Star Wars What if these people joined the Rebellion.

[Bacle]

Yeah, if Vader was as powerful as people claim, the Falcon would never have gotten off Hoth, nor would have Vader's TIE gone out of control merely by being clipped by a panicked wingman.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

Aight, where's that fucken picture...ah yes...

Big daddy Vader gonna pimp slap some men in spandex.

 

[Spartan303]

No, but he did lose to Obi-Wan rather definitively and barely managed to beat Ahsoka in rebels so he's not Superman to their Jimmy Olsen, he's an Olympic athlete silver medalist to their bronze medalist. Meanwhile Cap, Master Chief, and Batman are accustomed to fighting gold medalists like Thanos, The Promethian, and Darkseid.

Further it's often bandied about that having his limbs and organs replaced with machines dramatically weakened him from being a top-notch force wielder.

He didn't barely manage to beat Ashoka, he straight up beat her handily and would have killed her had it not been for Ezra pulling a magical Mcguffin out of his ass. All evidence suggests had Ezra not done so then Ashoka would be dead.

Yes she held up for a time and yes she stuck him the face...but his attention was focused more on the Holocron than her. Vader did not have the same burning hatred for her that he had for Kenobi. If anything he seemed saddened and resigned to it. As much as Vader ever can be about these things.

 

[Zachowon]

Yeah, if Vader was as powerful as people claim, the Falcon would never have gotten off Hoth, nor would have Vader's TIE gone out of control merely by being clipped by a panicked wingman.

He let the Flacon escape, and he single hadnedly took out I think it was...Two squadrons of rebel fighters. I can go get he scans.
Oh he can also pick up pieces of metal larger then Chief...

 

[Bear Ribs]

He didn't barely manage to beat Ashoka, he straight up beat her handily and would have killed her had it not been for Ezra pulling a magical Mcguffin out of his ass. All evidence suggests had Ezra not done so then Ashoka would be dead.

Yes she held up for a time and yes she stuck him the face...but his attention was focused more on the Holocron than her. Vader did not have the same burning hatred for her that he had for Kenobi. If anything he seemed saddened and resigned to it. As much as Vader ever can be about these things.

The creators do not share your optimistic appraisal of the situation.



Ahsoka is not a pushover to Vader. -Dave Filoni



"Ahsoka will handle some business."
"Don't think Ahsoka's gonna get owned. Yeah, Ahsoka's, I would say like top 3/4, as far as fighting combat skills, Jedi of all time."

She hit him. In the face. With a lightsaber. And flayed his mask open. And this fighting was on top of a massive Dark Side nexus that was powering Vader up, and with her own emotions compromised given her reaction to realizing he was Anakin.

There is no fight where your skilled opponent hits you in the face with a lightsaber yet you were handily owning them.

He let the Flacon escape, and he single hadnedly took out I think it was...Two squadrons of rebel fighters. I can go get he scans.
Oh he can also pick up pieces of metal larger then Chief...

He let the Falcon escape. And then spent the rest of the movie pursuing them through an asteroid field. And paying bounty hunters to catch them. And killing Captain Needa for losing them. And following them to Cloud City. But you think he let them escape on purpose.

Your Darth Vader is a complete frikkin' moron.

 

[Bacle]

He let the Flacon escape, and he single hadnedly took out I think it was...Two squadrons of rebel fighters. I can go get he scans.
Oh he can also pick up pieces of metal larger then Chief...

He let the Falcon escape on the Death Star.

On Hoth he was powerless to physically stop the escape himself, and I can prove he wasn't 'letting them escape' by how he ordered multiple Imp Stars to chase the Falcon into the asteroid field, despite knowing it could easily wreck his ships. Heck, the only reason he stopped was because he had to move out of the asteroid field to contact Palp's.

Also, he didn't waste 2 squadrons himself at the DS, a lot of the Rebs went down to turbolasers and the regular TIEs.

