source please. I have not seen any sort of study since academia and algorithms suppress anything related to it.
My understanding of it is that conservatives are tired of regretful ex-Democrats saddling on up, and deciding that they should be in charge. The vast majority of said ex-Democrats still hold basically nothing in common with them. The ex-Democrats still believe in liberal dogma, they still hold to leftist values. Despite this, said ex-Democrats sure do insist that in order to get their support conservatives need to change pretty much every right wing policy to be the Democrat policy from about ten years ago. Said ex-Democrats then get increasingly shrill when they are told that their policies are totally incongruent with basic core conservative values and if adopted as they insist would fundamentally shatter the conservative base. This makes ex-Democrats come across as either saboteurs, grifters or opportunists.I don't see how you could have; on this forum alone conservatives are increasingly insulting people they disagree with, calling them stupid, enemy shills/sympathizers, and worse.
There are more Independents than Dems or GOP base; appealing only to a hardcore base of trad-cons won't win elections.My understanding of it is that conservatives are tired of regretful ex-Democrats saddling on up, and deciding that they should be in charge. The vast majority of said ex-Democrats still hold basically nothing in common with them. The ex-Democrats still believe in liberal dogma, they still hold to leftist values. Despite this, said ex-Democrats sure do insist that in order to get their support conservatives need to change pretty much every right wing policy to be the Democrat policy from about ten years ago. Said ex-Democrats then get increasingly shrill when they are told that their policies are totally incongruent with basic core conservative values and if adopted as they insist would fundamentally shatter the conservative base. This makes ex-Democrats come across as either saboteurs, grifters or opportunists.
You don't have a party without a base. Period. You can emphasize or play down different parts of the base to attract unaffiliated voters, but unaffiliated voters don't decide what the base is. This is people fleeing the harsh taxes and insane civil governing of California for other states, then insisting on the same policies that created what they left.There are more Independents than Dems or GOP base; appealing only to a hardcore base of trad-cons won't win elections.
In fact, without ex-Dems and and Independents voting R, the GOP would have little to no power as is.
Trad-cons can bitch all they want about ex-Dems and Independents having a say in what stances and platforms the GOP takes, but they won't get any shit they want without us.
Edit: The Dems and Left, even in their hardcore base, seem to understand the power of Independent voters and why they cannot win without them. If the hardcore base of the Right cannot understand the same and only wants a purity spiral, then the GOP will not have much power at all.
You knew what the conservative base was well before you went to them. If you can't close your eyes to the parts you disagree with in favor of the parts you do, then vote independent or start a third party. Politics is the art of choosing which compromises to make. Again, unaffiliated or ex-Democrats voters are the supplicants, not the conservatives.I honestly think us more moderate types would be better off forming a party of our own, and simply forming a coalition with other parties which are not authoritarians to fight said authoritarians. It would be nice, in the meantime, if conservatives could save arguing about evolution until after we've kicked the commies out of the government and other institutions, though.
Yeah, this is exactly what I'm getting at. I'd also point out that us more moderate types shouldn't be the only ones expected to compromise. After all, this is the lament of the gun rights' side when discussing how all the "compromises" made on that front have only ever been one-sided.You knew what the conservative base was well before you went to them. If you can't close your eyes to the parts you disagree with in favor of the parts you do, then vote independent or start a third party. Politics is the art of choosing which compromises to make. Again, unaffiliated or ex-Democrats voters are the supplicants, not the conservatives.
It's not that anyone is at risk of being pushed back to the other side, it's that the refusal to set aside what are, realistically speaking, minor differences, in the face of an existential threat, will only leave us divided and much easier for the other side to conquer.If meaningless ideological differences like evolution is enough to push you back to the marxism of the Left, well you're likely a bad fit to begin with. One is counting angels on pin heads, the other is counting all the money you now owe the government.
In fact, without ex-Dems and and Independents voting R, the GOP would have little to no power as is.
If you walk into a church it's going to have crosses all over the place. If you walk into a right wing organization it's going to be at least moderately religious. Insisting that the crosses need to go isn't a compromise, it's missing the point. Maybe don't pick fights with the organization you're looking to join and influence? I swear ex-Democrats feel like they gotta engage and agree with every part of a platform, that can only happen in a party you found yourself.Yeah, this is exactly what I'm getting at. I'd also point out that us more moderate types shouldn't be the only ones expected to compromise. After all, this is the lament of the gun rights' side when discussing how all the "compromises" made on that front have only ever been one-sided.
It's not that anyone is at risk of being pushed back to the other side, it's that the refusal to set aside what are, realistically speaking, minor differences, in the face of an existential threat, will only leave us divided and much easier for the other side to conquer.
If meaningless ideological differences like evolution is enough to push you back to the marxism of the Left, well you're likely a bad fit to begin with. One is counting angels on pin heads, the other is counting all the money you now owe the government.
