Israel ðŸ‡®ðŸ‡± State of Israel Thread

Marduk

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Till 1948,and even 1956,arabs supported USA.Then USA supported Izrael for free,and in exchange turned arab countries into enemies.It is good to knew,that exist country more stupid then Poland.
What kind of history did you learn? USA started to support Israel during the 60's.
Egypt started siding with the Soviet block in mid 50's, that's how their army was stocked with Soviet gear in the 1956 war. Coincidence?
Arabs never supported USA. Arabs wanted to stay neutral, play the superpowers against each other and do their own thing, while preferably double dipping aid from all.
 

King Arts

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What kind of history did you learn? USA started to support Israel during the 60's.
Egypt started siding with the Soviet block in mid 50's. Coincidence?
Arabs never supported USA. Arabs wanted to stay neutral, play the superpowers against each other and do their own thing, while preferably double dipping aid from all.
I mean you are both right. The Arabs did want to not get involved in the Cold War except to get money from both sides. However America supported Israel from the start Henry Truman was literally the first person to recognize Israel a few minutes after its founding.
 

ATP

Well-known member
What kind of history did you learn? USA started to support Israel during the 60's.
Egypt started siding with the Soviet block in mid 50's, that's how their army was stocked with Soviet gear in the 1956 war. Coincidence?
Arabs never supported USA. Arabs wanted to stay neutral, play the superpowers against each other and do their own thing, while preferably double dipping aid from all.

And in 1956 USA helped Egypt against Izrael aggression.And Egypt never attacked USA,till they start paing Izrael for making arab countries american enemies.
Pay for turning friends into enemies - it is something new in politic.And i applaud Izrael for making USA their property,it was well done.
 

Marduk

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And in 1956 USA helped Egypt against Izrael aggression.And Egypt never attacked USA,till they start paing Izrael for making arab countries american enemies.
Exactly. And how did Egypt thank for that?
By... siding with Soviets. Because Egypt was more more interested in fighting with Brits than with Soviets. Obviously that couldn't be accepted in Cold War.
So there you have it, why USA eventually allied with Israel instead of staying neutral - Egypt paid for the aid with betrayal.

Caffery was consistently very positive about Nasser in his reports to Washington right up until his departure from Cairo in 1955. The regime of King Farouk was viewed in Washington as weak, corrupt, unstable, and anti-American, so the Free Officers' July coup was welcomed by the United States.[52] As it was, Nasser's contacts with the CIA were not necessary to prevent British intervention against the July coup as Anglo-Egyptian relations had deteriorated so badly in 1951–52 that the British viewed any Egyptian government not headed by King Farouk as a huge improvement.[60] In May 1953, during a meeting with Secretary Dulles, who asked Egypt to join an anti-Soviet alliance, Nasser responded by saying that the Soviet Union has


never occupied our territory ... but the British have been here for seventy years. How can I go to my people and tell them I am disregarding a killer with a pistol sixty miles from me at the Suez Canal to worry about somebody who is holding a knife a thousand miles away?[49]

Dulles informed Nasser of his belief that the Soviet Union was seeking world conquest, that the principal danger to the Near East came from the Kremlin, and urged Nasser to set aside his differences with Britain to focus on countering the Soviet Union.[49] In this spirit, Dulles suggested that Nasser negotiate a deal that would see Egypt assume sovereignty over the canal zone base, but then allow the British to have "technical control" in the same way that Ford auto company provided parts and training to its Egyptian dealers.[49]

Nasser did not share Dulles's fear of the Soviet Union taking over the Middle East, and insisted quite vehemently that he wanted to see the total end of all British influence not only in Egypt, but all the Middle East.[49] The CIA offered Nasser a $3 million bribe if he would join the proposed Middle East Defense Organization; Nasser took the money, but then refused to join.[61] At most, Nasser made it clear to the Americans that he wanted an Egyptian-dominated Arab League to be the principal defence organisation in the Near East, which might be informally associated with the United States.
Israel was also approached by Soviets too in its early days (see: Czechoslovakian weapon imports in 1949), but in the end it was stuck with the west, and so the alliances ended up as they did.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Exactly. And how did Egypt thank for that?
By... siding with Soviets. Because Egypt was more more interested in fighting with Brits than with Soviets. Obviously that couldn't be accepted in Cold War.
So there you have it, why USA eventually allied with Israel instead of staying neutral - Egypt paid for the aid with betrayal.


