Russian-Ukrainian-Polish Eternal Friendship Thread

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
We didn't seem to have a thread on the simmering Conflict in Ukraine and I found this article so here it is.


Just an unmarked grave found but the article segways into mass graves and other war crimes committed by Russia and the Rebel forces they back in that region of the Ukraine.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
Russia carving chunks out of the EU.
The usual mantra of the US and UK to maintain the EU / continental Europe under their military boot. Problem is - nobody outside of Poland buys that game anymore.
And Poland still has delusions of being the Poland empire.
 

Morphic Tide

Well-known member
nobody outside of Poland
Again, Poland is an EU country. And has a long history of being fucked with because it's a ludicrously efficient invasion corridor. If Russia is expanding at all, they'd be mad to ignore Poland, but going at Poland would mean trying to chip away at the EU.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
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Staff Member
Russia carving chunks out of the EU.
The usual mantra of the US and UK to maintain the EU / continental Europe under their military boot. Problem is - nobody outside of Poland buys that game anymore.
And Poland still has delusions of being the Poland empire.
No, the problem is Russia having ambitions of being Russian Empire again, and Poland is included in that ambition.
Conveniently you also forget other countries that have similar attitudes due to being in that ambition too, like all the Baltics.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
Poland, or more exactly, some polish politicians still think that they are a great power. And try to fuck with nations way stronger than them. And getting fucked because of that. Just learn a bit of polish story from 17xx to today. Poland is in no way an innocent victim on that. Today's Russia is not interested in Poland at all. Maybe in some chunks of Ukraine. You know, the ones that Russia gifted to Ukraine during the time that both are Soviet republics?
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
Poland, or more exactly, some polish politicians still think that they are a great power. And try to fuck with nations way stronger than them. And getting fucked because of that. Just learn a bit of polish story from 17xx to today. Poland is in no way an innocent victim on that. Today's Russia is not interested in Poland at all. Maybe in some chunks of Ukraine. You know, the ones that Russia gifted to Ukraine during the time that both are Soviet republics?
Marduk IS POLISH.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
South Korea is more then prepared for a war against NK, and even Chins.
It's capital bring in Arty range is accounted for.

Russia would want its land back, and Poland will have none if it, so the EU will stand there at least.

India and China have been warring for a LONG time and India would not let China run unopposed. Neither will damn near every country around them.

Iran is in an areas that is always a shitstorm
Dude, try to learn a bit of history, and not only the parts one side write. In the end, you understand that all nations fuck with their neighbors if they think they can.
 

Marduk

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Poland, or more exactly, some polish politicians still think that they are a great power. And try to fuck with nations way stronger than them. And getting fucked because of that. Just learn a bit of polish story from 17xx to today.
You try to learn some basic geopolitics.
How do they think Poland is a great power?
Guess if you think that all US allies are vassals (wonder what that makes Russia's allies, China's allies and Germany's allies), then not acting like a vassal clearly must mean a delusion of being a great power, because in paulobrito world, there are only vassal states and great powers.
Poland is in no way an innocent victim on that. Today's Russia is not interested in Poland at all.
Lol.
Guess Russia's whole gas transit politics are just a lack of interest. Got it.
Maybe in some chunks of Ukraine. You know, the ones that Russia gifted to Ukraine during the time that both are Soviet republics?
That's Crimea, and that's debatable, the other chunks weren't gifted.
Also Russia is interested in the whole thing being more of a vassal than the US allies you call vassals.
And South Ossetia. And Transnistrania. And the -stans. And many others.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Oh? show me one, please. Because the US doesn't have any. Is the US and his vassals, the US doesn't have non-submissive (aka vassals) allies.
Maybe is difficult for you to understand/admit that, but is the world as it is.

In Europe,you are right.USA have vassals there,not allies.
But Japan,South Korea,Vietnam,India would fight China for their own reasons,not becouse USA want so.
And Poland have no other choice then being USA vassal as long as Russia is worshipping Stalin.

Althought...it is matter of time,before China take over Syberia,and Russia would fight them then.It would be our time to change overlord and become China vassal,becouse USA would sell us to Russia.
And since Putin pet,Dugin belive that all poles must become russian/german or die,and ukrainian and belarussian are not nations,we are fighting for our lives here.
Better be live polish american/chineese vassal,then dead polish hero or second category russian/german.

