Armchair General's DonbAss Derailed Discussion Thread (Topics Include History, Traps, and the Ongoing Slavic Civil War plus much much more)

[TheRejectionist]

Russia can, and still probably will, conquer Ukraine, but given the causalities they've taken and the international response, I don't think you can spin that as a victory. That ship has sailed.

It's a bit too early to tell. I am more concerned after the war has ended.

 

[ATP]

Yeah, I think I said before that for every Ukrainian posturing with one after an alleged kill there are pics of a hell of a lot more captured by the Russians.
My theory was that they were actually shit, the Russians managed to counter them, or the simple truth is that the Ukrainian army is deserting or falling back in uncontrolled retreat.

Or all of the above.

My first thought when I saw the cope cage was WTF, my second after I heard that some of these things have heat seeking was, um, maybe that is a radiator?

Let say,that ukrainian army is deserting.Tell me,why russian army do not attacked and win then? either it not happened,or russians are dessering,too.
Or comrade colonel stopped them - he need bloody war,and KGB need russian army massacred,so they do not made putch and save Mother Russia from KGB mafias.
Which would work.

And is good for Europe - Putin could not conqer us later,and USA could nold sell Poland again to Moscow,let say to made alliance with China.

Ukrainians and russians are dying,but....when exactly anybody cared about dying russians or ukrainians? certainly not comrade Putin now.

 

[Bacle]

 

[Agent23]

Let say,that ukrainian army is deserting.Tell me,why russian army do not attacked and win then? either it not happened,or russians are dessering,too.
Or comrade colonel stopped them - he need bloody war,and KGB need russian army massacred,so they do not made putch and save Mother Russia from KGB mafias.
Which would work.

And is good for Europe - Putin could not conqer us later,and USA could nold sell Poland again to Moscow,let say to made alliance with China.

Ukrainians and russians are dying,but....when exactly anybody cared about dying russians or ukrainians? certainly not comrade Putin now.

I am just wondering how and why so much very expensive, very modern western tech keeps getting captured.

Knowing us Slavs, both sides might be pretend-fighting and reselling each-other weapons and ammo, then pocketing the bribes and prize money provided by central command and this might just be them grifting, pretending to work and getting drunk all day long... 😂
Or at least that is one nice dream I have when I try and stop thinking about the current mess we are all in.
After all these shenanigans I hope that Polandball finally learns that far-away allies are useless, and that they need more weapons and nukes.
Then just tell Putin to not bother them and they won't bother him and sign some type of mutual non-intervention treaty.

 

[Agent23]

Speaking of piracy, they made it legal for all software coming from hostile countries.

Hey, I will have you know that stealing IP from your enemy is a time-honored Slavic tactic ever since the Xth century.

We see as guideline, not as law!

 

[ATP]

I am just wondering how and why so much very expensive, very modern western tech keeps getting captured.

Knowing us Slavs, both sides might be pretend-fighting and reselling each-other weapons and ammo, then pocketing the bribes and prize money provided by central command and this might just be them grifting, pretending to work and getting drunk all day long... 😂
Or at least that is one nice dream I have when I try and stop thinking about the current mess we are all in.
After all these shenanigans I hope that Polandball finally learns that far-away allies are useless, and that they need more weapons and nukes.
Then just tell Putin to not bother them and they won't bother him and sign some type of mutual non-intervention treaty.

Both sides are corrupted,but not to that extend.
Problem with Putin - he started with blowing up his own people to provoke war in which he genocided 200k Czechens,and later broken all promises made to country other then China.

We could not have lasting deal with him.But,if he gave us 300 missiles with nukes/and codes to them/ then we could be good neighbours.Problem is - even if KGB agree to that,our ruling eunuch do not.Becouse they always do what USA want.Opposition is even worst,they always do what germans want.

Only hope - Holy Mary is Qeen of Poland,if we survive it would be only thanks to HER.

 

[AnimalNoodles]

did these idiots actually think they were going to be l33t operators and get equipped the same as Ukrainian citizens instead of being used as human anti-tank barriers?

