'Plan B' Military Coup To Remove Trump, Coordinated By Mattis and Other's, Said to Exist By Former Senator and Marine Vet Richard H. Black

Zachowon said:
There is more to it but yes the basics is I am defending my employer

Besides the fact in order for the IC to do its job is has to break the law...do you expect the IC to follow the law when trying to protect our country?

also, that document i linked, showed that he DID NOT KNOW as much as he claims he does. Hwll I even have more training then he does in the SIGINT field...

He also did not go through the proper channels, had he it would be a diffrent story.

and don't claim he did, when as the document I showed, says he did not..

there are some things that perhaps he was in the right for doing.. how he went about it and how he endangered US lives and methods is a big issues. He made life more difficult for us to get our enemies...

Thank you.
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Yes, yes I do. Otherwise what's the point of having a constitution, if the government is just going to violate it whenever it suits them? The NSA had their day in court, and lost; deal with it. Or don't; either way, it won't change the result, which I consider a win for the American people.

I'm not asking you to condemn your employers, but you don't have to white knight for the intelligence community either; you could just not say anything. Because honestly? I don't trust anything you have to say when it comes to this particular topic. Not that I'm calling you a liar, but just because you believe something is true, it does not then follow that it is; as evidenced by the swaths of people suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome.
 
Lord Invictus said:
Thank you for your candor. That should go without saying that everyone here can take everything you say with a pinch of salt?
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Since I cant back it up because of NDAs? Yeah I guess
Terthna said:
Yes, yes I do. Otherwise what's the point of having a constitution, if the government is just going to violate it whenever it suits them? The NSA had their day in court, and lost; deal with it. Or don't; either way, it won't change the result, which I consider a win for the American people.

I'm not asking you to condemn your employers, but you don't have to white knight for the intelligence community either; you could just not say anything. Because honestly? I don't trust anything you have to say when it comes to this particular topic. Not that I'm calling you a liar, but just because you believe something is true, it does not then follow that it is; as evidenced by the swaths of people suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome.
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It will make my job difficult, thus protecting the US populace.

Sadly I can not back up my argument because of the law. What I know of as the truth can not be defended. Thus to all fo your it may as well be false and I will understand that.

You all can take it with a grain of salt, what I say.
 
Zachowon said:
Since I cant back it up because of NDAs? Yeah I guess
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I don’t think your say so is evidence.

But thanks

Zachowon said:
Sadly I can not back up my argument because of the law. What I know of as the truth can not be defended. Thus to all fo your it may as well be false and I will understand that.
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So your argument rests on classified information you know but can’t share with us.

That’s very convenient.

And even if so, I don’t think that negates the point.

Snowden may have not followed proper channels. Such as they are. But he did reveal to the public what things the NSA gets up to. Things that were dismissed as conspiracy theories on a few years before.

I don’t particularly care if Snowden damaged US intrigues, or otherwise made spooks’ jobs harder. I’m not a booster for american imperialism.

As for protecting the american populace-strangely, the spooks have spent for times cooking up anti Trump dossiers, and blowing up Al Qaeda insurgents in Yemen.

That’s the glorious intelligence community folks in which we must place our full and undiluted trust!
 
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Zachowon said:
Since I cant back it up because of NDAs? Yeah I guess

It will make my job difficult, thus protecting the US populace.

Sadly I can not back up my argument because of the law. What I know of as the truth can not be defended. Thus to all fo your it may as well be false and I will understand that.

You all can take it with a grain of salt, what I say.
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I recognize the good intentions behind what you do, but I have no interest in trading my liberty for safety. If that means I must accept the risk of something horrible happening to me, then so be it.
 
Let's not forget neither Al-Qaeda or NK are actual threats to the territorial integrity of the United States, its sovereignty, or the bulk of its citizens lives.

There is no threat in the world that is.

Except for thermonuclear war.
 
Lord Invictus said:
I don’t think your say so is evidence.

But thanks


So your argument rests on classified information you know but can’t share with us.

That’s very convenient.

And even if so, I don’t think that negates the point.

Snowden may have not followed proper channels. Such as they are. But he did reveal to the public what things the NSA gets up to. Things that were dismissed as conspiracy theories on a few years before.

I don’t particularly care if Snowden damaged US intrigues, or otherwise made spooks’ jobs harder. I’m not a booster for american imperialism.

As for protecting the american populace-strangely, the spooks have spent for times cooking up anti Trump dossiers, and blowing up Al Qaeda insurgents in Yemen.

That’s the glorious intelligence community folks in which we must place our full and undiluted trust!
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Terthna said:
I recognize the good intentions behind what you do, but I have no interest in trading my liberty for safety. If that means I must accept the risk of something horrible happening to me, then so be it.
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Lord Invictus said:
Let's not forget neither Al-Qaeda or NK are actual threats to the territorial integrity of the United States, its sovereignty, or the bulk of its citizens lives.

There is no threat in the world that is.

Except for thermonuclear war.
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AHAHAHAH there are. As the NSA focuses on ALL foreign threats, from AQ and ISIS to Russia, China and Iran.

I just know any argument I would like to make I can not make.
 
Zachowon said:
Snip
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Okay, while I consider this whole thread to be filled with the heights of idiocy that I’m not even going to engage with. I have to say this.

Zachowon, if you can’t make your argument because your job along with the superiors you report to will rightfully take you over the coals for spilling classified info on a civvie forum. Then I suggest you disengage from the argument and just put Lord Invictus on ignore.
 
