United States Trump 2nd Term - Planning and Beyond

[Ixian]

And when we see "Undo Guadalupe Hidalgo" become an actual political movement, Americans in Mexico and the Southwest dead (Americans in Mexico are generally left alone by the cartel, what do you think is going to happen to them now?), and fetanyl still in the streets as before?

Well, I knew the next four years were going to be a shitshow, I just was hoping it wasn't going to be a violent shitshow. But thugs like you who think special forces are Rambo can get your hardon. Animalnoodles made the comparison to the GWOT, I'd make the comparison to the German General Staff who thought "strategy" was some kind of French wine and all you had to do was win battles.

So, if I understand you, you worry the terrorists will be terrorists if America treats them as terrorists?

Idiotic.

We aren't going to allow them to operate in the United States any longer, if that requires violence, so be it.

You clearly underestimate just how deadly tier 1 special forces are, no they aren't movie "Rambo's", but they are certainly effective and lethal, which the Cartels will quickly discover. I reject your cowardly worldview, I reject that we HAVE to allow Cartel thugs to operate with impunity at the souther border.

The USA will crush them if they don't fold and back off, it isn't a question and isn't in doubt. The political willpower is there, the military technology and boots are there. Your fearmongering is just that, fearmongering.

So, USA is to behave like Izrael - send killer squad to foreign countries to murder local citizens?

The Cartels have been doing it for decades... so yeah. If Mexico doesn't like it, they should have done something about it a long time ago.

 

[SoliFortissimi]

We really haven't learnt a single damn thing, have we?

 

[TheRejectionist]

If they are so stupid as to try and stand up against tier 1 special forces units.... then they die.

I would say more narcissistic and macho culture when it is not warranted.

Hey, if those bastards die and the collateral damage is contained, you will never get a peep from me.

But, @AnimalNoodles is partly right. You still need the support of Mexican people, not necessarily their government, but it's better to have both. Or at least, agree to not bother the "cleanup".

If you head into mexico w/o the open agreement of the mexican government you will piss off the mexicans, and if you want to defeat the cartels you need mexican support.

Andd it is also this :

Drugs are a DEMAND problem. Legalise them and make illegal trade in them unprofitable - drug cartels are dead overnight.
But I have low hopes for anybody to overcome the resistance of the anti-drug political-healthcare-LEO complex AND the drug dealers.

@Largo is also right @Ixian don't expect to have a cakewalk Blitzkrieg Rambo-style. All the fancy toys helped nothing against the Taliban, you guys lost the war the moment they decided they wouldn't want to fight a conventional war AND/OR that you would re-establish a Pashtun-led monarchy. You lost even harder when Biden decided to go against a promise. Cartel can be an easier target, but you can't expect to go full Django on them and walk smiling into the night with burning buildings behind.

The Cartels have been doing it for decades... so yeah. If Mexico doesn't like it, they should have done something about it a long time ago.

Bit difficult to do that when some cartels are under CIA & FBI protection, as well as others that are in the Mexican government.

So, USA is to behave like Izrael - send killer squad to foreign countries to murder local citizens?

If the US has better aim and cares about hearts and minds, they won't.

Anyway, I think all of you need to take a chill pill. You can beat your chests and tap the war drums but Trump is not going to be Terminator 2000. Trump is a dealmaker and peacemaker first and foremost.

So tone down your expections.

 

[RenegadeInterrupt]

I see the world has not erupted in nuclear hellfire yet and Trump has been president for almost a day. Probably gonna have to wait a little longer before we can tell the liberals "told ya so!" just yet.

 

[SoliFortissimi]

you would re-establish a Pashtun-led monarch

Bruh, the US literally stopped the Pashtun and tribal chiefs from bringing back the monarchy. In retrospect, that might have been a bad idea.

 

[Ixian]

I would say more narcissistic and macho culture when it is not warranted.

Hey, if those bastards die and the collateral damage is contained, you will never get a peep from me.