 

[Spartan303]

The Fact tjat Ashoka even survived for longer than a minute is testament to her power and skill. Anakin trained her well. Id put Ashoka as if this time in the elite levels of the Jedi. Yet even a reluctant Vader still beat her. So, my point stands.

 

[Zachowon]

The creators do not share your optimistic appraisal of the situation.



Ahsoka is not a pushover to Vader. -Dave Filoni



"Ahsoka will handle some business."
"Don't think Ahsoka's gonna get owned. Yeah, Ahsoka's, I would say like top 3/4, as far as fighting combat skills, Jedi of all time."

She hit him. In the face. With a lightsaber. And flayed his mask open. And this fighting was on top of a massive Dark Side nexus that was powering Vader up, and with her own emotions compromised given her reaction to realizing he was Anakin.

There is no fight where your skilled opponent hits you in the face with a lightsaber yet you were handily owning them.

He let the Falcon escape. And then spent the rest of the movie pursuing them through an asteroid field. And paying bounty hunters to catch them. And killing Captain Needa for losing them. And following them to Cloud City. But you think he let them escape on purpose.

Your Darth Vader is a complete frikkin' moron.

He let the Falcon escape on the Death Star.

On Hoth he was powerless to physically stop the escape himself, and I can prove he wasn't 'letting them escape' by how he ordered multiple Imp Stars to chase the Falcon into the asteroid field, despite knowing it could easily wreck his ships. Heck, the only reason he stopped was because he had to move out of the asteroid field to contact Palp's.

Also, he didn't waste 2 squadrons himself at the DS, a lot of the Rebs went down to turbolasers and the regular TIEs.

See, I can tell neither of you two have read the comics.
Do not worry, I am going to be gathering plenty ofhis comic feats to show you!

The Fact tjat Ashoka even survived for longer than a minute is testament to her power and skill. Anakin trained her well. Id put Ashoka as if this time in the elite levels of the Jedi. Yet even a reluctant Vader still beat her. So, my point stands.

He has shown to be able to give someone who beat multiple inquisitors and an old jedi master a complete run for their money in the Fallen order

 

[Bacle]

See, I can tell neither of you two have read the comics.
Do not worry, I am going to be gathering plenty ofhis comic feats to show you!

He has shown to be able to give someone who beat multiple inquisitors and an old jedi master a complete run for their money in the Fallen order

Movie feats trump comics.

 

[Spartan303]

He has shown to be able to give someone who beat multiple inquisitors and an old jedi master a complete run for their money in the Fallen order

Yeah....Cal knew he was screwed so he dipped out.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

The creators do not share your optimistic appraisal of the situation.



Ahsoka is not a pushover to Vader. -Dave Filoni

Then Filoni is a moron and this is just blatant favouritism for his OC. Vader has butchered oh so many people of Ahsoka's skill level.

Then again, this is the same man who thinks Grand Admiral Thrawn being dragged off to god knows where by tentacle monsters is a good "twist." So it isn't too surprising.

He let the Falcon escape. And then spent the rest of the movie pursuing them through an asteroid field. And paying bounty hunters to catch them. And killing Captain Needa for losing them. And following them to Cloud City. But you think he let them escape on purpose.

Your Darth Vader is a complete frikkin' moron.

He's talking about A New Hope. It was part of the Imperial strategy to discover the Rebel base.

 

[Bear Ribs]

The Fact tjat Ashoka even survived for longer than a minute is testament to her power and skill. Anakin trained her well. Id put Ashoka as if this time in the elite levels of the Jedi. Yet even a reluctant Vader still beat her. So, my point stands.

"Vader was reluctant" is something you made up. "Ahsoka was badass and gave him a brutal fight where she split his face open even though they were fighting on a Dark Side Nexus" is canon and based on the visuals and the statements of the creators.

Ezra lasts 40 freakin' seconds and he's a half-trained padawan. It should be no credit to any fully trained Jedi to last one minute if a barely-trained padawan, who himself was trained by another barely-trained padawan who never became a Jedi, can handle Vader for two-thirds of a minute. You severely overestimate Vader, again. He's stronger than other Jedi but he's only a silver medalist to their bronze medalist.



