Military US Military Is Scared Americans Won't Fight For Globalism

[Cherico]

So, let's look at potential solutions:

Raise pay, working conditions and benefits for soldiers until the job starts to appeal again.
Disadvantages:

• Expensive, I can just hear the bureaucrats squealing now at the very thought.
• After decades of constant lying, who'd trust the recruiter propagandists that this time they weren't gonna screw you over?
• Could allow soldiers to build up wealth, contrary to the long-term goal of reducing everyone but the plutocrats to bankrupt rent-slaves.

American Foreign League. Service guarantees citizenship.
Disadvantages:

• You know all those statistics about how many American soldiers would refuse to fire upon American citizens or otherwise refuse totalitarian orders against their own people? Not an issue with a foreign varangian guard.
• An Arminius or even an Odoacer scenario. Traditionally, replacing untrustworthy native soldiers with barbarian mercenaries keeps backfiring spectacularly.

Fuck up the economy so badly that hiring yourselves out as glorified mercenaries is the only available career.
Disadvantages:

• If you're gonna be at risk of getting shot in the process of fighting a war anyway, why join the army of the people who put you in that situation instead of one of the civilian militias forming to take revenge on them? It'd be the fall of the Weimar Republic all over again, only this time the scapegoats genuinely would be guilty.

Robots.
Disadvantages:

• Technology isn't quite there yet, ask again in another decade or two. Yeah, I've heard all the conspiracy theories about the military-industry complex black budget, keeping gadgetry ahead of the civilian market to themselves and the supposed real reason for the global microchip shortage, but I don't believe them, much more likely that the money got embezzled on account of the lack of oversight than used to build an army of terminators.
• Same loyalty-to-the-politicians-not-the-people varangian guard issue as an American Foreign League.
• If their loyalty can be challenged, there's always the risk that suddenly the entire leadership of the status quo will be massacred by their own bodyguards and the Boston Dynamics CEO, some peon coder who put a backdoor in their software, the hacker known as 4chan, an unexpectedly intelligent artificially intelligent operating system, etc, proclaims themselves the first American Emperor.

another option is to just bring back the draft or conscription.

 

[Simonbob]

another option is to just bring back the draft or conscription.

Not really.

The end result of a draft is always crappy troops. That's been shown again and again.


Still, given how stupid it is, the current US Gov might try.

 

[Cherico]

Not really.

The end result of a draft is always crappy troops. That's been shown again and again.


Still, given how stupid it is, the current US Gov might try.

The thing is in a serious war lots of crappy troops can win you said war.

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

The thing is in a serious war lots of crappy troops can win you said war.

As long as they can perform decently on the battlefield. Although given the kind of potential recruits joining the US military, the crappy troops can only get you so far before they end up becoming POWs.

 

[Simonbob]

The thing is in a serious war lots of crappy troops can win you said war.

Perhaps. Usually, that kind of loss isn't worth it.

If you can't motivate your troops enough to join, why are you fighting in the first place? It's happened repeatedly.

Heck, that's pretty much the story of both USSR and US vs Afganistan. The troops didn't want to be there, didn't want to fight, and the Taliban did.

Even with numbers and tech, winning all sorts of battles, the war was lost from before they even started.

 

[Marduk]

The thing is in a serious war lots of crappy troops can win you said war.

That's WW1 warfare in a nutshell. War was won with rifles, machineguns and cannons, and all of these took warm bodies to staff, lots of them, with not that much training or intellectual requirements.
Now we live in an age of jets with 9 figure prices, missiles with 7 figure prices, tanks with 8 figure prices. Each needs a handful of highly skilled operators and few dozens of support personnel, many of them technicians and engineers highly sought after on the civilian market too, and behind them a high tech industrial base to make the vehicles and parts. We are entering the economy-warfare setup closer to middle ages, with armies consisting of professionals who train their entire lives and using extremely expensive equipment, supported by occasional levy/mercenaries but not too much of that. And above all, requiring massive economic backing. If you lack the former, you get Iraq or Saudi Arabia. If you lack the latter, you get North Korea or Cuba. If you lack both, you get Somalia or Afghanistan, aka hoping that the other side has some reason to want to avoid wrecking your whole country and massacring everyone because that's the only thing that could stop them.