But, @AnimalNoodles is partly right. You still need the support of Mexican people, not necessarily their government, but it's better to have both. Or at least, agree to not bother the "cleanup".

Andd it is also this :


@Largo is also right @Ixian don't expect to have a cakewalk Blitzkrieg Rambo-style. All the fancy toys helped nothing against the Taliban, you guys lost the war the moment they decided they wouldn't want to fight a conventional war AND/OR that you would re-establish a Pashtun-led monarchy. You lost even harder when Biden decided to go against a promise. Cartel can be an easier target, but you can't expect to go full Django on them and walk smiling into the night with burning buildings behind.


Bit difficult to do that when some cartels are under CIA & FBI protection, as well as others that are in the Mexican government.

If the US has better aim and cares about hearts and minds, they won't.

Anyway, I think all of you need to take a chill pill. You can beat your chests and tap the war drums but Trump is not going to be Terminator 2000. Trump is a dealmaker and peacemaker first and foremost.

So tone down your expections.

I don't think it'll really come to mass violence.

I think the Cartels are smart enough to back away from America instead of risking American drones over their compounds and American soldiers in their homes. I suspect some of the dumber ones will die along the southern border, and the rest will retreat and hide, at least until the political winds shift, whenever that may be.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

The Cartel bosses like power and money. Those are the people that will be targeted by SOF and/or high altitude missile strikes.

Convince enough bosses that they can't make money when they're dead, and you'll get a solid retreat out of the rest.

If you can target enough of the cartel terrorists (no, I won't call them soldiers) to make them fear taking action against the US and its citizens, do that as well.

 

[nemo1986]

He can't do that. Birthright citizenship is enshrined in the Constitution.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

He can't do that. Birthright citizenship is enshrined in the Constitution.

Not really. It wasn't a thing for at least the first 100-150 years.

 

[Ixian]

He can't do that. Birthright citizenship is enshrined in the Constitution.

The 14th Amendment was meant for freed slaves and their descendants.

Not anchor babies for foreign invaders.

 

[Largo]

I don't think it'll really come to mass violence.

I think the Cartels are smart enough to back away from America instead of risking American drones over their compounds and American soldiers in their homes. I suspect some of the dumber ones will die along the southern border, and the rest will retreat and hide, at least until the political winds shift, whenever that may be.

This is your victory scenario? Really? Are you so shortsighted that you cannot plan what you're going to have for tonight's dinner?

Because let's say you're right. The cartel members will retreat and hide against the Ubermenschian special forces.

Now what? You have three options.

1. Declare victory and go back to the United States. Those people who are "retreating and hiding" will stop hiding and go back to doing what they were doing before. You have fixed nothing, pissed off Mexico, and made the United States look weak.
2. Occupy the area until you find the hiding cartel members. With special forces as opposed to the regular army. This is ridiculously escalatory, and you don't use special forces to hold territory. You will have to bring in the regular army, and now we're at war.
3. Go south to Mexico City. Very good idea. No problems here whatsoever.

The 14th Amendment was meant for freed slaves and their descendants.

Not anchor babies for foreign invaders.

Oh, so we're going with what was meant? Well, I say that the 1st Amendment wasn't meant for the Internet, or television, or radio, because the Founding Fathers had no earthly idea about those things.

Or we could, I'm just spitballing here, go with the textualist approach that conservatives have claimed they believed in throughout my lifetime. And the textualist approach makes it very damn clear.

 

[Buba]

Cartels commiting crimes in the USA is an INTERNAL AMERICAN PROBLEM!
Trying to solve it by invading/terrorising other countrIes says - WE CAN'T FIX OUR OWN SHIT.

 

[Ixian]

This is your victory scenario? Really? Are you so shortsighted that you cannot plan what you're going to have for tonight's dinner?

Because let's say you're right. The cartel members will retreat and hide against the Ubermenschian special forces.

Now what? You have three options.