 

[Bacle]

 

[LordsFire]

Anyway, here is Rickards on the causes of the war and the impact of it on the whole world:

This really comes across as either paid shilling on Russia's behalf, or someone who is so buried in Russian propaganda that he doesn't realize he should be asking to be paid for what he's saying.

Sure, he makes it sound polite and pleasant, but ultimately what the message coming across is 'It's the US and EU's fault that Russia is invading the Ukraine, and the economic sanctions are going to hurt the rest of the world more than Russia.'

Everything is the West's fault, and they're just going to hurt themselves more than the Russia with what they're doing. It's like a flashback from the pinkos during the Cold War, so buried in their socialist dogma that they can't understand anything outside of their narrative.

To be fair, it's not like he's talking complete nonsense; he raises relevant points about the back and forth of diplomacy and international politics, he just is putting the weight and emphasis on the wrong elements.

 

[Terthna]

This really comes across as either paid shilling on Russia's behalf, or someone who is so buried in Russian propaganda that he doesn't realize he should be asking to be paid for what he's saying.

Sure, he makes it sound polite and pleasant, but ultimately what the message coming across is 'It's the US and EU's fault that Russia is invading the Ukraine, and the economic sanctions are going to hurt the rest of the world more than Russia.'

Everything is the West's fault, and they're just going to hurt themselves more than the Russia with what they're doing. It's like a flashback from the pinkos during the Cold War, so buried in their socialist dogma that they can't understand anything outside of their narrative.

To be fair, it's not like he's talking complete nonsense; he raises relevant points about the back and forth of diplomacy and international politics, he just is putting the weight and emphasis on the wrong elements.

To you, it comes across that way. To me, it matches with a lot of what I already knew; the situation in Ukraine is the west's fault, and economic sanctions, much like protests, are useless. You don't have to believe that, but painting everyone who disagrees with you as a "socialist pinko" just demonstrates that you're not coming at this from a position of reason; you're coming at it from a position of faith, and you're lashing out at the non-believers who threaten your beliefs by refusing to share them.

Quite frankly, I think any hope for a rational discourse regarding what going down in Ukraine died long before any of us were born. Because this isn't about what's actually happening there now; it's about the Cold War, and people who could never accept that it was over.

 

[Agent23]

 

[Captain X]

I seriously have to wonder how many of you pro-Russia/Putin types are old enough to have spent any of your lives during the Cold War. I wasn't real old when the Soviet Union collapsed, just in the first few grades, but I still remember what that was like. I think you're going to have a taste of it yourselves, though.


ETA:

You know, I really have to wonder with some of you where your line is. What has to happen before you stop even bothering to stick up for Russia.

 

[PsihoKekec]

I seriously have to wonder how many of you pro-Russia/Putin types are old enough to have spent any of your lives during the Cold War. I wasn't real old when the Soviet Union collapsed, just in the first few grades, but I still remember what that was like. I think you're going to have a taste of it yourselves, though.

I'm glad you can see the bright side of it.

 

[TheRejectionist]

I seriously have to wonder how many of you pro-Russia/Putin types are old enough to have spent any of your lives during the Cold War. I wasn't real old when the Soviet Union collapsed, just in the first few grades, but I still remember what that was like. I think you're going to have a taste of it yourselves, though.


ETA:

You know, I really have to wonder with some of you where your line is. What has to happen before you stop even bothering to stick up for Russia.

I am young enough to remember your country trying to annihilate every inch of actual freedom, not the McFreedom. I am young to remember the United States destroyed 3 countries : Iraq, Syria, Lybia, Yemen. I am young enough to remember that your overthrow of legit governments didn't end with the Cold War.