The fight is also very obviously not Ahsoka being pushed around. She charges him at 1:50. She force-pushes him across the room at 1:57. He manages to push her off a cliff by 2:44 but by 3:38 she's climbed back up the cliff and she's charging him again. She cuts his face open a few seconds later. Again, this is on top of a Dark Side Nexus that will severely power up Vader and hose the light-siders' powers.

At 4:00 she realizes he was Anakin. She's the one who's emotionally compromised and reluctant in the fight at that point and it shows, though she's still able to fight she goes pure defensive and he rules the fight from then on. Any emotional element is tilting Vader's way, not hers.

See, I can tell neither of you two have read the comics.
Do not worry, I am going to be gathering plenty ofhis comic feats to show you!

He has shown to be able to give someone who beat multiple inquisitors and an old jedi master a complete run for their money in the Fallen order

Good luck getting a comic feat to stick. If it's a one-off that never shows up anywhere else, you need an explanation for why. And it's easy to explain, the force isn't evenly distributed. We know for a fact the Dark Side is stronger in some places than others. We also know that some specific powers work better in some places than others thanks to the Mandalorian and finding out Grogu could communicate with the whole galaxy at once, but only sitting in one specific spot in one temple that Ahsoka directed them to. Finally we know emotional state can massively warp a person's ability to use the force.

So even if Vader has RealUltimatePower in one frame of one obscure comic book, you need to establish that he has that power all the time and it wasn't a unique circumstance. Which is a hard sell since if he had that power all the time, he would use it more often than one frame of one obscure comic book. You will also need to establish that said power actually exists and isn't a visual tic common to comics, like speech balloons and "whoosh" lines comics are prone to. Finally you'll have to establish how long and how powerful your one-frame-of-a-comic power is, how long it lasts, etc.

Then Filoni is a moron and this is just blatant favouritism for his OC. Vader has butchered oh so many people of Ahsoka's skill level.

Then again, this is the same man who thinks Grand Admiral Thrawn being dragged off to god knows where by tentacle monsters is a good "twist." So it isn't too surprising.

"My opinion is contradicted by the actual canon but that just means canon is wrong!"

Well if we're making up our own Canon, I've just decided that Vibranium is immune to the force so Cap can beat Vader over the head with it all day and TK/precog will do nothing. Also if you hit a Vibranium shield with your lightsaber you suffer instant volcanic diarrhea. It's not any weirder than the other ways Vibranium interacts with the universe.

He's talking about A New Hope. It was part of the Imperial strategy to discover the Rebel base.

Given that he was replying to a sentence that included "On Hoth," that's either a very dishonest attempt at prevarication or not being able to follow the discussion at all.

 

[Zachowon]

Movie feats trump comics.

All is canon under Disney

Yeah....Cal knew he was screwed so he dipped out.

He barley escaped even then

 

[Zachowon]

Here is the scene where he kills multiple squadrons alone...

Spoiler

See that? All of those? well.

Three squadrons all open fire

Surprises them with his speed, and then

One down without a scratch

They fire Torps..and then

It took luke hitting him dead on, because he let him, to stop vader from killing the final Squadron....

 

[Bear Ribs]

Here is the scene where he kills multiple squadrons alone...

'Kay, and how good were those pilots? You need to establish that they're worth a fig before beating them actually means anything. Especially this specific comic where it took place almost immediately after Yavin where the Rebels lost every pilot except Luke, Wedge, and Keyan Farlander, so these would have likely have been the greenest, least-experienced pilots in history.

 

[Spartan303]

Bear Ribs, I said as reluctant as Vader can be on such situations. I thought that implied limited to almost nothing. But neither did he have the overwhelming list to destroy her like he did Obi-Wan. Ashoka is awesome, I'll not ever dispute that. But she didn't stand a real chance of taking Vader down. And whats more, she knew it. Her entire strategy was to hold him off, not duel him and win. You don't do that unless you know you're outmatched. Her skill and power let her survive where other Jedi would have perished long before.