1. Declare victory and go back to the United States. Those people who are "retreating and hiding" will stop hiding and go back to doing what they were doing before. You have fixed nothing, pissed off Mexico, and made the United States look weak.
2. Occupy the area until you find the hiding cartel members. With special forces as opposed to the regular army. This is ridiculously escalatory, and you don't use special forces to hold territory. You will have to bring in the regular army, and now we're at war.
3. Go south to Mexico City. Very good idea. No problems here whatsoever.

My ideal goal is that the Cartels stop predating on American citizens. I recognize it isn't politically expedient to level or occupy Mexico, so unless we really want to commit, making them piss themselves and run away is the best option.

Of course, if they try and fight back, it's a different ball game.

Either way, the end goal is that they stay the fuck out of the US.

Cartels commiting crimes in the USA is an INTERNAL AMERICAN PROBLEM!
Trying to solve it by invading/terrorising other countrIes says - WE CAN'T FIX OUR OWN SHIT.

When their main bases of operation and places of power are across the southern border, it becomes an INTERNATIONAL problem.

 

[Zachowon]

What intel and support capabilities? Do you think that Mexicans, local or otherwise, are going to give you that? Even if you think they will, what's your plan for if they don't? How do you avoid ending up like the Russians?

Intel can be done without being in theater, and Mexico will let us or they will get tariffed.
We also already have a working relationship with them against the cartels...

 

[bullethead]

It won't surprise me to see the following happen:

• Trump cuts deal with Mexico so that in exchange for [insert thing that benefits America here], the US kicks the asses of the most heavily armed and organized cartels that the Mexican military can't handle.
• Given the content of Trump's executive orders, cartel affiliated criminals get put on death row pretty regularly.
• The border wall gets built/reinforced.

Enough of these things working together would do a lot to mitigate the drug trade, although fixing the American economy would have a bigger impact on demand.

 

[Buba]

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/21/nx-s1-5266207/trump-paris-agreement-biden-climate-change

Correct decision for mostly wrong reasons, as AGW simply is bullshit.
Still I applaud!

 

[Largo]

Intel can be done without being in theater, and Mexico will let us or they will get tariffed.
We also already have a working relationship with them against the cartels...

Trump already promised they're going to get tariffed anyways, so that's not a threat. And if you're going to tell me that Trump will strike a deal, Mexico has no reason to believe that he won't renege and put tariffs after he gets his special military operation. Or did you forget that he made a trade deal with Mexico last time yet has already indicated he wants to tear that deal up?

And the working relationship is irrelevant. If this working relationship is so cool, surely Mexico won't object if we just send in the army to deal with the cartel instead?

 

[SoliFortissimi]

He can't do that. Birthright citizenship is enshrined in the Constitution.

No, no, let him cook. I want to see how crazy he gets.

Trump cuts deal with Mexico so that in exchange for [insert thing that benefits America here], the US kicks the asses of the most heavily armed and organized cartels that the Mexican military can't handle.

That would require both Trump and Mexico to be rational actors.

 

[AnimalNoodles]

The Cartel bosses like power and money. Those are the people that will be targeted by SOF and/or high altitude missile strikes.

Convince enough bosses that they can't make money when they're dead, and you'll get a solid retreat out of the rest.

If you can target enough of the cartel terrorists (no, I won't call them soldiers) to make them fear taking action against the US and its citizens, do that as well.

Has this worked with Hamas and Hezbollah?

You dont think the Cartels will be sending their own drones to strike back? Not predators of course, but they are perfectly capable of hiring large numbers of soon to be unemployed ukrainian FPV drone operators and using them to attack politicians, policemen, the homes of SOF personal etc etc.

 

[StormEagle]

I feel like everyone’s ignoring a distinct difference between the cartels and the Taliban or other terrorists orgs. Die hard believers in the cause, these people are not.

The cartels are not ideological or ethnic independence movements. The entire point of their existence is to make money via illicit means. You cannot make money, if you are dead.

I feel like the calculus for the average cartel member suddenly changes if they now stand a good chance of having their head popped by spec ops or coast guard.