The Americas Chaos In Haiti

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Lord Sovereign said:
What exactly is Haiti's issue that prevents a functioning society? I mean that in a serious way as my knowledge of the region isn't as good as I'd like it to be. All I am aware of is they got fleeced by the French and keep being hit by Earthquakes.
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Have you seen the documentary The Cannibal Warlords of Liberia? Featuring such luminaries as General Butt Naked, who is quoted as saying "I feed them the heart of an innocent child" (re: the initiation ritual for his child soldiers)?

If you're not familiar, then maybe you know about the civil war in Sierra Leone, right next door, where the rebel forces (including the self-styled "West Side Niggaz") carried out the infamous and very aptly titled "Operation No Living Thing", in which they went block by block in order to loot, rape and kill indiscriminately.

Or have you perhaps seen footage of South African "necklacing"? Perchance you are somewhat familiar with the goings-in on Rwanda, c. 1994? Failing that, the exploits of Robert Mugabe in "liberated" Zimbabwe might ring a bell, since they involve such happy stuff as "punitive gang rape"? I've not yet mentioned Uganda under Idi Amin, which I'm sure you'll agree is a gross oversight...

Well. That exact issue is also the problem of Haiti. Pure and simple: a piece of Sub-Saharan Africa has been transplanted across the ocean, and the outcomes are the exact same. What we see here can be no surprise to anyone who simply understands that Haiti is at its core "Africa-across-the-Sea". Once you know that, and if you know anything at all about Africa, the things we see in Haiti become... depressingly predictable.
 
Skallagrim said:
Have you seen the documentary The Cannibal Warlords of Liberia? Featuring such luminaries as General Butt Naked, who is quoted as saying "I feed them the heart of an innocent child" (re: the initiation ritual for his child soldiers)?

If you're not familiar, then maybe you know about the civil war in Sierra Leone, right next door, where the rebel forces (including the self-styled "West Side Niggaz") carried out the infamous and very aptly titled "Operation No Living Thing", in which they went block by block in order to loot, rape and kill indiscriminately.

Or have you perhaps seen footage of South African "necklacing"? Perchance you are somewhat familiar with the goings-in on Rwanda, c. 1994? Failing that, the exploits of Robert Mugabe in "liberated" Zimbabwe might ring a bell, since they involve such happy stuff as "punitive gang rape"? I've not yet mentioned Uganda under Idi Amin, which I'm sure you'll agree is a gross oversight...

Well. That exact issue is also the problem of Haiti. Pure and simple: a piece of Sub-Saharan Africa has been transplanted across the ocean, and the outcomes are the exact same. What we see here can be no surprise to anyone who simply understands that Haiti is at its core "Africa-across-the-Sea". Once you know that, and if you know anything at all about Africa, the things we see in Haiti become... depressingly predictable.
Click to expand...
Grim stuff. As I understand it Sub-Saharan Africa never quite got out of the Iron Age (specifically in mentality) and is chronically tribal as it is.

If the impression I’ve got from that is correct, then Haiti’s only hope is for the most vicious bastard in their history to come along and exterminate the opposition before stabilising the situation?

I suppose that makes my previous statement ring true: Haiti needs a king.

Edit: Is that why the Dominican Republic is so different to its neighbour? They’re more quintessential Latin America/Spanish Imperial Echo than “Africa across the sea“ so to speak?
 
Maybe all that voodoo mixed with the 1804 genocide of the Saint-Domingue whites has left their half of the island stuck under the French version of the 'Indian burial ground curse' trope.

Lord Sovereign said:
Grim stuff. As I understand it Sub-Saharan Africa never quite got out of the Iron Age (specifically in mentality) and is chronically tribal as it is.

If the impression I’ve got from that is correct, then Haiti’s only hope is for the most vicious bastard in their history to come along and exterminate the opposition before stabilising the situation?

I suppose that makes my previous statement ring true: Haiti needs a king.

