Turkish-backed attack on Armenia by Azerbaijan with formal declaration of War
- Thread starter Bacle
- Start date
Duke Nukem
Hail to the king baby
This shit is starting to get worrying.
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
They did the same a few days ago. It's not an uncommon maneuver, send your forces to the border in order to compel the side you don't like to dilute their fighting force by keeping some of their forces on your border. Turkey is doing the same to Armenia.
Video released by the Armenian MoD shows a platoon or company sized force in the Mataghis Gorge coming under an artillery strike and ATGM fire.
Edit: Another video from the same gorge of unarmored military trucks being struck by ATGM fire.
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Tzeentchean Perspective
Well-known member
Arch Dornan
Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
Nagorno-Karabakh conflict: Major cities hit as heavy fighting continues
Both Azerbaijan's second city and the capital of the breakaway region come under heavy fire.
www.bbc.com
Tryglaw
Well-known member
It takes serious balls to sneak up that close, even so I'm surprised the RPG grenade even armed at such short distance...
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
Armored vehicles lack situational awareness in such enviroments, that's why you need supporting infantry. Depending on the type, RPG warheads arm at 10-15 meters.
Tryglaw
Well-known member
IIRC newer BMP variants have both ERA capable of defeating basic RPGs and thermal sights (either commander or gunner / maybe both, I'd need to check...) for situational awareness.
Newest Russian gear comes with active defences that would have seen the grenade intercepted well short of the vehicle.
About right, an RRPG 7 I think can arm at even short with a certain type of warhead
Yes and no. They often react to further ranged weaponly. then what was fired there
Tryglaw
Well-known member
Active yes, but those don't get exported for the moment, and are mostly for the new generation of vehicles - Armata family.
ERA / NERA works on contact, so launching distance makes no difference. Guess Azeri had either cheap(er) models without the goodies or the explosive inserts "grew feet" and went somewhere / "fell off the back of the truck" somewhere.
You...do know Russia generally keeps things that make it harder for them to kill that they make to themselves.
Also I am talking about the trophy system.
Tryglaw
Well-known member
Same damn type of thing...
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
Most of Azeri IFVs are BMP-1&2 and ERA is useless on them. ERA doesn't fully disperse the cumulative stream, so you still need certain amount of armor to stop it and BMP armor is not thick enough. Worse, detonation of ERA block could also cause spalling and crack the vehicle hull, as the Syrian rebels discovered the hard way, when they experimented with Kontakt-1
They don't see through stone walls, they also require attentive and observant operator.
This new gear is not in production yet. Active defenses also have weak points, like the shrapnel vulnerable sensors and perhaps the distance at which this engagement took place could be too short for proper activation.
BMP's don't need active defense in close range situations anyways since those explosive panels might harm all of its infantry it was carrying into battle who were undoubtedly helping defend the INFANTRY Fighting Vehicle from randos with RPG's sneaking to within twenty meters of it.
Tryglaw
Well-known member
Not quite. Kontakt is tank-grade heavy ERA, so fitting it on lighter vehicles can only end in tears (or laughter, depending on perspective).
For BMP-3 vehicle, Kaktus in the name of the ERA system that is meant to protect against older RPG-class weapons (not modern tandem warheads though, you need heavy ERA + tank to, if you pardon the pun, tank that one), BMP-3 can be fitted with those, though I don't know if the Azeri saw fit to cough up for the setup.
It also seems the Azeri have more BMP-3s then -1s and -2s together.
That much goes without saying, but having both would make sneaking in through foliage for example much harder.
Arena is based off Drozd that goes back to Soviet Union days, but yes, at 20 meters the RPG gunner could well be under radar envelope.
Actually that was the main concern and reason Drozd wasn't implemented, it had multi-tube launcher setup on the turret / above hull armour that fired explosive projectile, which in turn exploded in proximity of incoming enemy shot destroying / disrupting it's flight vector short of the tank.
It did the job but was very hard on adjacent squishies, hence the system wasn't fully implemented. Modern ERA seem to have solved the problem.
D
Deleted member
Guest
Donbass was also the same thing, but it was not widely reported in the west. But when you saw the massed shelling by the Ukrainian Army to break through at Saur-Moghyla during the summer of 2014, when the Donbass separatists were making their defensive stand before the final turn of the first phase of the war with the Russian intervention, it was clear there was large-scale conventional combat in Europe again:
D
Deleted member 88
Guest
There was the Russo-Georgian war in 2008. And Donbass bordered on outright conventional(though it had a lot of asymmetrical elements too).
The wars of the past decade have involved a variety of elements-asymmetric, conventional, and otherwise.