The theory of evolution and support for it is not a 'meaningless ideological difference', nor is it at odds with anything except young earth creationism.If you walk into a church it's going to have crosses all over the place. If you walk into a right wing organization it's going to be at least moderately religious. Insisting that the crosses need to go isn't a compromise, it's missing the point. Maybe don't pick fights with the organization you're looking to join and influence? I swear ex-Democrats feel like they gotta engage and agree with every part of a platform, that can only happen in a party you found yourself.
My understanding of it is that conservatives are tired of regretful ex-Democrats saddling on up, and deciding that they should be in charge. The vast majority of said ex-Democrats still hold basically nothing in common with them. The ex-Democrats still believe in liberal dogma, they still hold to leftist values. Despite this, said ex-Democrats sure do insist that in order to get their support conservatives need to change pretty much every right wing policy to be the Democrat policy from about ten years ago. Said ex-Democrats then get increasingly shrill when they are told that their policies are totally incongruent with basic core conservative values and if adopted as they insist would fundamentally shatter the conservative base. This makes ex-Democrats come across as either saboteurs, grifters or opportunists.
There are more Independents than Dems or GOP base; appealing only to a hardcore base of trad-cons won't win elections.
In fact, without ex-Dems and and Independents voting R, the GOP would have little to no power as is.
Trad-cons can bitch all they want about ex-Dems and Independents having a say in what stances and platforms the GOP takes, but they won't get any shit they want without us.
Edit: The Dems and Left, even in their hardcore base, seem to understand the power of Independent voters and why they cannot win without them. If the hardcore base of the Right cannot understand the same and only wants a purity spiral, then the GOP will not have much power at all.
-Snip-
Very well-said.
Coming in to prove exactly Wargamer's point.
The Conservative right has had a general outlook and policy since at least the time of Reagan:
We don't compromise on core principles to win votes. We convince others that our position will in fact benefit them as well as us, and win them over to the truth instead.
We may compromise on side issues, like drug legalization, or going for serious welfare reform instead of removing it altogether, but we aren't compromising on God, Family, and small government. If you can't understand that those are the core principles of American conservatism, then either pick us as the lesser evil compared to the left, or as Wargamer said, go form your own party.
I'd love a viable third party, because fuck the two party system.Bacle, there's a problem with what you're saying, and it's not just my Blackpilled ass noticing it.
If you really beleve something, you should not compromise. Not at all. If somebody convinces you there's more going on, sure you should re-think it a bit, but it you're sure, you should not bend an inch.
We're not political party hacks, Bacle. We're not the GOP, or the LOLbertarians. We're not the people who need to win votes. We're just talking with people we're acquainted with, here, on a free site.
There's quite a bit we agree with you on. But, we can, and do, choose to stand with our actual beliefs, whether some people like it or not. That that's only possible on a site that is both Free Speech and Right aligned, well, that says terrible things.
You don't want to compromise your beliefs, fine, I can respect that; just understand that if the GOP decides to make the theory of evolution the hill it wants to fight on, and lose on, again, you can do it without the support of the Independents. What will happen is trad-cons will be primaried out more and more, they will lose more and more of the shrinking hold they have on the modern, populist Right, and will fade away into irrelevancy.
Missing the point would be saying that I'm telling you to hide your crosses when all I'm asking is that you save shit like pulling out the Young Earth Creationism until after the shit with the commies is settled. I'm also suggesting that rather than all joining one party, that we instead separate into parties more suited to our actual platforms and simply cooperate on things we actually all agree on (like kicking the Commies out) so you don't have to whine about ex-Democrats trying to take over your party. Not that I've ever been a Democrat, incidentally.If you walk into a church it's going to have crosses all over the place. If you walk into a right wing organization it's going to be at least moderately religious. Insisting that the crosses need to go isn't a compromise, it's missing the point. Maybe don't pick fights with the organization you're looking to join and influence? I swear ex-Democrats feel like they gotta engage and agree with every part of a platform, that can only happen in a party you found yourself.
Missing the point would be saying that I'm telling you to hide your crosses when all I'm asking is that you save shit like pulling out the Young Earth Creationism until after the shit with the commies is settled.
I kind of mixed up threads. One of these other threads has a post about some Republican going on about it. It makes things awkward for those of us who aren't creationists to have would-be allies essentially use the fact the lefties are pushing CRT and sexually grooming children as an excuse to push their fundamentalism - "roll everything back" essentially.
It might not be, but you still have people on here who are arguing that point. Meanwhile I'd rather just let schools teach basic biology and not have any kind of ideological indoctrination going on.Still, I wonder if the Creationism talk is as common as all that. If it's a tiny, tiny minority of GOP, the Media could make a massive deal about it, even if there was no way it'd happen.