Edit: Is that why the Dominican Republic is so different to its neighbour? They’re more quintessential Latin America/Spanish Imperial Echo than “Africa across the sea“ so to speak?
Click to expand...
They tried a king before. And two different empires, the former of which was founded by the genocidaire of 1804 (Dessalines). Didn't work out too well. The Haitians have, to my knowledge, tried just about everything from monarchy to military dictatorship to aristocratic oligarchy to multiparty democracy to pan-African black ultranationalism verging on Theocratic Voudoun Black National-Socialism (Noirisme & the Duvaliers) to foreign occupation - and literally none of these have worked, not even splitting the country into a monarchist north and republican south (1808-20) did any good for that matter. I guess anarchy under Great Warlord Barbecue is next. Their leaders have not lacked for sadistic genocidal bastardry, given the likes of Dessalines & Duvalier in the pages of their blood-soaked history, so that can't be the missing ingredient either.
 
Didn't that Island always have cannibal tribes though? this is just them returning to their traditions. I've been told that we need to respect indigenous cultures and western cultural values aren't better. I propose we quarantine them for a decade or two and test the theory. I am sure by the end of it they will have a very LGBTQAIP+ positive country with women's rights and avacado toast.
 

www.newsnationnow.com

US pledges an additional $100M for a multinational force awaiting deployment to violence-hit Haiti

U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Monday announced an additional $100 million to finance the deployment of a multinational force to Haiti following a meeting with Caribbean leaders in Jamai…
www.newsnationnow.com www.newsnationnow.com

“U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Monday announced an additional $100 million to finance the deployment of a multinational force to Haiti following a meeting with Caribbean leaders in Jamaica to halt the country's violent crisis.

Blinken also announced another $33 million in humanitarian aid and the creation of a joint proposal agreed on by Caribbean leaders and "all of the Haitian stakeholders to expedite a political transition" and create a "presidential college."

He said the college would take "concrete steps" he did not identify to meet the needs of Haitian people and enable the pending deployment of the multinational force to be led by Kenya. Blinken also noted that the U.S. Department of Defense doubled its support for the mission, having previously set aside $100 million.”

so the USA is giving over 300 million dollars in total to “help” Haiti. What percentage of that is actually going to help anyone who actually needs it do you guys bet. Also I need to one day sit down and do the math on the the ”foreign aid” the USA gives out.
 
We should send these people to explain to them that cannibalistic warlords are no the right way forth and that they should embrace pronoun liberalism.

GITvEbwXEAAtrbS
 
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Circle of Willis said:
They tried a king before. And two different empires, the former of which was founded by the genocidaire of 1804 (Dessalines). Didn't work out too well. The Haitians have, to my knowledge, tried just about everything from monarchy to military dictatorship to aristocratic oligarchy to multiparty democracy to pan-African black ultranationalism verging on Theocratic Voudoun Black National-Socialism (Noirisme & the Duvaliers) to foreign occupation - and literally none of these have worked, not even splitting the country into a monarchist north and republican south (1808-20) did any good for that matter. I guess anarchy under Great Warlord Barbecue is next. Their leaders have not lacked for sadistic genocidal bastardry, given the likes of Dessalines & Duvalier in the pages of their blood-soaked history, so that can't be the missing ingredient either.
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So…
Circle of Willis said:
Maybe all that voodoo mixed with the 1804 genocide of the Saint-Domingue whites has left their half of the island stuck under the French version of the 'Indian burial ground curse' trope.
Click to expand...
Yeah.

Cursed.
 
Skallagrim said:
Have you seen the documentary The Cannibal Warlords of Liberia? Featuring such luminaries as General Butt Naked, who is quoted as saying "I feed them the heart of an innocent child" (re: the initiation ritual for his child soldiers)?

If you're not familiar, then maybe you know about the civil war in Sierra Leone, right next door, where the rebel forces (including the self-styled "West Side Niggaz") carried out the infamous and very aptly titled "Operation No Living Thing", in which they went block by block in order to loot, rape and kill indiscriminately.

Or have you perhaps seen footage of South African "necklacing"? Perchance you are somewhat familiar with the goings-in on Rwanda, c. 1994? Failing that, the exploits of Robert Mugabe in "liberated" Zimbabwe might ring a bell, since they involve such happy stuff as "punitive gang rape"? I've not yet mentioned Uganda under Idi Amin, which I'm sure you'll agree is a gross oversight...

