Military US Military Is Scared Americans Won't Fight For Globalism

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
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Then you are in for a world of surprises. Its a pet peeve theory created by naive peacenik left.
Meanwhile, you would be clever to compare your theory to real, existing authoritarian countries whose governments do in fact threaten their population on a regular basis.
Do they have a strong, professional military?
After 2020, the US isn't much better than a hopped up, nuclear armed banana republic.

I am absolutely worried that the political winds that allowed the Biden Admin to become a thing are not nearly as worried about a Red Wave as many here like to tell each other.

I am very concerned that a Woke Pentagon, State Dept, and White House would be little different than what Putin has forced on Russia if they are given a war and are able to secure more power and military force. They rigged an election once, they will do it again, and a war would make it easier for them to do so.

And unlike some I know better than to think the military can be changed from the inside out anymore, or be considered a non-political entity. It is it's own political branch and party to a large degree, with a polite fiction of political neutrality maintained for PR purposes.

We might be the least worst banana republic, but we are no longer the people who can claim moral high ground over a lot of rather shady electoral systems we usually associate with Africa and South America.

Which means it is necessary to start viewing US armed forces as potentially being willing to follow their paymasters more than the Constitution, if the current political climate keeps up.
 

Marduk

Well-known member
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After 2020, the US isn't much better than a hopped up, nuclear armed banana republic.

I am absolutely worried that the political winds that allowed the Biden Admin to become a thing are not nearly as worried about a Red Wave as many here like to tell each other.

I am very concerned that a Woke Pentagon, State Dept, and White House would be little different than what Putin has forced on Russia if they are given a war and are able to secure more power and military force. They rigged an election once, they will do it again, and a war would make it easier for them to do so.

And unlike some I know better than to think the military can be changed from the inside out anymore, or be considered a non-political entity. It is it's own political branch and party to a large degree, with a polite fiction of political neutrality maintained for PR purposes.

We might be the least worst banana republic, but we are no longer the people who can claim moral high ground over a lot of rather shady electoral systems we usually associate with Africa and South America.

Which means it is necessary to start viewing US armed forces as potentially being willing to follow their paymasters more than the Constitution, if the current political climate keeps up.
You have completely missed my point. Banana republics never have the kind of armies you are fearing here. Especially those not explicitly ruled by a military junta.
Some have a small military (Belarus). Some have a large one (North Korea). But universally the military is made mostly of conscripts who don't want to be there, led by more or less loyal, probably corrupt, competence optional officers.
Its when you start to see odd police, not-police, totally not-secret-police organizations with weird hiring requirements that you should start to worry. That's who does most of the dirty work in such countries.

Why don't they create a quality military despite usually wanting to make a lot of use of theirs?
The thing is, a well organized, competent and motivated military merely by existing is, to such banana republic governments, a fairly unacceptable risk that the leadership of such military might one day decide that the military is run better than the rest of the country, and as such, they might get the idea that they could do the job of ruling the country better...
And of all people in the banana republic they would have the firepower to make the national gendermerie, revolutionary guard, secret police and whatever else does the dirty work normally think twice about trying to stop them.
 
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sillygoose

Well-known member
You have completely missed my point. Banana republics never have the kind of armies you are fearing here. Especially those not explicitly ruled by a military junta.
Some have a small military (Belarus). Some have a large one (North Korea). But universally the military is made mostly of conscripts who don't want to be there, led by more or less loyal, probably corrupt, competence optional officers.
Its when you start to see odd police, not-police, totally not-secret-police organizations with weird hiring requirements that you should start to worry. That's who does most of the dirty work in such countries.

Why don't they create a quality military despite usually wanting to make a lot of use of theirs?
The thing is, a well organized, competent and motivated military merely by existing is, to such banana republic governments, a fairly unacceptable risk that the leadership of such military might one day decide that the military is run better than the rest of the country, and as such, they might get the idea that they could do the job of ruling the country better...
And of all people in the banana republic they would have the firepower to make the national gendermerie, revolutionary guard, secret police and whatever else does the dirty work normally think twice about trying to stop them.
Given the ideological purge that has been done of the US military I question the capabilities it has to actually win a semi-peer level conflict at this point. It is good enough to beat up 3rd world militaries and insurgents...sort of, but having the US army be willing to fight and die like the Russians or Ukrainians have is unlikely. Iraq pushed the military to the brink and it is treated as little more than a jobs program for most branches at this point. SF is another story, but apparently they aren't even what they used to be at this point. Again I'm talking about the combat arms, the technology side of it is probably fine since they won't be in the line of fire.
 