Reklos said:
Okay, while I consider this whole thread to be filled with the heights of idiocy that I’m not even going to engage with. I have to say this.

Zachowon, if you can’t make your argument because your job along with the superiors you report to will rightfully take you over the coals for spilling classified info on a civvie forum. Then I suggest you disengage from the argument and just put Lord Invictus on ignore.
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I wont put anyone on ignore.

I am dropping my arguments.
 
Zachowon said:
AHAHAHAH there are. As the NSA focuses on ALL foreign threats, from AQ and ISIS to Russia, China and Iran.

I just know any argument I would like to make I can not make.
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I didn’t say it not?

Russia, China, and Iran are no threats to the American heartland. (Except for nuclear weapons).

ISIS and Al Qaeda are even less a threat.

Unless of course they have secret super secret armies or advanced tech or something else that is a massive advantage over the US.
 
Lord Invictus said:
I didn’t say it not?

Russia, China, and Iran are no threats to the American heartland. (Except for nuclear weapons).

ISIS and Al Qaeda are even less a threat.

Unless of course they have secret super secret armies or advanced tech or something else that is a massive advantage over the US.
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I am not going to bother arguing as any thing to help I cant say
 
Zachowon said:
I am not going to bother arguing as any thing to help I cant say
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If they had the technology or resources to actually threaten the survival of the US government or people(excluding nuclear weapons) I suspect that wouldn’t be super classified information.

Of course they have nukes. Of course they have cyber units, biological weapons, chems, etc...

That’s why we have MAD.

But I do not believe they have anything more exotic than that.

If they did, it would likely be public knowledge.
 
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What would be your allowable death toll, in US Citizens abroad before a threat is considered a threat? You called out the heartland, so should all threats OCONUS just be ignored? Anyone travelling should be on their own? Those are the threats he's talking about.

As for Snowden, that guy deserves jail regardless of what he thought he was doing. There's a WPA for a reason, and if he'd documented his concerns and brought them to the proper channels, there would be nothing anyone could do about it. Needless to say, Wikileaks is not in the "proper channels."

@Zachowon you misstated something earlier about breaking laws. When you're in the conduct of your duties IAW Title 50 you're not violating laws, you just have different ones that apply to you. You shouldn't misrepresent yourself as breaking laws when you're authorized to engage in the actions. No different than shooting an enemy combatant not being considered murder.
 
Panzerkraken said:
What would be your allowable death toll, in US Citizens abroad before a threat is considered a threat? You called out the heartland, so should all threats OCONUS just be ignored? Anyone travelling should be on their own? Those are the threats he's talking about.
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For the size, power, and reach of these intelligence agencies(not to mention their contemptible political machinations), a threat to the survival of the government or the people of the United States.

Americans traveling abroad especially in certain countries put their own lives at risk.

Obviously there are threats to the homeland, but as this thread shows, apparently the vaunted "Intelligence Community" considers Donald Trump a threat. Which means...they either consider his voters a threat or deem they don't actually have a right to participate in the political process.

Like shit, does anyone realize just how bad this is?

The intelligence spooks intervening in domestic politics is banana tier country. Or its Soviet Union level state intrigue.

Where is the actual popular will?

You know the people who elected Donald Trump?

The institutions and personnel Zachowon are so fervently defending are against and seeking to subvert both of the above.

These institutions are incompatible with a free republic.
 
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Panzerkraken said:
What would be your allowable death toll, in US Citizens abroad before a threat is considered a threat? You called out the heartland, so should all threats OCONUS just be ignored? Anyone travelling should be on their own? Those are the threats he's talking about.

As for Snowden, that guy deserves jail regardless of what he thought he was doing. There's a WPA for a reason, and if he'd documented his concerns and brought them to the proper channels, there would be nothing anyone could do about it. Needless to say, Wikileaks is not in the "proper channels."

@Zachowon you misstated something earlier about breaking laws. When you're in the conduct of your duties IAW Title 50 you're not violating laws, you just have different ones that apply to you. You shouldn't misrepresent yourself as breaking laws when you're authorized to engage in the actions. No different than shooting an enemy combatant not being considered murder.
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You are right. That was my bad. It isn't breaking laws just having things that allow for it to be legal if I follow certain procedures
Lord Invictus said:
For the size, power, and reach of these intelligence agencies(not to mention their contemptible political machinations), a threat to the survival of the government or the people of the United States.

Americans traveling abroad especially in certain countries put their own lives at risk.

Obviously there are threats to the homeland, but as this thread shows, apparently the vaunted "Intelligence Community" considers Donald Trump a threat. Which means...they either consider his voters a threat or deem they don't actually have a right to participate in the political process.

Like shit, does anyone realize just how bad this is?

The intelligence spooks intervening in domestic politics is banana tier country. Or its Soviet Union level state intrigue.

Where is the actual popular will?

You know the people who elected Donald Trump?

The institutions and personnel Zachowon are so fervently defending are against and seeking to subvert both of the above.

These institutions are incompatible with a free republic.
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I mainly defend the NSA and the DoD IC.
 
PsihoKekec said:
As the joke goes:
A: How do you know CIA had nothing to do with Kennedy's assassination?
B: He is dead.
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Kennedy was a mob hit, it's just admitting the mob knocked off a POTUS really makes a lot of gov agencies look incompetent or more incompetent.

A Rusky/Marxist assassin, or lone loon, or inside job, or such looks less damaging to their credibility.
 
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