Israel was also approached by Soviets too in its early days (see: Czechoslovakian weapon imports in 1949), but in the end it was stuck with the west, and so the alliances ended up as they did.

Izrael get czech weapons from Sralin,becouse in that times jews served Sralin - for example,in Poland they ruled and murdered for being polish patriot.That changed,when Sralin decided purge them just in case.Idiot,they served him well.

Egypt fighted with brits - exactly,as USA.Becouse for USA destroing british colonial empire in that times was more important then fighting soviets - which,to be honest,they did seriously only when Reagan ruled.Result - end of soviet union.
Every american president before could do the same.Idiots,i am not suprised that jews own them.

So,USA could not support Izrael 2.0 and have peace with muslim nations,with cheap oil.They decide to support Izrael,result -
11.9.2001,war on terror,Iraq and Afganistan destroyed only to be gave to islamists there,christians in Iraq who lived there almost from Jesus times destroyed.
But Izrael is payed by USA,so somebody at least get something from that shit.
 

Marduk

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Izrael get czech weapons from Sralin,becouse in that times jews served Sralin - for example,in Poland they ruled and murdered for being polish patriot.That changed,when Sralin decided purge them just in case.Idiot,they served him well.

Egypt fighted with brits - exactly,as USA.Becouse for USA destroing british colonial empire in that times was more important then fighting soviets - which,to be honest,they did seriously only when Reagan ruled.Result - end of soviet union.
Every american president before could do the same.Idiots,i am not suprised that jews own them.
The idea was that if USA helps the Brit colonies gain independence relatively peacefully they will be grateful and side with the west against Soviets, instead of Soviets launching revolutions and helping them overthrow the colonial powers and gaining independence as commie Soviet allies.
Egypt is just one of examples how that didn't work exactly as intended.
So,USA could not support Izrael 2.0 and have peace with muslim nations,with cheap oil.They decide to support Izrael,result -
Osama did not attack USA over Israel support alone, he had a whole list of reasons, he was an Islamist, not Arab Nationalist.
Why did Osama Bin Laden attack US
In Osama bin Laden's November 2002 "Letter to America" he explicitly stated al-Qaeda's motives for their attacks, blaming the "Zionist crusader alliance and their collaborators" for aggression against Muslims in many countries including Somalia, Bosnia Herzegovina, and the Qana massacre in Lebanon.
Grievances that were mentioned by bin Laden include the presence of US troops in Saudi Arabia, the US support of Israel, and sanctions against Iraq after the latter's attack on Kuwait.
Laden's purpose also revolved around changing power equations in the Middle East and triggering regime changes. He was of the view that "America is weak", given how through the 1980s-1990s the US had withdrawn from Vietnam, Lebanon and Somalia.
WTF do Bosnia and Somalia have to do with Israel?

11.9.2001,war on terror,Iraq and Afganistan destroyed only to be gave to islamists there,christians in Iraq who lived there almost from Jesus times destroyed.
But Izrael is payed by USA,so somebody at least get something from that shit.
USA could not destroy Afghanistan, read up what a shithole it was before 2001, there wasn't much to destroy even if they wanted to. It was run by exactly the same islamists that regained power now. Just like Iraq, it was fucked up because Bush and his advisors were not very smart, but smart enough to make money on the side. In Iraq this combined with Saddam also not being very smart, so between his Kuwait blunder and scare tactics against Iran (in which he in fact was useful in current perspective) being good enough to fool Bush too.
In Afghanistan Bush at first realized the problem (aka Pakistan) and threatened them, but Pakistan outsmarted him and started to roleplay as ally to America, which American politicians either fell for, got bribed to, or couldn't PR their way out of, either way they refused to call Pakistan's bullshit no matter what, even when it turned out Pakistan is sheltering Osama himself. In practice Afghan Taliban doesn't exist without Pakistani military intelligence, but no one wants to touch that because Pakistan is a nuclear power with many islamic terrorist friends.
 