Not to mention that as a Latin American passionate about history, I remember all of this :

Argentina	1890	Troops	Buenos Aires interests protected
Chile	1891	Troops	Marines clash with nationalist rebels
Haiti	1891	Troops	Black workers revolt on U.S.-claimed Navassa Island defeated
Nicaragua	1894	Troops	Month-long occupation of Bluefields
Panama	1895	Naval, troops	Marines land in Colombian province
Nicaragua	1896	Troops	Marines land in port of Corinto
Cuba	1898-	Naval, troops	Seized from Spain, U.S. still holds Navy base at Guantanamo
Puerto Rico	1898-	Naval, troops	Seized from Spain, occupation continues
Nicaragua	1898	Troops	Marines land at port of San Juan del Sur
Nicaragua	1899	Troops	Marines land at port of Bluefields
Honduras	1903	Troops	Marines intervene in revolution
Dominican Republic	1903-04	Troops	U.S. interests protected in Revolution
Cuba	1906-09	Troops	Marines land in democratic election
Nicaragua	1907	Troops	"Dollar Diplomacy" protectorate set up
Honduras	1907	Troops	Marines land during war with Nicaragua
Panama	1908	Troops	Marines intervene in election contest
Nicaragua	1910	Troops	Marines land in Bluefields and Corinto
Honduras	1911	Troops	U.S. interests protected in civil war
Cuba	1912	Troops	U.S. interests protected in Havana
Panama	1912	Troops	Marines land during heated election
Honduras	1912	Troops	Marines protect U.S. economic interests
Nicaragua	1912-33	Troops, bombing	20-year occupation, fought guerrillas
Mexico	1913	Naval	Americans evacuated during revolution
Dominican Republic	1914	Naval	Fight with rebels over Santo Domingo
Mexico	1914-18	Naval, troops	Series of interventions against nationalists
Haiti	1914-34	Troops, bombing	19-year occupation after revolts
Dominican Republic	1916-24	Troops	8-year Marine occupation
Cuba	1917-33	Troops	Military occupation, economic protectorate
Panama	1918-20	Troops	"Police duty" during unrest after elections
Honduras	1919	Troops	Marines land during election campaign
Guatemala	1920	Troops	2-week intervention against unionists
Costa Rica	1921	Troops
Panama	1921	Troops
Honduras	1924-25	Troops	Landed twice during election strife
Panama	1925	Troops	Marines suppress general strike
El Salvador	1932	Naval	Warships sent during Faribundo Marti revolt
Uruguay	1947	Nuclear threat	Bombers deployed as show of strength
Puerto Rico	1950	Command operation	Independence rebellion crushed in Ponce
Guatemala	1954-?	Command operation, bombing, nuclear threat	CIA directs exile invasion and coup d'Etat after newly elected government nationalizes unused U.S.'s United Fruit Company lands; bombers based in Nicaragua; long-term result: 200,000 murdered
Panama	1958	Troops	Flag protests erupt into confrontation
Cuba	1961	Command operation	CIA-directed exile invasion fails
Cuba	1962	Nuclear threat, naval	Blockade during missile crisis; near-war with Soviet Union
Panama	1964	Troops	Panamanians shot for urging canal's return
Dominican Republic	1965-66	Troops, bombing	Marines land during election campaign
Guatemala	1966-67	Command operation	Green Berets intervene against rebels
Chile	1973	Command operation	CIA-backed coup ousts democratically elected Marxist president
El Salvador	1981-92	Command operation, troops	Advisors, overflights aid anti-rebel war, soldiers briefly involved in hostage clash; long-term result: 75,000 murdered and destruction of popular movement
Nicaragua	1981-90	Command operation, naval	CIA directs exile (Contra) invasions, plants harbor mines against revolution; result: 50,000 murdered
Honduras	1982-90	Troops	Maneuvers help build bases near borders
Grenada	1983-84	Troops, bombing	Invasion four years after revolution
Bolivia	1987	Troops	Army assists raids on cocaine region
Panama	1989	Troops, bombing	Nationalist government ousted by 27,000 soldiers, leaders arrested, 2000+ killed
Haiti	1994-95	Troops, naval	Blockade against military government; troops restore President Aristide to office three years after coup
Venezuela	2002	Command operation	Failed coup attempt to remove left-populist president Hugo Chavez
Haiti	2004-	Troops	Removal of democratically elected President Aristide; troops occupy country
Honduras	2009	Command operation	Support for coup that removed president Manuel Zelaya

