Alternate History Ideas and Discussion

[ATP]

They will have to industrialize western Russia and the Urals faster.
Maybe this will free up some more of their energy to expand into the Caucasus and Siberia, and maybe they will prioritize taking the eastern Balkans and the Bosporus to secure their trade and prevent anyone digging too deeply into their heartland.

Industrialization - i do not belive so,they still had slaves.But taking more in Asia is probable - in 1830 they planned to take Khiva,and abadonned it till 1870 becouse of polish uprisings and Crimea war.
Here,they could take Khiva,and later go to Afganistan and maybe even India - we would have war with England,and nobody else,like with Crimea war.

 

[Zyobot]

'Post-WWI Russia Permanently Balkanized'.

 

[Skallagrim]

'Post-WWI Russia Permanently Balkanized'.

 

[Zyobot]

Eh, well, how much worse can a German victory be, really?

At least here, the USSR is butterflied, with the big trade-off I can think of being how nasty Imperial Germany was towards populations in the East (albeit, not in the "Exterminate them all!" sense the Third Reich was).

 

[Skallagrim]

Eh, well, how much worse can a German victory be, really?

At least here, the USSR is butterflied, with the big trade-off I can think of being how nasty Germany was towards populations in the East (albeit, not in the "Exterminate them all!" sense WW2 Germany was).

Who said anything about 'worse'? German victory[*] would be better for Ukrainians, Balts, Belarussians, Fins, Cossacks, and to some extent even for the Russians and the Poles.

Volga German statehood, perhaps?

Russia would just end up being truncated. Lots of balkanisation at the edges. It would suck for the Armenians, and maybe for the Georgians (depending on what the Ottomans can achieve), but the Kalmyks, Ossetians, Chechens, Avars, Dargins, Abkhazians & all sorts of other assorted muslim peoples from the Caucasus region would no doubt split off and go their merry way, too. Not to mention that there will probably be considerable chaos in Central Asia. (Great Turkestan allied to Germany and the Ottomans? Independent Mongolia and Manchuria under Japanese hegemony, with slow expansion Northward to follow?)

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[*] Ideally preceding the revolution, and occurring in such circumstances that Germany goes for peace with honour in the West and is thus motivated to make big gains at the expense of Russia.

 

[Zyobot]

All right, conceded.

Honestly, I'm inclined to think anything short of extermination or enslavement is mercy compared to 70 years of Soviet rule. Even then, ATL losers seem to either be better off (or at least, not much worse off) than their OTL counterparts.

 

[ATP]

All right, conceded.

Honestly, I'm inclined to think anything short of extermination or enslavement is mercy compared to 70 years of Soviet rule. Even then, ATL losers seem to either be better off (or at least, not much worse off) than their OTL counterparts.

Everytching except worst commies would be mercy compared to soviets.

But,we have few scenarios here:

1.Germans win and keep Russia balkanized - France,England and USA still exist here,and when germans get involved in stomping on another uprising,they would attack.
Considering that thanks to germans being germans everybody would hate them by that time,we would have WW2 win by Allies,and
1A Russia is still balkanized
1B somebody made Moscov great again.Probably USA - they,for unknown reasons,hated idea of independent nations and loved Moscov,no matter white or red.

2A.German lost,but so did soviets.No clear winner in civil war ,Japan take Siberia,and we have 10 russian states fighting each other.
2B german lost,soviets lost,USA finally install somebody in Moscov.

 

[Blasterbot]

If the germans won the east quicker they might be able to push for an end to the western front sooner. either through a stronger push in the west or just doing a white peace on that front and claiming that winning in the east was enough to their citizens. might be that they manage to avoid pulling in the USA at all if this happens soon enough. USA might stay on their side of the pond and no spread of commies or fascists in response to them. might not be a perfect timeline but that is a good one.

 

[ATP]

If the germans won the east quicker they might be able to push for an end to the western front sooner. either through a stronger push in the west or just doing a white peace on that front and claiming that winning in the east was enough to their citizens. might be that they manage to avoid pulling in the USA at all if this happens soon enough. USA might stay on their side of the pond and no spread of commies or fascists in response to them. might not be a perfect timeline but that is a good one.