Heck, that's pretty much the story of both USSR and US vs Afganistan. The troops didn't want to be there, didn't want to fight, and the Taliban did.

Even with numbers and tech, winning all sorts of battles, the war was lost from before they even started.

Neither was the reason for Afghanistan in either the case of USA nor USSR.
The troops didn't have much say in either case, the losses were inconvenient politically (though after "afghanization" of the war US ones were very low), the economic cost was not popular, and politically this was going nowhere, escalating the previous 2 problems.
The Taliban, as they still do, played funny games with Afghan\Pakistan border in both cases and that was their whole survival trick. When times get tough, be somewhere they can't pursue you or bomb you.
The only way to "win" Afghanistan in a way that sticks would be USSR performing settler colonialism on it, because USA sure as hell doesn't have the political setup for it.
Once Pashtuns would be replaced by people loyal to the outside power who have no friends nor interest in what's on the other side of Durand Line, then the insurgency problem would be over.

 

[Bacle]

another option is to just bring back the draft or conscription.

It's political suicide to even float that idea outside the Pentagon, and even in the Pentagon it's a distasteful subject.

There is a reason there has not been a draft since Vietnam, and why even general prefer an all volunteer force.

Drafts get you warm bodies, but the type of warfare that goes on these days is not the type where victory can be achieved just by having more warm bodies on the field. Particularly when said many of said warm bodies do not want to be there, and drones are cheaper than conscripts.

A draft would also see lots of people flee abroad to avoid it, and desertion in the ranks like has not been seen since the Civil War.

As well, MAD means that any opponent strong enough to require a draft to fight them on 'even terms' also has enough nukes to make a draft pointless, because conscripts are not going to stop ICBM/SLBM/nuke torps like the Status-6.

 

[WolfBear]

another option is to just bring back the draft or conscription.

But the rich will be able to dodge it, no?

It's political suicide to even float that idea outside the Pentagon, and even in the Pentagon it's a distasteful subject.

There is a reason there has not been a draft since Vietnam, and why even general prefer an all volunteer force.

Drafts get you warm bodies, but the type of warfare that goes on these days is not the type where victory can be achieved just by having more warm bodies on the field. Particularly when said many of said warm bodies do not want to be there, and drones are cheaper than conscripts.

A draft would also see lots of people flee abroad to avoid it, and desertion in the ranks like has not been seen since the Civil War.

As well, MAD means that any opponent strong enough to require a draft to fight them on 'even terms' also has enough nukes to make a draft pointless, because conscripts are not going to stop ICBM/SLBM/nuke torps like the Status-6.

Excellent analysis!

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

I would also like to point out that training drone operators would take a long time to complete, and possibly just as expensive. Even if that were the case, who is qualified enough to operate drones for the military? The video gamers?

 

[Bacle]

@Zachowon

Are your bosses blind or dumb, or just don't care about possibly igniting a civil war if they enact this bullshit?


Do they really think trying to enact a draft is at all feasible politically or socially these days?

The paper in the OP laid out why the military has had retention/recruitment issues, and now they actually think even floating the idea of a draft is at all a smart move. How much of their own farts have the brass been huffing?

 

[Spartan303]

They've been talking about enacting a draft for 3 decades. It hasn't happened yet and likely wont happen now.

 

[Bacle]

They've been talking about enacting a draft for 3 decades. It hasn't happened yet and likely wont happen now.

I want you to look at the stupidity that has come out of DC in the past few years and tell me with a straight face that the White House and Pentagon aren't dumb enough to try this.

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Mandatory conscription in the US? I honestly hope that these American would-be conscripts don’t end up bei treated like shit, but that’s asking too much.

 

[Spartan303]

I want you to look at the stupidity that has come out of DC in the past few years and tell me with a straight face that the White House and Pentagon aren't dumb enough to try this.