Sources:
Blum, William. Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventionism Since World War II. Monroe, Maine: Common Courage Press, 1995.
Ege & Makhijani. "180 Landings by the U.S. Marine Corps" (History Division), Counterspy (July-Aug. 1982). Foreign Affairs Division, Congressional Research Service, Library of Congress.
Instances of Use of Armed Forces Abroad, 1798-2020. CRS Report for Congress, 2020.
Grossman, Zoltan. Over a Century of U.S. Military Interventions. Self-published, revised Jan. 1, 1995.
Sklar, Holly. "Who's Who: Invading 'Our' Hemisphere 1831-," Z Magazine (Feb. 1990).
U.S. Congress, Committee on Foreign Affairs' Report. Background Information on the Use of United States Armed Forces in Foreign Countries. Washington, D.C.: 91st Congress, 2nd Session, 1970.
Zinn, Howard. A People's History of the United States. New York: Perennial Library, Harper & Row, 1980.
Zoltan Grossman, From Wounded Knee to Iraq (A Chronology of U.S. Imperialism)

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

• March 12, 1947 President Harry Truman proclaimed the Truman Doctrine, stating that the United States would support "free peoples who are resisting attempted subjugation by armed minorities or by outside pressures." The US gave $400 million in military and economic aid to Turkey and Greece to battle Communist insurgents in Greece in 1947 and prevent both countries from falling under the Soviet sphere of influence. (See Greek Civil War)
• Central Intelligence Agency involvement in Italian elections, involving propaganda and the alleged buying of votes, in order to prevent the Communist Party of Italy coming to power, in 1948. (See 1948 Italian election)
• 1948-1951 the United States contributed both economic and technical assistance toward the recovery of European countries after World War II, known as the Marshall Plan. Sixteen countries accept the aid, but most communist countries reject it.
• June 28 1948, the US flew supplies into the Western-held sectors of Berlin over the blockade during 1948-1949, known as the Berlin Airlift
• U.S. financial and military support of the Republic of China, that began during the Sino-Japanese War and through World War II, continued against the People's Liberation Army.

1950s

• Funding of French Indochina War from 1945 until 1954.
• Korean War from 1950 until 1953: After communist North Koreans invade South Korea, the UN, with every nation voting "yea" except for Yugoslavia that abstained, approves military support for South Korea, involving over a dozen countries including the US.
• U.S. (CIA) and UK (MI-6) succeed in removal of Prime Minister Mohammed Mossadegh of Iran (Operation Ajax) - 1953.[1]
• Food for Peace is established in 1954. Since the program started, it has sent over 100 million metric tons of American food to 150 countries, or about 3 billion people. This program with other US programs account for 60% of the world's total food aid.
• CIA-orchestrated overthrow of Jacobo Arbenz Guzmán in Guatemala (Operation PBSUCCESS) - 1954.
• U.S. support for President Ngo Dinh Diem of Vietnam from 1955 - 1963. [2]
• Lebanon crisis of 1958: The US assisted President Camille Chamoun when Pan-Arbists advocated by Egypt's president, Gamal Abdel Nasser, attempted to overthrow the Lebanese government.
• After the Chinese bombing of ancient monasteries at Chatreng and Litang that housed thousands of civilians in 1956 which violated the Plan for the Peaceful Liberation of Tibet, the CIA aided Chushi Gandrug and Tensung Dhanglang Magar's resistance movement.
• U.S. support for Cuban dictator Fulgencio Batista (amongst others against Marxist insurgents) until his unpopularity and impending overthrow becomes clear in 1959.
• Two assassination attempts of general Abdul Karim Qassim, president of Iraq, 1959 and 1963 (the second one succeeded).

