paltry "compensation" to try and avoid controversy?

The way I see it actions like that make your people deserve the migrants.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
Staff Member
America. That disproves your whole point. You make these claims that aren't true because ethnicity isn't black and white.
America is not considered an ethnically homogenous country by anyone for a damn reason, so your disproval is a joke.
Indentured servants were treated much better than slaves. There are a few black people on this site who would tell you to fuck off for you saying slaves were not treated worse than indentured servants.
I've just fucking shown you a quote from a historical researcher in the article saying no, not really better, describing it as "a status little different from chattel slaves".
It's very unPC to disrupt the kind of "victimhood hierarchy" view of it you are trying to push, know, but then again, that's why it needs to be pushed against.
No they did not. It was always a sore spot. I respect those who are consistent. An American can be a mysoginist and still be consistent "All MEN are created equal" but they have to invent bullshit science to make racism square itself into America's round peg. "Muh blacks are a diffrent species and not human!"
Well then you are accusing the people who wrote it of not understanding the implications while you do. You can read up on that, they had their own understanding of it, and we have touched upon it already - equal or not in the eyes of the creator, in legal status obviously there is a difference between citizen and non-citizen, indentured and free man, criminal and law abiding citizen, the rest is details and degrees of difference. If you take this equality to the extreme you are trying to you will end up with anarchist view of this and no one wants that.
That's why I can't have anything but contempt towards American racists, those who agree with the constitution and founding fathers on equality but say no to blacks.
I don't give a shit for racists one way or another, they are dumb, but there are worse, dumber and yet more influential political movements around now.

It's not going to leftist mores. The left does not have a monopoly on morality. Tell me if leftists started saying child rape and suicide was bad would you say it was good?
Well did most of historical western societies share the leftist's view on this? If not, then it's probably leftist view. In this case it's stuff western societies mysteriously started being against not even during, but in a couple decades after WW2.
Also for your last sentence I actually agree on threating people the way they treat others. So sure.
Then you are being inconsistent in your whining about what the western countries do.
So it's not about whether doing it is bad absolutely, it's based on the judgement whether you think the target deserves it. In that case, we may agree it might, in some others we may not.
Good luck on beating the whole world, it's not the 1800's anymore. China and India can blow up Europe.
Back to my point, it's based on martial power. If China and India want to ruin Europe, cold war 2 it is, and blow if they will try to blow it up if not allowed to, oh well, nuclear war it is.
But a nation can be unequal. Why not have blacks be in power and oppress whites? If we can get away with it and still be a super power why should a black man not fuck you over?
>if
Well, if the black man is in power, wants to do it and can get away with it, then (besides meaning some sort of black nationalism being effectively in power and surprisingly functional) his answer to that question matters, not your or mine, for if he is in such a position, why would he care for what your moral convictions are, when he has his own?
Most civilizations will naturally have moral opinions of such things that are either mostly or completely independent of what other ones adopt - after all, even though the western civilization isn't waging religious wars since centuries, the civilization of Islam couldn't care less and they still do, even if they aren't very good at them.
It's very unwise to make a blanket assumption that everyone in the world subscribes to golden rule based morality and practices it too.
Look at South Africa, the local commies are fine with their country getting into deeper shit as long as they can be commies and treat local whites like dirt.
That point also applies to CCP obviously, they are more than happy to criticize western history of colonialism 24/7, and use the very same moralistic and universalistic arguments you and many others present against it, while at the same time scheming how to do their own right now. They don't care about your standards and whether you will call them hypocrites, they care about expanding their power and whether they can get away with it, and are willing to exploit your beliefs to help facilitate getting you to let them get away with it.
 
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Tiamat

I've seen the future...
The A1 was shit. The A2 and A3 are pretty decent and fixed most of the problems. Supposedly later versions are more reliable than the M4.

I've heard there were still reliability issues, though? Squaddies still complain about it.

Press X to doubt.
Need to see Citations

I'm mostly getting this from online anecdotes. You can see the arrse wiki on the SA80 and judge for yourself. Most of it is complaints about the original, but the last few paragraphs say the latest versions aren't bad.

