They had chemical weapons.
Russian-Ukrainian-Polish Eternal Friendship Thread
- Thread starter Husky_Khan
- Start date
Oh shit... Here we go.
Let's talk about the USS Maine instead actually...
Great White Fleet versus Ukraine Navy 2021... Who wins?
That wasn't the WMD that was sold to the US public.
'Yellowcake Uranium' ring a bell.
Also, the whole 'helped AQ with 9/11' lie which sparked it all.
How many US and Iraqi lives were lost to those lies?
No, Iraq was Bush Jr's daddy issues launching an invasion, and the warhawks/military industrial complex gleefully going along with it.
Edit: But thanks for showing you are just a shill for any lie the US military industrial complex cooks up as pretext for military action. I'm sure your bosses are proud.
They had MWDs.
They either sold them when we were coming in, gave then away or destroyed them
Yeah, sure they did.
Chem weapons aren't what the public was told was the reason for invading, nor does it refute that the initial reason we had for attacking Iraq was that someone told Bush they had a part in 9/11. Points you completely dodged.
Defending the invasion of Iraq is possibly the stupidest way to try to defend the credibility of the US military or DC.
They did.
Just because you are brainwashed to think "They LIED BECAUSE I WASNT GOVEN EXACTLY WHAT I WAS TOLD ABOUT" doesn't mean they lied
Zach, that all happened while I was in middle school, and I watched the news live on TV in the lead up to the invasion.
I remember the Yellowcake lie (you dodged this), I remember the 'Iraq helped with 9/11' lie (you dodged this), I remember much of the international community not buying said lies (Freedom Fries because France didn't want to play ball), I remember the Dixie Chicks being cancelled for daring to question the invasion, and I remember how many people wanted to take Iraq's oil (Cheney and Haliburton ring a bell).
It's rather amazing you are seriously trying to justify the invasion of Iraq as a way to try to defend how the warhawks are reacting to the Ukraine situation.
Part of the reason Russia is so paranoid about DCs actions is because they remember the lies about the invasion of Iraq as well, and how willing the people in DC and US media were to go along with them.
Agent23
Ни шагу назад!
japan is still quite limited by its post-war constitution, and probably won't send in the JSDF, also, Russia and Japan are still technically kinda-sorta not finished with WWII.
Sure, and it had nothing to do with corruption in Kiev, or the fact that the area was part of Russia to Gorby redrew the lines.
This is what I mean by US establishment and warhawks not being able to grock or admit that some people might honestly prefer to be in Russia's sphere than in DCs.
Why do the people of Donbass and other rebel areas have to remain in Kiev's control, if they honestly want to divorce themselves from Kiev's control?
Does right to self-determination disappear if people make the 'wrong' choice, in the eyes of DC?
Yeah, I have absolutely no problem with Crimea and the Donbass leaving Ukraine just so long as the rest of Ukraine is likewise able to chart its own path, including at least EU membership but perhaps even NATO membership as well.
The Russophone percentage in Crimea and the Donbass was considerably greater than in any other part of Ukraine. From 2001:
Sevastopol: 90.6% Russophone in 2001
The rest of Crimea: 77.0% Russophone in 2001
Donetsk Oblast: 74.9% Russophone in 2001
Luhansk Oblast: 68.8% Russophone in 2001
But no other part of Ukraine is even 50% Russophone.
Tiamat
I've seen the future...
"Sighs, blows whistle" Okay kiddies, outta the pool!
Seriously, @Bacle , this personal tiff between you and @Zachowon used to admittedly be a little amusing at time, but now it's gotten nauseatingly tiresome. No one's viewpoints are gonna change here, the situation in the Ukraine is not going to get any better at the moment.
GASP! Governments lie? What a concept! Yeah, they do lie....along with just about every other government on the planet at some point. Not always necessarily for mustache-twirling ACME-Industrial Evil Complex reasons, sometimes just as often for "good intentions that often pave the road to Hell". Hope that's not a new concept for you. Just like everyone lies at some point, whether to others or themselves. And then I also look at some of the fellows claiming to expose the lies (Greenwald, Snowden, Assange, etc.) and sometimes find, holy crap, some of these twits are flat out crazier than the morons they claim to expose and are pretty nutty themselves. Yes, I know, I sound callous and cruel...but that's realpolitik. It's why the U.S government, at least in theory is supposed to work under checks and balances, since the Founders realized that people will indeed lie and screw up. But I'm getting off track here.
Getting back on topic....Great White Fleet vs Ukraine Navy 2021...who wins?? Dunno, will there be any suitably long-legged buxom pinup gals cheering on the festivities?
Seriously, @Bacle , this personal tiff between you and @Zachowon used to admittedly be a little amusing at time, but now it's gotten nauseatingly tiresome. No one's viewpoints are gonna change here, the situation in the Ukraine is not going to get any better at the moment.