Yes,they could win WW1 - but still lost WW2.Becouse they would rule Europe stealing from all nations and killing those who fight them,but still not genociding any nation - but,all nations would hate them.

So next war would be germany vs everybody - and they would lost it.

 

[Blasterbot]

Yes,they could win WW1 - but still lost WW2.Becouse they would rule Europe stealing from all nations and killing those who fight them,but still not genociding any nation - but,all nations would hate them.

So next war would be germany vs everybody - and they would lost it.

My thought was if they could white peace in the west and make gains in the east leading to an earlier end to the war the French and British would not be as inclined for a second go at things. admittedly things would be bad for Poland and the balkans. but not Soviet bad.

 

[49ersfootball]

Alternate History What Ifs:
1.) AZ Governor Bruce Babbitt (D) easily wins reelection to 3rd full 4-year term in 1986 with 61% of the statewide vote. What are the ramifications for the Grand Canyon State since it will butterfly Nutjob Mecham ?
2.) The Revolution against the Duvalier's fail badly in Haiti & an aggressive crackdown ensues against the opposition. How will the international community react ?
3.) Iran-Contra Scandal explodes during the midst of the 1986 Midterms with federal indictments & impeachment hearings against Reagan. Would Reagan's presidency survive before the end of 1986 ?

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Alternate History What Ifs:
1.) AZ Governor Bruce Babbitt (D) easily wins reelection to 3rd full 4-year term in 1986 with 61% of the statewide vote. What are the ramifications for the Grand Canyon State since it will butterfly Nutjob Mecham ?
2.) The Revolution against the Duvalier's fail badly in Haiti & an aggressive crackdown ensues against the opposition. How will the international community react ?
3.) Iran-Contra Scandal explodes during the midst of the 1986 Midterms with federal indictments & impeachment hearings against Reagan. Would Reagan's presidency survive before the end of 1986 ?

Possible torpedoing of Bush SR presidency, leading to either Dole or Dukakis becoming President?

 

[johnreiter]

If the Nazis had invented the Atomic bomb in February of 1944, and had 2 bombs to deploy on the allies, where would/could they have used them?

 

[49ersfootball]

Possible torpedoing of Bush SR presidency, leading to either Dole or Dukakis becoming President?

Babbitt vs Bush 41 in 1988 would be juicy.

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Babbitt vs Bush 41 in 1988 would be juicy.

Wouldn't Bush SR also be implicated by the Iran-Contra Scandal too?

 

[Buba]

If the Nazis had invented the Atomic bomb in February of 1944, and had 2 bombs to deploy on the allies, where would/could they have used them?

Moscow and London.
Next question

 

[49ersfootball]

Wouldn't Bush SR also be implicated by the Iran-Contra Scandal too?

What If Scenario:
1.) 1986 Midterms results in vicious backlash against the GOP.
2.) Reagan impeached by the Dem-controlled US House of Representatives.
3.) Sensing the United States Senate would potentially vote to convict, Reagan announces in early December 1986 resigns from the Presidency.
4.) Bush 41 pardons Reagan & seeks full term in 1988.
5.) Babbitt becomes the Democratic Party presidential nominee in 1988 & aggressively ties Bush 41 to the Iran Contra Scandals.
6.) Does Bush 41 employ Atwater to use the Willie Horton commercials against Babbitt ?

 

[ATP]

My thought was if they could white peace in the west and make gains in the east leading to an earlier end to the war the French and British would not be as inclined for a second go at things. admittedly things would be bad for Poland and the balkans. but not Soviet bad.

Everytching is better then soviets - except other commies.

germans in theory could made white peace on West - but,they are germans,so they would never do that.That would do something which made them french and England hate them - which would let to lost WW2.

 

[Zyobot]

'FDR And His Cabinet To 1861'.

Say ASB brainwashes the public into his accepting his presidency, making it all the easier as FDR leads the Union into war with the Confederacy.

 

[Buba]

'FDR And His Cabinet To 1861'.

FDR leads the Union into war with the Confederacy.

Would he? He is a Democrat and AFAIK he did not lift a pinkie against Jim Crow.
Also - he kicks the bucket inside a few months without modern meds.