Yes, I know it's a wiki, but it's run by people who use the thing, rather than an official website that swears blind all the problems are fixed this time.

I tend to trust anecdotes by people who've personally experienced something/an event than "official" statements/figures. :) Looks like they've ironed out the technical problems; still, the design of the gun itself is still pretty crap.

It's like the gunsmiths prototyping it got drunk and couldn't decide what it supposed to be.


The original SA80, sadly, is the last product of a company that was getting told it was going out of business...with the unfortunate results.

Still, I'd take an improved A2 or A3 version over a crappy one any day.
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
Yes everyone hunts Pirates Zach because they cause headaches to almost everyone. That's why the Romans called them enemies of mankind because all nations were angry at them. Then Anglo larpers started spouting it and adding slavery to that, which makes no sense as the majority of humanity has had slavery so how can the majority of humanity be enemies to themselves.
Yes, but we also have a lot more advanced world and as we see with China's fishing boat fleet.
One needs to be able to stop them as well not just normal pirates.
Why do you think this? This is as stupid as saying Iraqi's hate us for our freedom. Again in the war with Germany, and Japan and Vietnam they hated us also. They don't anymore but that's because there has been decades since there was conflict.
ME will always hate us because we arnt Islamic.
Normal countries like Germany, Japan, Korea, and Vietnam can forgive us or thank us for what we did.
We grew closer to them because of Anglophiles who were traitors to America. They were the same progressives in the early 1900's who got us into world war 1 and such and also brought about prohibition.
The Brits were easier to be allies with when the French were only out forthemselves since the beginning...
They used the colonies revolution to get back at the Brits fir the French and Indian War.
Because we went into a war we lost to protect a non NATO member. Do you understand the scenario I brought up or are you misunderstanding it?
We have yet to go into a war to help a non NATO member and lose.
Vietnam was not helping a non nato member against a invasion.
Korea would he closest but that was a UN war nit just American.
Do you know why very effective leaders in the US like Henry Kissinger have called military men dumb pawns?
Because their role is to obey orders.
Yes because they want to act all high and mighty that THEY are the reason we are able to be as powerful as we are. That THEY are rhe reason the world has had peace.
When in reality, having the most powerful military in the world often prevents people from wanting to fuck eith you. As rhe AQ and the Taliban learned after 9/11.
You are an NCO right?
Yes
Sure you want your privates to have some initiative in a firefight or doing their job.
I want them to be able to think on thier own because if I go down they should be able to act and not he a liability.
But if you get orders to deploy to Niger in Africa
We want to restore the old president to power to "bring back democracy from the dictatorship that took it" :rolleyes: . If one of your privates decides to "think for himself" and say "You know this war is both unjust and is not helpful to the American people, in fact I think it might be harmful to our interests as a whole to be seen as colonizers and damage relations with other nations. So Sargent Zach I'm not going to obey the orders to participate in the invasion."

What would you do?
I would tell him "hey, if you think it is u just ir immoral or illegal to follow these orders, you can file a complaint with IG and not participate. IG will make sure you are not retaliated against.