GASP! Governments lie? What a concept! Yeah, they do lie....along with just about every other government on the planet at some point. Not always necessarily for mustache-twirling ACME-Industrial Evil Complex reasons, sometimes just as often for "good intentions that often pave the road to Hell". Hope that's not a new concept for you. Just like everyone lies at some point, whether to others or themselves. And then I also look at some of the fellows claiming to expose the lies (Greenwald, Snowden, Assange, etc.) and sometimes find, holy crap, some of these twits are flat out crazier than the morons they claim to expose and are pretty nutty themselves. Yes, I know, I sound callous and cruel...but that's realpolitik. It's why the U.S government, at least in theory is supposed to work under checks and balances, since the Founders realized that people will indeed lie and screw up. But I'm getting off track here.
Getting back on topic....Great White Fleet vs Ukraine Navy 2021...who wins?? Dunno, will there be any suitably long-legged buxom pinup gals cheering on the festivities?
You think it's tiresome, imagine having to deal with someone defending the Iraq invasion in this day and age, while dodging any point that might make the US gov and military look bad in every other argument."Sighs, blows whistle" Okay kiddies, outta the pool!
Seriously, @Bacle , this personal tiff between you and @Zachowon used to admittedly be a little amusing at time, but now it's gotten nauseatingly tiresome. No one's viewpoints are gonna change here, the situation in the Ukraine is not going to get any better at the moment.
GASP! Governments lie? What a concept! Yeah, they do lie....along with just about every other government on the planet at some point. Not always necessarily for mustache-twirling ACME-Industrial Evil Complex reasons, sometimes just as often for "good intentions that often pave the road to Hell". Hope that's not a new concept for you. Just like everyone lies at some point, whether to others or themselves. And then I also look at some of the fellows claiming to expose the lies (Greenwald, Snowden, Assange, etc.) and sometimes find, holy crap, some of these twits are flat out crazier than the morons they claim to expose and are pretty nutty themselves. Yes, I know, I sound callous and cruel...but that's realpolitik. It's why the U.S government, at least in theory is supposed to work under checks and balances, since the Founders realized that people will indeed lie and screw up. But I'm getting off track here.
Getting back on topic....Great White Fleet vs Ukraine Navy 2021...who wins?? Dunno, will there be any suitably long-legged buxom pinup gals cheering on the festivities?
At this point I think Zach's real job in intel is to be a shill/propaganda agent to counter anything bad said about the US military; won't be the first time the IC has been used to try to craft and push domestic narratives favorable to them.
Tiamat
I've seen the future...
Bacle, seriously dude, take it to a damn PM with him or me or whatever, get over it and move on. Hell, take a break from the internet for a few days, it will do you some good.
Agent23
Ни шагу назад!
I posted this map, like, twice already, I think.The Russophone percentage in Crimea and the Donbass was considerably greater than in any other part of Ukraine. From 2001:
Sevastopol: 90.6% Russophone in 2001
The rest of Crimea: 77.0% Russophone in 2001
Donetsk Oblast: 74.9% Russophone in 2001
Luhansk Oblast: 68.8% Russophone in 2001
But no other part of Ukraine is even 50% Russophone.
Nah, he wants to be that sort of shill for corrupt powers, he gets to have it happen in public.
Particularly when he continues to call me and idiot anytime I don't buy his/his bosses narratives.
Embarrassing the US military industrial complex, and the willing tools/shills for it, is the best way to keep them from getting us involved in more pointless, wasteful wars over pride, ego, and Lockmart stock prices.
Fuck you bacle.
I am sorry you hate the truth
I don't hate the truth, I dislike when it is twisted and ignored to excuse lies that cost millions of lives and billions of dollars, all for nothing.
Because the invasion of Iraq accomplished nothing in the end except destablizing the MidEast, showing the corruption of DC to the world, and reducing the world's trust in the reasonableness and sanity of the US government.
It also showed the US public why we should not trust our own leaders on anything related to military matters/adventurism, and why we should be suspicious of any gov overreach due to an 'emergency' (Patriot Act, ect.).
Getting back on topic....Great White Fleet vs Ukraine Navy 2021...who wins?? Dunno, will there be any suitably long-legged buxom pinup gals cheering on the festivities?
I actually looked up the Ukranian Navy. They literally got one Frigate. And a missile boat.
The Great White Fleet had sixteen battleships divided in two squadrons plus escorts. Once those antiship missile launchers shot their load things should get fun.
"Remember the Maine!"
Ukraine lost most of its navy when it lost Crimea, I think.
Well, I just wanted to make sure that everyone on here actually saw this map.
Agent23
Ни шагу назад!
Well, most don't act like they have seen it.