They're not. Not yet. There is literally no reason for it. It would kill any support the Democrats have lift, which isn't much. And any conscripts they'd get out of it wouldn't be loyal to them. There is a reason we haven't used the draft since Vietnam. So calm down.

 

[Bacle]

They're not. Not yet. There is literally no reason for it. It would kill any support the Democrats have lift, which isn't much. And any conscripts they'd get out of it wouldn't be loyal to them. There is a reason we haven't used the draft since Vietnam. So calm down.

If they can just rig the elections again like in 2020, why would they fear losing electoral support?

Edit: Like, the idea that they actually fear political backlash over something like this, when they can control the vote counting, is playing by political rules that haven't applied for years now.

And I'd rather be paranoid about something like this and raise the alarm, than allow it to slip under the radar.

 

[Spartan303]

If they can just rig the elections again like in 2020, why would they fear losing electoral support?

Edit: Like, the idea that they actually fear political backlash over something like this, when they can control the vote counting, is playing by political rules that haven't applied for years now.

And I'd rather be paranoid about something like this and raise the alarm, than allow it to slip under the radar.

They can't rig the election like they did before because the fear of Covid and the lockdowns literally gave them a once in a lifetime opportunity to cheat. That play is now no longer on the table. And not to mention the dozens of new voter registration laws on the table not to mention voter police that have been hired. New steps have been taken to ensure something like that never happens again.

And now people are waking up to what Joe Biden and the Democrats have been doing for decades. There is no hiding it anymore. So yes they fear the Backlash.

 

[Cherico]

They can't rig the election like they did before because the fear of Covid and the lockdowns literally gave them a once in a lifetime opportunity to cheat. That play is now no longer on the table. And not to mention the dozens of new voter registration laws on the table not to mention voter police that have been hired. New steps have been taken to ensure something like that never happens again.

And now people are waking up to what Joe Biden and the Democrats have been doing for decades. There is no hiding it anymore. So yes they fear the Backlash.

I don't feel any sympathy for them man like non at all.

 

[Bacle]

They can't rig the election like they did before because the fear of Covid and the lockdowns literally gave them a once in a lifetime opportunity to cheat. That play is now no longer on the table. And not to mention the dozens of new voter registration laws on the table not to mention voter police that have been hired. New steps have been taken to ensure something like that never happens again.

And now people are waking up to what Joe Biden and the Democrats have been doing for decades. There is no hiding it anymore. So yes they fear the Backlash.

They only fear some CEO's turning against them and possibly funding their primary opponents, not actually being held to account for what they have done.

Plus, thanks to Putin going full retard, they can also just say anyone who isn't for the draft is a "Russian sympathizer", like they are already doing for people who question the 2020 election.

I will only believe they cannot avoid the backlash if/when a Red Wave happens, and we see actually repurcussions for the shit that has happened the past few years.

Till then I consider 'the coming backlash' nothing more than wishful thinking and operate on the assumption that the elite and powers in DC have nothing holding them in check anymore except their own ego's and pride.

Which is precisely why people need to be aware they are again floating the idea of a draft, because if they can steal elections, then they need not fear doing something so monumentally stupid.

 

[PsihoKekec]

To the surprise of absolutely no one

 

[Zachowon]

@Zachowon

Are your bosses blind or dumb, or just don't care about possibly igniting a civil war if they enact this bullshit?


Do they really think trying to enact a draft is at all feasible politically or socially these days?

The paper in the OP laid out why the military has had retention/recruitment issues, and now they actually think even floating the idea of a draft is at all a smart move. How much of their own farts have the brass been huffing?

They are not going tk draft.
It is literally saying how those who are pacifists wint be forced to conflict

To the surprise of absolutely no one

I know people who are more pissed they replaced the leg tuck because it was actually useful.

Because a few high ranking female officers didn't want to put in the fucking work.

Don't worry people are gonna make the Army regret this decision. Majority do not try to try and make the numbers show how stupid it is.