Because guess what, as an NCO it is my job to make sure I know what is best for my soldiers. It is in the NCO Creed. "I know my soldiers, and I will always will place the needs of my soldiers above my own"
Simple as.
Hey, if we go and have help fromECOWAS no big deal.
The president can invoke the insurrection act at his will. He can claim that the National Guard obeying the governor's order to go into another state is an insurrection. Yes it's easy to be federalized, because there is no mechanism to prevent and punish the president from doing that.
Actually in order fir the president to declare the insurrection act the president has to have told the ones insurecting to stop at least twice and if they do not do so then they can invoke thay act.
An empire does not have to be centrally controlled. The empire can give autonomy to it's regions. I see an empire as a nation with large land, population, and resources. The British if they get into a war with France or Germany can call upon it's commonwealth. That's why in world war 2 even if America stayed out of it the British might still have outproduced the Germans.
Except the British still has colonies back then....
Like India...
But outside of that, the diffrence between a commonwealth and en empire is they all control themselves independently of the British government.
And AFAIK they can say no to the crown
Zach I'm not scared of England either, so I guess I don't have Anglophobia. I just have antipathy towards the English for their past crimes, their double standard of pointing fingers at other European colonial powers and America while they themselves are proud of their empire and say it did nothing wrong, and their current misdeeds.
I mean, compared to the rest of Europe, they were the best to thier colonies. L99k at what the Belgians did in the congo. Spain and Portugal to thiers.
France still has some for Christ's sake!
Also I don't think the Chinese are a threat to our freedoms.
This is where you are wrong.
No nation in the world is able to take away our freedom of speech,
They can if they buy up any media organizations that are widely used in the US ir make an app that basically makes it impossible to not be spied upon.
Or they just pay off people in our government.
right to bear arms,
I mean, they just help invent new ways governments can get control over its people.
5th ammendment, etc.
They already break our 4th amendment in the fact that that TikTok exists and the amount if stuff it gets access too.
The only one that could do it is our own. That's why I don't want it to be too strong because an army that can be sent abroad can be sent home to enforce the government's rules. China and Russia can't come to American shores go into American houses take our guns away, or arrest people for insulting Putin, or whoever. The U.S. government has the ability to do that if you said something.
Okay. Cool.
But if a nation decides to invade and we have no military strong enough to repel them...what then?
The military is horrible for policing actions because we are not trained for it.
Look at what we did in the ME.
And unlike out there, you would have people from these areas policing thier family and friends? Yeah no.
We arnt like that.

China is a threat to the US due to the fact it can influence our nation in ways that arnt physical.
Our economy, our fucking media.
It has a large group out there specifically meant to disrupt our cuber infrastructure.
It is a threat because it sees us as subservient to them and they will come for us one day or another. Just depends om if we make it easy or not.
I get the ocean is big Zach, but a carrier is not needed for anti piracy operations. We have radar and sonar and all sorts of stuff so that frigates could just be used for that. It's not the age of sail where pirates can fight warships and win.
Your right, but at the same time when you have groups like the Houthis who attack from ashore and you can't guarantee to hit the target effectively with a frigate you have to use aircraft.

Or you want to make sure adversarial aircraft don't get close and attack your ships etc etc.
Projection of power is often more then enough to prevent most conflicts in the world.
 

Typhonis

Well-known member
The original SA80, sadly, is the last product of a company that was getting told it was going out of business...with the unfortunate results.

Still, I'd take an improved A2 or A3 version over a crappy one any day.
At least it wasn't actively sabotaged by Army Ordinance to promote their own product.
 

History Learner

Well-known member
Chinese Demographics is something discussed much in this thread, and some of the solutions to it on the part of the CCP are starting to come into view. The most obvious one is they curtail abortion, as Stalin did from 1936 until his death in the USSR:



If China is able to totally suppress abortion, then their fertility rate would be at around ~2, as they would be doubling their live births. There is some question of if they can be that successful in suppressing infanticide, but even in more conservative cases they will likely see a serious boost:



As a reminder, Elbridge Colby (Who wrote the 2018 Pentagon paper on confronting China for the Trump administration) thinks internal migration is sufficient to delay any demographic issues in China for another generation. Clamping down on abortion and thus raising the fertility rates would thus seriously extend that time-frame well into the late 21st Century:

 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder


Taiwanese who buy a book called "If China Attacks", which is sort of a guide for what civies should do if the CCP goes for it, have been getting harassing phone-calls from people in the CCP acting as 'customer service reps' or the like, bugging customers about "ideologically problematic" purchases.
 

AmosTrask

Well-known member


Taiwanese who buy a book called "If China Attacks", which is sort of a guide for what civies should do if the CCP goes for it, have been getting harassing phone-calls from people in the CCP acting as 'customer service reps' or the like, bugging customers about "ideologically problematic" purchases.

The stupidity of the CCP never ceases to amaze me. The Streisand Effect should drive more sales.
 

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