I really would prefer independent Poland,but sadly for small russian and german minds it is something just not possible to agree for them.They belive,that our land is their land.
 
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paulobrito

Well-known member
That's Crimea, and that's debatable, the other chunks weren't gifted.
That shows how little you know of history.
Please learn about the '20s and '30s.
And Crimea, for your information, tried to exit Ukraine and return to Russia as soon as the fragmentation of the USSR occurs.
But, everything that goes in a direction your political views don't accept, don't happen, I see. At least you are consistent.
Children's of ideology and propaganda, what one can expect?
 

Marduk

Well-known member
Moderator
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That shows how little you know of history.
Please learn about the '20s and '30s.
Stop going "learn history" and use some damn historical fact, i won't go guessing whose version of history are you asking me to learn, nevermind the assumption that this version is worth learning at all.

And why 20's and 30's?
Why not the 40's, when Soviets did some mass demographic engineering by moving the inconvenient locals to distant shitholes?
And why not 1800's, when Crimea was an Ottoman vassal (official, not imaginary) for longer than it ever was in Russia?
Yet it was Russia who took it over now, not Turkey.
And Crimea, for your information, tried to exit Ukraine and return to Russia as soon as the fragmentation of the USSR occurs.
But, everything that goes in a direction your political views don't accept, don't happen, I see. At least you are consistent.
Children's of ideology and propaganda, what one can expect?
Doesn't fucking matter. In the Budapest Memorandum, Russia promised to protect Ukraine's territorial integrity. A shady referendum held post military takeover doesn't change the fact that this promise was broken in most egregious way possible. Hence, no one should trust any promises Russian government signs.
 
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paulobrito

Well-known member
Because in the '20s and '30s Russia gifted a lot of territory to Ukraine.
And you proved again that the parts of history you don't like don't matter/don't exist for you. How convenient.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
Most nations would give token diplomatic support, hoping that they don't get noticed for real and that the fallout doesn't hit them too hard when Russia, China and USA are turned into irradiated wasteland. Off course the predictions of the Fulda gap salivators never came true despite 40 years long standoff, so it's quite likely the Suwalki gap aficionados won't get their wish as well.


Or they would send their best wishes and wait for nuclear dust to settle before doing anything of substance.
Unfortunately, several nations have what is called the Samson option - if I go down, everybody goes with me. Also knows, as - if it goes full nuke war, then sent nukes to every nation that have an industrial capability that matters in the aftermath.
Of course, that is planning/doctrine - nobody knows what happens if the shit hits the fan, after all. Part of the charm, really.
 

Marduk

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Because in the '20s and '30s Russia gifted a lot of territory to Ukraine.
Yes, and some of it didn't even belong to the Soviets to begin with :D
And you proved again that the parts of history you don't like don't matter/don't exist for you. How convenient.
Now that's laughable.
There were no Russia and no Ukraine in the 20's and 30's.
There was only Soviet Union, and SSRs were not sovereign states, but internal organizational scheme of Soviet Union.
But then again, that only matters on the most surface propaganda argumentation level.
Donbass was in Ukrainian SSR since the inception of USSR and look how much that matters now.
In the 20's, which you like so much, Donbass was even majority Ukrainian, but Stalin did have a talent for serious demographic engineering.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
See? You show again that you know crap about history. Not surprising.
Majority Ukrainian... right.
Stalin do a lot of population movement, no doubt, but, that doesn't change some facts, that you want to ignore.
Is useless to talk to someone that is ignorant, ideological ride, and frankly don't want to accept that is living in an ideological world created/provided by others, to advance their agenda.
You are what the correct term is - a useful idiot. At least the Stalinists get that one correct.
 