 

[Bear Ribs]

Bear Ribs, I said as reluctant as Vader can be on such situations. I thought that implied limited to almost nothing. But neither did he have the overwhelming list to destroy her like he did Obi-Wan. Ashoka is awesome, I'll not ever dispute that. But she didn't stand a real chance of taking Vader down. And whats more, she knew it. Her entire strategy was to hold him off, not duel him and win. You don't do that unless you know you're outmatched. Her skill and power let her survive where other Jedi would have perished long before.

Did you actually watch the video I linked? Her growling out that she would avenge her master and destroy Vader, followed by charging him, throwing him around, and driving him back over and over with relentless attacks? That's not a strategy of holding him off and that's not what the creators said in the discussions I linked (where they comment on how relentless she is and no pushover to Vader). This looks remarkably like you watched an entirely different show or just can't remotely remember events, even those quoted and posted in-thread.

 

[Zachowon]

'Kay, and how good were those pilots? You need to establish that they're worth a fig before beating them actually means anything. Especially this specific comic where it took place almost immediately after Yavin where the Rebels lost every pilot except Luke, Wedge, and Keyan Farlander, so these would have likely have been the greenest, least-experienced pilots in history.

It took place plenty after the death star was destroyed. We know, because they have such a large amount of troops and pilots.
Also, just because they arnt named doesn't mean they are horrible.
They are damn good pilots, but not better then Vader.
No one being added is a better pilot...
I am just using it to show he cares not.
I an still gathering feats of him in combat on the ground

 

[Bear Ribs]

It took place plenty after the death star was destroyed. We know, because they have such a large amount of troops and pilots.
Also, just because they arnt named doesn't mean they are horrible.
They are damn good pilots, but not better then Vader.
No one being added is a better pilot...
I am just using it to show he cares not.
I an still gathering feats of him in combat on the ground

No, we know it happened shortly after the Death Star was destroyed because it's listed as happening 0ABY, aka the same year the Death Star was destroyed. Given that Vader did a ton of other stuff in 0ABY after this, this had to be very close to right after Yavin.

Battle of Vrogas Vas

The Battle of Vrogas Vas was fought during the Galactic Civil War on the planet Vrogas Vas between Darth Vader, Imperial Commander Karbin and his forces, and the Alliance to Restore the Republic. Using intelligence provided by the rogue archaeologist Dr. Aphra, Vader traveled to Vrogas Vas in...

starwars.fandom.com

You need to prove those are damn good pilots, not just assert your opinion. And save your time on the ground forces comic, if you can't prove those are damn good groundtroopers you'll face the same objection. Random extras of completely unknown, but probably garbage given the timing, skill do not establish badass creds.

 

[Zachowon]

No, we know it happened shortly after the Death Star was destroyed because it's listed as happening 0ABY, aka the same year the Death Star was destroyed. Given that Vader did a ton of other stuff in 0ABY after this, this had to be very close to right after Yavin.

Battle of Vrogas Vas

The Battle of Vrogas Vas was fought during the Galactic Civil War on the planet Vrogas Vas between Darth Vader, Imperial Commander Karbin and his forces, and the Alliance to Restore the Republic. Using intelligence provided by the rogue archaeologist Dr. Aphra, Vader traveled to Vrogas Vas in...

starwars.fandom.com

You need to prove those are damn good pilots, not just assert your opinion. And save your time on the ground forces comic, if you can't prove those are damn good groundtroopers you'll face the same objection. Random extras of completely unknown, but probably garbage given the timing, skill do not establish badass creds.

Oh, I was going to show him taking on Jedi Masters and the like.
But obviously I have to Prove they were good....
When this is the only time we see them?
I can show Vader doing tons of stuff. Plenty that make him able to take on chief, Kenobi, batman, and Cap all at once. Gotta give me some time. I have roughly 6 years worth of comics to go through