1960s

• Peace Corps, an independent U.S. federal agency, was established in 1961. Within six years, Peace Corp was involved in education and agriculture related projects of 55 Third World countries. Over the years, the Peace Corps has expanded its mission to include improving education, health and HIV/AIDS, business, information technology, agriculture, and the environment in about 80 developing and underdeveloped countries and nations with a developing economy.
• U.S.-backed abortive Bay of Pigs Invasion of Cuba in 1961.
• CIA planning to assassinate Prime Minister Patrice Lumumba of the Congo. [3] [4] Belgium has since officially apologized for its own role in the affair. [5]
• CIA involvement in the assassination of Rafael Leónidas Trujillo, their former ally in the Dominican Republic, in 1961 [6] [7]
• Alleged CIA involvement in overthrow of Juan Bosch, the democratically elected leader of the Dominican Republic. [8]
• Alleged CIA-backed overthrow of José María Velasco Ibarra of Ecuador in 1963.
• U.S. backs coup against South Vietnamese President Ngo Dinh Diem in 1963. [9]
• CIA-backed overthrow of João Goulart in Brazil in 1964. [10] [11]
• CIA covert support for the election of Eduardo Frei Montalva of Chile in 1964.
• Alleged CIA-backed overthrow of Sukarno and subsequent support of Suharto in Indonesia in 1965. Former officials of the U.S. Embassy in Indonesia acknowledge supplying a list of 5,000 suspected communists -- given to them by the CIA -- to the Indonesian government and checking them off the list when those people were executed. The U.S. government also supplied 90% of Indonesia's military hardware.[12][13]
• Vietnam War - (1964–1975)
• Involvement in riots and violence that brought down the government of Cheddi Jagan in Guyana.
• Alleged CIA-backed military coup brings dictator Joseph Mobutu to power in the Congo in 1965.
• Alleged CIA support to military coup against Ghanaian leader Kwame Nkrumah in 1966.
• Alleged CIA-backed military coup ushers in Regime of the Colonels in Greece in 1967.
• American support for Israel in the 1967 Six-Day War.
• CIA-organized military operation ends in execution of Che Guevara in Bolivia in 1967.
• Beginning in 1968 the US bombed the Ho Chi Minh trail in Laos and Cambodia to disrupt the logistical support given to the Viet Cong by the North Vietnamese Army

1970s

• Alleged CIA-supported coup against Prince Sihanouk in Cambodia in 1970.
• Alleged CIA-supported military coup against President Juan José Torres of Bolivia in 1971.
• Support for Pakistan in the Bangladesh Liberation War.
• Political and economic intervention in Chile against president Salvador Allende; contacts with military officers planning to overthrow Allende.
• Support for Indonesian invasion and occupation of Portuguese Timor (now East Timor)(1975).
• CIA support for UNITA rebels in Angola, from 1976 - 1984.
• Approval and support for Argentina's "Dirty War". (1976-1983)
• U.S. backs and provides military funding to Salvadoran Armed Forces, civil-military junta, and President José Napoleón Duarte during country's civil war, (1979-89). [14]
• Following overthrow of the dictator Anastasio Somoza Debayle in Nicaragua by the Sandinistas, the CIA supports the Contras from 1979 - 1989. resolution. [15]
• Support of armed opposition parties, including Khmer Rouge, to Vietnamese-installed regime of Heng Samrin in Cambodia, 1979–1993.
• Alleged American intervention in civil war in Yemen, from 1979 - 1984.

1980s

• Alleged support for Romanian dictator Nicolae Ceaucescu, 1980s.
• CIA support for José Napoleón Duarte and other anti-Communist politicians alleged to have links with right-wing death squads.
• Provision of military assistance to Hissène Habré of Chad, leading to the overthrow of Libya-supported neutralist Goukouni Oueddei.
• Sale of small arms and weapons production materials to Iraq during the Iran-Iraq War
• Sale of arms to Iran (see Iran–Contra Affair)
• Training of Nicaraguan Contras and support to military regimes in Honduras, Guatemala, Panama, and South America during the 1980s.
• Alleged CIA support to Gwangju Massacre in 1980.
• Alleged CIA and South African backing to a coup attempt in the Seychelles in 1981.
• American support for Israel in the 1982 Lebanon War.
• Support for military dictator Efraín Ríos Montt in Guatemala {1982-1983.} Alleged CIA support for the coup that brought him into power.
• Invasion of Grenada, overthrow of Marxist government (Operation Urgent Fury) - 1983.
• Under CIA Director George H W Bush, provided funds, training and weapons (mainly Stinger missiles to thward Soviet air superiority - they were the real reason why the mujahadeen won the war)with help of other organisations (most of them are now 'terrorist' organisations) and the Pakistani Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) (secret services)
• Alleged involvement in the mysterious death of Samora Machel, President of Mozambique (1986).
• Support to coup against Timoci Bavadra, democratically elected Prime Minister of Fiji in 1987.
• In 1989, The US establishes Support for East European Democracy to help assist Poland and Hungary's transition into market-based democracies.
• Operation Just Cause: In late 1989, the US invaded Panama and arrested Manuel Noriega for drug trafficking after a U.S. Marine was killed and Noriega declared war against the US.