Zachowon

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The idea was that if USA helps the Brit colonies gain independence relatively peacefully they will be grateful and side with the west against Soviets, instead of Soviets launching revolutions and helping them overthrow the colonial powers and gaining independence as commie Soviet allies.
Egypt is just one of examples how that didn't work exactly as intended.

Osama did not attack USA over Israel support alone, he had a whole list of reasons, he was an Islamist, not Arab Nationalist.

WTF do Bosnia and Somalia have to do with Israel?


USA could not destroy Afghanistan, read up what a shithole it was before 2001, there wasn't much to destroy even if they wanted to. It was run by exactly the same islamists that regained power now. Just like Iraq, it was fucked up because Bush and his advisors were not very smart, but smart enough to make money on the side. In Iraq this combined with Saddam also not being very smart, so between his Kuwait blunder and scare tactics against Iran (in which he in fact was useful in current perspective) being good enough to fool Bush too.
In Afghanistan Bush at first realized the problem (aka Pakistan) and threatened them, but Pakistan outsmarted him and started to roleplay as ally to America, which American politicians either fell for, got bribed to, or couldn't PR their way out of, either way they refused to call Pakistan's bullshit no matter what, even when it turned out Pakistan is sheltering Osama himself. In practice Afghan Taliban doesn't exist without Pakistani military intelligence, but no one wants to touch that because Pakistan is a nuclear power with many islamic terrorist friends.
We kicked ass militarily every damn conflict we have been in.



Fucking PR, and laws of war...../s
 

ATP

Well-known member
The idea was that if USA helps the Brit colonies gain independence relatively peacefully they will be grateful and side with the west against Soviets, instead of Soviets launching revolutions and helping them overthrow the colonial powers and gaining independence as commie Soviet allies.
Egypt is just one of examples how that didn't work exactly as intended.

Osama did not attack USA over Israel support alone, he had a whole list of reasons, he was an Islamist, not Arab Nationalist.

WTF do Bosnia and Somalia have to do with Israel?


USA could not destroy Afghanistan, read up what a shithole it was before 2001, there wasn't much to destroy even if they wanted to. It was run by exactly the same islamists that regained power now. Just like Iraq, it was fucked up because Bush and his advisors were not very smart, but smart enough to make money on the side. In Iraq this combined with Saddam also not being very smart, so between his Kuwait blunder and scare tactics against Iran (in which he in fact was useful in current perspective) being good enough to fool Bush too.
In Afghanistan Bush at first realized the problem (aka Pakistan) and threatened them, but Pakistan outsmarted him and started to roleplay as ally to America, which American politicians either fell for, got bribed to, or couldn't PR their way out of, either way they refused to call Pakistan's bullshit no matter what, even when it turned out Pakistan is sheltering Osama himself. In practice Afghan Taliban doesn't exist without Pakistani military intelligence, but no one wants to touch that because Pakistan is a nuclear power with many islamic terrorist friends.

1.USA still helped soviets again british.French,too - in 1953 they could save them in Vietnam by selling 20 bombers,but choosen support commies.Idiots.Truly,they deserved to be ruled by jews.

2.Osama without USA supporting Izrael would get less money.And probably attack somebody else.Besides,he had nothing to do with Afganistan or Iraq anyway.

3.Bosnia is problem becouse USA attacked Serbia,and nobody care about Somalia.

4.In Afganistan nothing changed for much money and lives spend,in Iraq USA removed christians living there from apostols times.Both wars were unnecessary,becouse nor talibans nor Saddam had anything to do with Osama.
Both could be avoided if USA do not followed Izrael.

All in all - USA from 60 years are paing Izrael to be hated by all muslims and engage in lost wars.Some muslims would hate them anyway - but not majority.And all money wasted on Izrael would be still in USA.
 

Marduk

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1.USA still helped soviets again british.French,too - in 1953 they could save them in Vietnam by selling 20 bombers,but choosen support commies.Idiots.Truly,they deserved to be ruled by jews.
Yes, in the end this was a dumb plan that didn't work, and so there is a good chance it was pushed by the commie sympathisers in US administration.
2.Osama without USA supporting Izrael would get less money.And probably attack somebody else.Besides,he had nothing to do with Afganistan or Iraq anyway.
Stop making your own theories about what Osama wanted or cared about and instead read his own damn manifesto.
Or at least a list of his statements.