Well. That exact issue is also the problem of Haiti. Pure and simple: a piece of Sub-Saharan Africa has been transplanted across the ocean, and the outcomes are the exact same. What we see here can be no surprise to anyone who simply understands that Haiti is at its core "Africa-across-the-Sea". Once you know that, and if you know anything at all about Africa, the things we see in Haiti become... depressingly predictable.
Click to expand...

Ancient europe, and asia was much the same how long do you think before they grow out of it?
 
Cherico said:
Ancient europe, and asia was much the same how long do you think before they grow out of it?
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I’m not sure if “grow out of it” is the right term. Indeed, in observing the more ancient and tribal societies of North Western Europe (Celts, Germans, etc) we may find some ideas as to how to ameliorate Haiti’s misery. Ancient problems, ancient solutions, and all that.

Indeed, this feeds into how I think it was a mistake to divide Africa up the way we did after Imperial withdrawal: instead of slamming all these tribes together between lines we drew, I wonder if it might not have been better to set up hundreds of city states and micro nations (some bound together in loose confederations) founded on tribal lines.
 
Lord Sovereign said:
I’m not sure if “grow out of it” is the right term. Indeed, in observing the more ancient and tribal societies of North Western Europe (Celts, Germans, etc) we may find some ideas as to how to ameliorate Haiti’s misery. Ancient problems, ancient solutions, and all that.

Indeed, this feeds into how I think it was a mistake to divide Africa up the way we did after Imperial withdrawal: instead of slamming all these tribes together between lines we drew, I wonder if it might not have been better to set up hundreds of city states and micro nations (some bound together in loose confederations) founded on tribal lines.
Click to expand...

What was stopping them from doing that once we left?
 
Lord Sovereign said:
I’m not sure if “grow out of it” is the right term. Indeed, in observing the more ancient and tribal societies of North Western Europe (Celts, Germans, etc) we may find some ideas as to how to ameliorate Haiti’s misery. Ancient problems, ancient solutions, and all that.

Indeed, this feeds into how I think it was a mistake to divide Africa up the way we did after Imperial withdrawal: instead of slamming all these tribes together between lines we drew, I wonder if it might not have been better to set up hundreds of city states and micro nations (some bound together in loose confederations) founded on tribal lines.
Click to expand...
1. The tribes aren't exactly war averse Europeans, some would still clobber each other eagerly.
2. It would utterly paralyze the UN.
3. Some of the smaller and not so small states would be permanently economically dysfunctional due to lack of certain resources, transport routes or access to sea, guaranteeing the same or worse misery as now.
4. If tribal politics and above problems weren't an issue, nothing stops them from replicating the Czechoslovakia scenario with bloodless, negotiated, and voluntary country splits.
 
Lord Sovereign said:
we may find some ideas as to how to ameliorate Haiti’s misery.
Click to expand...
Honestly?

I think Haiti should be left alone for a few decades and left to solve its own problems, not quarantined, just left alone. Even includes if a gang or warlord became the sovereign. Barring said warlord isn't Pol Pot levels of terrible.

That way the country can actually have an opportunity to slowly evolve stable powers structures. Instead of constantly being stirred and prodded.
 
LordDemiurge said:
Honestly?

I think Haiti should be left alone for a few decades and left to solve its own problems, not quarantined, just left alone. Even includes if a gang or warlord became the sovereign. Barring said warlord isn't Pol Pot levels of terrible.

That way the country can actually have an opportunity to slowly evolve stable powers structures. Instead of constantly being stirred and prodded.
Click to expand...

that might be the best solution.
 
LordDemiurge said:
Honestly?

I think Haiti should be left alone for a few decades and left to solve its own problems, not quarantined, just left alone. Even includes if a gang or warlord became the sovereign. Barring said warlord isn't Pol Pot levels of terrible.

That way the country can actually have an opportunity to slowly evolve stable powers structures. Instead of constantly being stirred and prodded.
Click to expand...
I think we should watch and wait, observing the various warlords and gang leaders closely, and whosoever has an aptitude for statecraft whilst not eating people we should lend some support to.
 
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