1990s

• Beginning in December 1989 until 1996 when the Liberian civil war ended, the United States attempted to get UN involved in negotiations. The UN refused. Meanwhile, the US provided humanitarian aid, including food and developmental aid.
• Intervention in Colombian civil war, 1990s
• Corruption of elections in Bulgaria in 1990 and in Albania in 1991 [16].
• Funding to the opposition presidential candidate, Violeta Barrios de Chamorro, in Sandinista-ruled Nicaragua. Chamorro won the election.
• After Iraq invades Kuwait in 1990, King Fahd, fearing Saudi Arabia would be Saddam Hussein's next target, invites U.S. troops to use the country as a base.
• UN-led Gulf War following Iraqi invasion of Kuwait, 1991
• When Mount Pinatubo erupted in 1991, the Volcano Disaster Assistance Program helped evacuate 75,000 people and $250 million to $375 million worth of equipment.
• Alleged U.S. Support for ousting Jean-Bertrand Aristide from Haiti, 1991 [17].
• U.S.-led UN sanctions against Iraq, from 1990 to 2003.
• The FREEDOM Support Act in 1992 amends Support for East European Democracy to include the new independent states of the former Soviet Union to aid their transition into market-based democracies.
• Operation Provide Relief, a 1992 US lead humanitarian relief for Somalia. After looting of the aid, it was reorganized as Operation Restore Hope, an American military operation with the support of the United Nations to deliver humanitarian aid and restore order to Somalia, that eventually lead to the Battle of Mogadishu in 1993.
• U.S. removal of Raoul Cedras from office in Haiti and temporary occupation of the country, 1993.
• Alleged support for Mexico in fighting the Zapatista Army of National Liberation, 1994.
• NATO bombing of Bosnian Serbs, 1995.
• Responding to the 1995 flood in North Korea that caused a famine, the US initially provided over $8 million in general humanitarian (China was the only country to initially contribute more aid). However, eight years later, the US has provided $644 million in aid to the country which comprises nearly 50% of the aid going to North Korea.
• U.S.-led bombing campaign, called Operation Desert Fox, against Iraq in enforcement of the UN designated No-Fly zones created to protect Kurds and Marsh Arabs, 1998.
• Iraq Liberation Act, 1998.
• Operation Infinite Reach: a US cruise missile strike on terrorist bases and targets in Afghanistan and Sudan, including the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory, after al Qaeda bombed two US embassies in 1998.
• NATO's bombing of Serbia in the Kosovo Conflict. Officially aimed at preventing ethnic cleansing of Albanians, 1999. During this bombing the Chinese embassy was hit. Some say this was done deliberately [18].

2000s

• U.S. invasion of Afghanistan, overthrow of Taliban when the government refuse to deliver Al-Qaida leaders located in the country after the September 11th attacks in 2001.
• Servicemen's Protection Act, called the Hague Invasion Act by critics 2002.
• Alleged CIA-backed abortive coup against democratically-elected President Hugo Chávez of Venezuela in 2002. [19]
• U.S. Invasion of Iraq, overthrow of Saddam Hussein, 2003
• Alleged American support in the overthrow of President Jean-Bertrand Aristide of Haiti in 2004. (see: 2004 Haiti rebellion) Also threatened Jamaica if it provided residence to Aristide.
• Alleged interference in Salvadoran presidential election. US threatened to take reprisals if the country would elect the socialist candidate Schafik Handal, 2004.
• Support to the Venezuelan opposition in the run-up to the referendum on Hugo Chávez' rule. Many elements were linked to the above-mentioned coup in 2002.
• Alleged support (along with Spain and Britain) for a failed coup plot against Teodoro Obiang Nguema Mbasogo of Equatorial Guinea in 2004. [20]
• Introduction of the Belarus Democracy Act. Also repeated meetings with opposition leaders and the addition of Belarus to the outposts of tyranny list

If the past and current events are any indication, your country's elite will tell the USAF to fuck violently another country because "Team America". You and the rest of the working class will have to pay the price.

