Armchair General's DonbAss Derailed Discussion Thread (Topics Include History, Traps, and the Ongoing Slavic Civil War plus much much more)

Jormungandr said:
If you're having to buy shitty, half-squibbed shells from North Korea just to maintain some sort of operational capacity, that does not support the "Russia has an overwhelming artillery advantage" supposition.
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I'm with you most of the way, but Russia getting artillery supplies from NK shouldn't be laughed off. NK and SK are both sitting on an absolute mountain of artillery guns and shells staring across the DMZ at each other. (Note to readers: basically, the Cold War never ended for the Korean peninsula. And Seoul is more or less within gun range.) NK may suck ass but the quality of those shells is important to it; that the shells suck anyway is a testament to how much NK sucks but I'm not sure they're that much worse than Russia's own stuff.

As far as I know, SK isn't prepared to give up its own shells. Unless that changes, Russia getting large quantities of NK shells may be key to counterbalancing NATO stockpiles and production.
Cherico said:
So basically the Russians are using this war to purge restive ethic groups? Yeah that checks out it's a very old Russian tactic
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Eh, that could be true, but I think it's much more likely that the reason ethnic minorities are being press-ganged is simply because that won't piss off the voters as much as doing it to "real" Russians will. Path of least resistance.
 
strunkenwhite said:
I'm with you most of the way, but Russia getting artillery supplies from NK shouldn't be laughed off. NK and SK are both sitting on an absolute mountain of artillery guns and shells staring across the DMZ at each other. (Note to readers: basically, the Cold War never ended for the Korean peninsula. And Seoul is more or less within gun range.) NK may suck ass but the quality of those shells is important to it; that the shells suck anyway is a testament to how much NK sucks but I'm not sure they're that much worse than Russia's own stuff.

As far as I know, SK isn't prepared to give up its own shells. Unless that changes, Russia getting large quantities of NK shells may be key to counterbalancing NATO stockpiles and production.

Eh, that could be true, but I think it's much more likely that the reason ethnic minorities are being press-ganged is simply because that won't piss off the voters as much as doing it to "real" Russians will. Path of least resistance.
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Russian stuff is sometimes bad quality from decades of bad storage or shortcuts of wartime production. NK stuff is bad quality by default, and only gets worse from there.

And speaking of SK, they did figure out a way to help with the western shell supply.
www.reuters.com

South Korea to lend 500,000 rounds of artillery shells to US -report

South Korea has reached an agreement to lend the United States 500,000 rounds of 155mm artillery shells that could give Washington greater flexibility to supply Ukraine with ammunition, a South Korean newspaper reported on Wednesday.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
 
strunkenwhite said:
I'm with you most of the way, but Russia getting artillery supplies from NK shouldn't be laughed off. NK and SK are both sitting on an absolute mountain of artillery guns and shells staring across the DMZ at each other. (Note to readers: basically, the Cold War never ended for the Korean peninsula. And Seoul is more or less within gun range.) NK may suck ass but the quality of those shells is important to it; that the shells suck anyway is a testament to how much NK sucks but I'm not sure they're that much worse than Russia's own stuff.

As far as I know, SK isn't prepared to give up its own shells. Unless that changes, Russia getting large quantities of NK shells may be key to counterbalancing NATO stockpiles and production.

Eh, that could be true, but I think it's much more likely that the reason ethnic minorities are being press-ganged is simply because that won't piss off the voters as much as doing it to "real" Russians will. Path of least resistance.
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Worse shells that may not even work from NK
 
Zachowon said:
Worse shells that may not even work from NK
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60% chance of being duds straight out of the factory. Worse in their inadequately built ammunition bunkers. North Korea uses 1920s era equipment and compensates with slave labour working 24 hours a day to meet production quota. They're worse at maintenance than Russia. On the order of bad to worst on the issue of maintenance.
Russia
China
North Korea.
 
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Lord Sovereign said:
The Russians, soldier for soldier, are badly outmatched. I still feel sorry for those poor bastards toppling over like a sack of potatoes, or twitching as bullets smack into their flesh.

They were still people at the end of the day.
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This is why Russia uses raw numbers, it might even work for them again time will tell.
 
Cherico said:
This is why Russia uses raw numbers, it might even work for them again time will tell.
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Numbers don't matter in modern combat when a single drone can kill dozens of your forces.
Numbers don't matter when large scale artillery makes them mist.
Numbers don't truly matter these days
 
Zachowon said:
Numbers don't matter in modern combat when a single drone can kill dozens of your forces.
Numbers don't matter when large scale artillery makes them mist.
Numbers don't truly matter these days
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Were going to see if your right or not, because that has been said before and proven wrong before.
 
Zachowon said:
How so?
Korea? When it was still ww2 tech for the most part in ground combat
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Korea is a good example yes, but theres also after world war 1 when people said numbers didn't matter.

Fact is that terrain, technology, and culture changes what works and doesn't work in combat all of the time, some times the defense has the lead sometimes the offense and saying numbers wont ever matter again has been proven wrong often enough that I wouldnt ever bet on it being a fixed rule.

Because war insists on being semi organized chaos.
 
Cherico said:
Korea is a good example yes, but theres also after world war 1 when people said numbers didn't matter.

Fact is that terrain, technology, and culture changes what works and doesn't work in combat all of the time, some times the defense has the lead sometimes the offense and saying numbers wont ever matter again has been proven wrong often enough that I wouldnt ever bet on it being a fixed rule.

Because war insists on being semi organized chaos.
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Numbers do not matter.
Not alone.
It matters of you have the tech and tactics to use it.

The US proved that numbers do not mean everything.
Castle itter.
A small team held off countless SS soldiers
 
Zachowon said:
Numbers do not matter.
Not alone.
It matters of you have the tech and tactics to use it.

The US proved that numbers do not mean everything.
Castle itter.
A small team held off countless SS soldiers
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The US also proved that numbers mean a fucking hell of a lot in that same war.

What made us terrifying was the amount of logistics and equipment we could bring to bear, so your kind of under cutting your argument there.
 
Cherico said:
The US also proved that numbers mean a fucking hell of a lot in that same war.

What made us terrifying was the amount of logistics and equipment we could bring to bear, so your kind of under cutting your argument there.
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Logistics is diffrent from pure numbers.
The US had more equipment then people.
Again, number if people means jack, being able to supply that large number efficiently is important
 
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