Marduk

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See? You show again that you know crap about history. Not surprising.
Majority Ukrainian... right.
Stalin do a lot of population movement, no doubt, but, that doesn't change some facts, that you want to ignore.
I know crap about history?
Along with other territories inhabited by Ukrainians, the Donbas was incorporated into the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic in the aftermath of the Russian Civil War. Cossacks in the region were subjected to decossackisation during 1919–1921.[23] Ukrainians in the Donbas were greatly affected by the 1932–33 Holodomor famine and the Russification policy of Joseph Stalin. As most ethnic Ukrainians were rural peasant farmers (called "kulaks" by the Soviet regime), they bore the brunt of the famine.[24][25] According to the Association of Ukrainians in Great Britain, the population of the area that is now Luhansk Oblast declined by 25% as a result of the famine, whereas it declined by 15–20% in the area that is now Donetsk Oblast.[26] According to one estimate, 81.3% of those who died during the famine in the Ukrainian SSR were ethnic Ukrainians, whilst only 4.5% were ethnic Russians.[27]

Donbas was greatly affected by the Second World War. In the lead-up to the war, the Donbas was racked by poverty and food shortages. War preparations resulted in an extension of the working day for factory labourers, whilst those that deviated from the heightened standards were arrested.[28] German Reich leader Adolf Hitler viewed the resources of the Donbas as critical to Operation Barbarossa. As such, the Donbas suffered under Nazi occupation during 1941 and 1942.[29] Thousands of industrial laborers were forcibly "exported" to Germany for use in factories. In what was then called Stalino Oblast, now Donetsk Oblast, 279,000 civilians were killed over the course of the occupation. In Voroshilovgrad Oblast, now Luhansk Oblast, 45,649 were killed.[30] An offensive by the Red Army in 1943 resulted in the return of Donbas to Soviet control. The war had taken its toll, leaving the region both destroyed and depopulated.[citation needed]

During the reconstruction of the Donbas after World War II, large numbers of Russian workers arrived to repopulate the region, further altering the population balance. In 1926, 639,000 ethnic Russians resided in the Donbas.[31] By 1959, the ethnic Russian population was 2.55 million. Russification was further advanced by the 1958–59 Soviet educational reforms, which led to the near elimination of all Ukrainian-language schooling in the Donbas.[32][33] By the time of the Soviet Census of 1989, 45% of the population of the Donbas reported their ethnicity as Russian.[34] In 1990, the Interfront of the Donbass was founded as a movement against Ukrainian independence.
Stalin did a lot of population movement (some to afterlife), and this is what changed the facts on the ground. But still barely to 45%, post soviet economy did the rest.
Now put up or shut up.
Is useless to talk to someone that is ignorant, ideological ride, and frankly don't want to accept that is living in an ideological world created/provided by others, to advance their agenda.
You are what the correct term is - a useful idiot. At least the Stalinists get that one correct.
Better useful idiot than completely useless creature of moronic nature like you.
 

ATP

Well-known member
See? You show again that you know crap about history. Not surprising.
Majority Ukrainian... right.
Stalin do a lot of population movement, no doubt, but, that doesn't change some facts, that you want to ignore.
Is useless to talk to someone that is ignorant, ideological ride, and frankly don't want to accept that is living in an ideological world created/provided by others, to advance their agenda.
You are what the correct term is - a useful idiot. At least the Stalinists get that one correct.

Stalin do not moved population.He mostly genocided it becouse they do not wonted kolchoz,and resettled with new people.
And Crimes belong to Tatars,not Russia.
If it is not ukrainian,it should become independent tatar state.

Back to topic - Singapoore would probably fight China,too.Becouse after Taiwan they would be next.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
Tartars stopped been a relevant part of Crimea's population by late 18xx - way before Stalin. But that escaped your bias, I see.
Again, most of the posters on this site failed at history but majored in ideology.
Not surprisingly.
I bet most are ex-soviet republics exiled to the US or US-related countries. The second-generation (or third) by the lack of knowledge, is an educated guess.
 

paulobrito

Well-known member
Look, i understand many of you don't like me or the way i think.
I have served my time - boring, is just after the 'cardinal revolution' of 74 in Portugal, so no 'active' time.
After that, i graduated, and i have done 4 years of volunteer service all around the globe.
Been 4 times sunder fire, hit three times - two by shrapnel, one by an 5.56, ffs. I still have the scars - not pretty. Not funny at all.
After that, i have traveled around the globe - not a big challenge, mind you, just a bit expensive.
Yeah, i know a lot about history, not the 'official one' that is a lot of crap, that takes a lot of time and dedication for you to get, understand.
So, color me not impressed by people that regurgitated the party line about history - you know nothing, 'John Snow's'.
 

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