But you seem to enjoy that idea for some weird reason.

 

[Captain X]

And yet you support Russia. I'm sure I could dig up a pretty long list of atrocities there. I'm sure I could dig up a pretty long one on Brazil, too. That isn't the point, though.

 

[PsihoKekec]

The point is that USA does it for freedom, everyone else does it for wrong reasons. Unless they are American allies, then they do it for right reasons as well.

 

[Captain X]

The point is that only fools would look at what is happening and think Russia is somehow in the right. Also only a fool would look to Russia as some kind of savior or defender of freedom. If any of you actually think that, I seriously have to wonder how you could legitimately be that stupid. I'd wonder if you were just pretending to be because you thought it was edgy or funny or something.

 

[strunkenwhite]

Frankly I think that the support for Yanukovych was a better indication as to who stood where in the Russia vs. West situation.

Yes, surely nothing has changed for the people of Ukraine since 2010.

 

[TheRejectionist]

And yet you support Russia. I'm sure I could dig up a pretty long list of atrocities there. I'm sure I could dig up a pretty long one on Brazil, too. That isn't the point, though.

I support Russia for the simple reason that they haven't fucked up over half of the world for the supremacy of the US elites.

I support Russia because hasn't chained my countries into an alliance that is more submission than genuine partnership.

I support Russia because they have been the ones offering equal partnerships, which were turn down since the elites might just treat my countries as banana republics if given the slightest of reasons.

All countries have atrocities.

But very few pretend it was for my muh freedom, muh terrorism.

The point is that USA does it for freedom, everyone else does it for wrong reasons. Unless they are American allies, then they do it for right reasons as well.

AND Muh freedom excuse has lost all credibility.

Freedom of what ? To have a colorful boot up my arse ? For my taxes to go to NATO expenses ? To have children conditioned or indoctrinated to accept and practice degenerate behaviors ? For the banks to have more sovereignity than people ? To still being censored or suicided because I have the wrong opinion?

 

[AnimalNoodles]

Even if Russia does win this war, and I think they will simply due to numbers, I honestly think it's going to be a massive Pyrrhic victory to the point of an actual strategic defeat.

There's going to be massive insurgencies all over the country, which is going to tie down Russia's forces and whatever patsies they put in power.
Ironically, that'd also mean that the breakaway 'states' and Crimea are going to be victim of this, too.

Russia has been made to bleed for this invasion in terms of resources, men, and equipment -- Much of that equipment, such as the more modern attack helicopters, cannot be easily if at all replaced. Hell, a lot of it is being abandoned and outright fucking stolen by Ukraine! If the inevitable insurgents get their hands on this stuff, Ukraine is going to be a second Afghanistan for the Russians.

Generals have been killed. Generals.

Public opinion in Russia is either for the war or against it, so there are massive social divides forming. Hell, a lot of Russians and Ukrainians are openly saying "why the fuck are we fighting?" -- including Russian troops!

Western companies, governments, and people have mostly turned against Russia completely -- Whatever "good imagery" they had in people's eyes is now gone. This stigma is going to last for decades.

This may mean Russia will have to turn to China -- Yeah, the Russians don't like or trust the Chinese either.

Russia's economy, already precarious, is hemorrhaging, and it's never been in the best shape to begin with!

The Russian oligarchs are losing money and influence. Putin may end up with a bullet in the back of the head one night if they all turn against him, which is becoming increasingly likely as time goes on.

Yeah, victory or not, it ain't gonna be good for Russia. smh

Russia doesnt want to occupy all of Ukraine. Thier goals are clear..neutralise Ukraine, pull off the russian speaking areas east of the Dnieper and secure the flow of water to the crimean.