Why do you guess what he wanted or cared about when you have the power of the internet and abiltity to read the man's own words?
Yes, he did have a thing with Iraq, specifically he had a problem with post-Kuwait sanctions against Iraq, and he had enough of a problem with them to put it into his letter.
He also had a thing with Afghanistan, starting with his butt hiding there, and ending with praising the way it was run as a proper islamic state.
3.Bosnia is problem becouse USA attacked Serbia,and nobody care about Somalia.
Osama cared, as evidenced by him listing that alongside his other grievances.
Also Osama was eager to throw Russia and USA in the same bad regarding Balkans as infidels. Notably he also mentions India alongside them in his grievances.
4.In Afganistan nothing changed for much money and lives spend,in Iraq USA removed christians living there from apostols times.
Not USA, islamists.

Both wars were unnecessary,becouse nor talibans nor Saddam had anything to do with Osama.
Saddam had nothing to do. Taliban were openly sheltering Osama, and when Americans intervened to get him, Taliban's managers in Pakistan sheltered him instead, so they had a lot to do with him.

Both could be avoided if USA do not followed Izrael.
Pure speculation.

All in all - USA from 60 years are paing Izrael to be hated by all muslims and engage in lost wars.Some muslims would hate them anyway - but not majority.And all money wasted on Izrael would be still in USA.
India is not supporting Israel and is hated by them too. Soviets were supporting Arabs against Israel but they were hated too.
 

Zachowon

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I mean, Poland supports Palestinian independence as far as I can tell.
So perhaps his own worls view is slightly skewed?
 

ATP

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I mean, Poland supports Palestinian independence as far as I can tell.
So perhaps his own worls view is slightly skewed?

Nope,we do not care about Palestina one way or another,as long as we have no problems in Holy Land.
And our goverment was doing everything Izrael wonted without breaking the law.Then Izrael recalled ambassador.Serve our idiots right.

About what @Marduk said -
Osama would probably hit USA,but maybe somebody else.And nobody else in muslim world would attack USA,if they do not pay Izrael.
USA removed Saddam,so they are responsible for islamist removing christians there.
minority of muslims would hate USA no matter what,but rest no.USA paid for being hated by all muslims.Idiots.
And i admire jews for owning Izrael,they showed much skill there.
 

Zachowon

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Nope,we do not care about Palestina one way or another,as long as we have no problems in Holy Land.
And our goverment was doing everything Izrael wonted without breaking the law.Then Izrael recalled ambassador.Serve our idiots right.

About what @Marduk said -
Osama would probably hit USA,but maybe somebody else.And nobody else in muslim world would attack USA,if they do not pay Izrael.
USA removed Saddam,so they are responsible for islamist removing christians there.
minority of muslims would hate USA no matter what,but rest no.USA paid for being hated by all muslims.Idiots.
And i admire jews for owning Izrael,they showed much skill there.
Poland supports the two state policy. Both Isreal and Palestine
 

Zachowon

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Which is basically just support for continued conflict in the region, because Palestine will never accept any solution that doesn't involved the death of every Jew.
Poland acknowledged Palestine exists and is an independent nation
 

ATP

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Poland acknowledged Palestine exists and is an independent nation

Becouse it is what UN agreed on.Are you want us to break international law,like Izrael? we have no H bombs and do not own USA,so we could not do that.
If we ever get it,we could consider your proposal.

Which not change fact,that from 1960 USA are paing Izrael so all muslims could hate them.
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
Becouse it is what UN agreed on.Are you want us to break international law,like Izrael? we have no H bombs and do not own USA,so we could not do that.
If we ever get it,we could consider your proposal.

Which not change fact,that from 1960 USA are paing Izrael so all muslims could hate them.
UN is a scam.
So you are saying the rest of western Europe are breaking international law?
 

History Learner

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Which is basically just support for continued conflict in the region, because Palestine will never accept any solution that doesn't involved the death of every Jew.

Thank you for admitting you have no idea what is actually going on in the region and are a dupe for really shitty propaganda.
 

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