BlackDragon98

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Banned - Politics
Given the ideological purge that has been done of the US military I question the capabilities it has to actually win a semi-peer level conflict at this point. It is good enough to beat up 3rd world militaries and insurgents...sort of, but having the US army be willing to fight and die like the Russians or Ukrainians have is unlikely. Iraq pushed the military to the brink and it is treated as little more than a jobs program for most branches at this point. SF is another story, but apparently they aren't even what they used to be at this point. Again I'm talking about the combat arms, the technology side of it is probably fine since they won't be in the line of fire.
One of the reasons is that the US Military is systemically court-martialling individuals that would have been war heroes in WW2 or Vietnam.

1st Lt. Micheal Behenna, 1st. Lt. Clint Lorance, Sgt. Derrick Miller, Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn, Master Sgt. John Hatley, CPO Edward R. Gallagher.

Half of them were tried based on testimony from subordinates who straight up lied to cover up their own smelly asses.

Who would want to join a military that court martials and imprisons soldiers and officers who would otherwise be war heroes?
 

Zachowon

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People think there has been an ideological purge.

There hasn't been....
Because we arnt supposed to be political on uniform and when out of ot STILL have to be careful what we do..
But people don't realize that
 

sillygoose

Well-known member


Very good point, and it's not just the poor who are not seeing a lot of appeal in being defenders of the Bretton Woods agreement.

Bretton Woods was killed by Nixon in the early 1970s and replaced by the petro-dollar and as a result the USD as the global reserve currency. The existing system is the dollar as a gold stand in. Some call it 'Bretton Woods II', but that's not really accurate.
 

Spartan303

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Osaul


They really are getting desperate for bodies; turns out pride flags aren't great recruitment tools.



No. Infact they do quite the opposite. Now, put someone like Trump in office or DeSantis, have them purge the Woke BS and get back to Warfighting basics. You'll see recruitment go up. Young men want to serve leaders like that. No one wants to serve Joey Bag of Donuts.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
No. Infact they do quite the opposite. Now, put someone like Trump in office or DeSantis, have them purge the Woke BS and get back to Warfighting basics. You'll see recruitment go up. Young men want to serve leaders like that. No one wants to serve Joey Bag of Donuts.
The problem is, the US military culture and US civic culture have diverged significantly, and even dropping the pride flags and purging the Woke BS won't fix the underlying issues.

Because the pride flags and Wokeness being pushed now are symptoms of deeper issues with the US military and the political establishment.

Continuing to try to play the old PR recruitment game 'Hello fellow kids'-style, while ignoring the elephant and donkey and CCP agents in the room, are at the heart of why many do not want to serve DC or feel America is worth dying for anymore.

Until the Pentagon is cleaned up and reckons with it's place in, and partial responsibility for, the political mess the US is currently in and it's own bad faith actions during the War on Terror and earlier, the military will keep seeing recruitment drop.
 

The Whispering Monk

Well-known member
Osaul


They really are getting desperate for bodies; turns out pride flags aren't great recruitment tools.

Wow...I'm having a hard time accepting this is real.

EDIT: nothing I'm reading on Recruitment sites says anything about waiving the Highschool Diploma / GED requirement.
 
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Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
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No. Infact they do quite the opposite. Now, put someone like Trump in office or DeSantis, have them purge the Woke BS and get back to Warfighting basics. You'll see recruitment go up. Young men want to serve leaders like that. No one wants to serve Joey Bag of Donuts.
One thing I am going to defend is that we are going back to the warfighting basics.

Because don't listen to bacle as all he hears is what he is told about those that complain about the military.

We are actively working to make our military ready to fight and defeat China.
Marines are going back to the way they have always been, amphibious forces.
Army has put in place numerous systems to make sure we are ready for the force on force conflict.

Besides SHARP amd EO, that is the closest thing to woke I can think off.

The Army is restructuring heavily.


@Bacle you know nothing about what is going to fix the military.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
@Bacle you know nothing about what is going to fix the military.
I know what would fix recruiting numbers, even if it might not be the sorts of things the Pentagon likes to have to admit or talk about.

But then again, you are someone who just seems to think that if they really have to, they can just use a draft to fill out the numbers, and do so without likely causing a civil war.
 

BlackDragon98

Freikorps Kommandant
Banned - Politics
No. Infact they do quite the opposite. Now, put someone like Trump in office or DeSantis, have them purge the Woke BS and get back to Warfighting basics. You'll see recruitment go up. Young men want to serve leaders like that. No one wants to serve Joey Bag of Donuts.
step one is always the hardest, they say.

get that done first (without starting the next US revolution/civil war) and then we'll talk about it

One thing I am going to defend is that we are going back to the warfighting basics.

We are actively working to make our military ready to fight and defeat China.
that's all nice and dandy, but have you forgotten something perhaps . . .

ah ha! the Navy!

who is currently too busy doing pronoun training to hear us anyway.

US 7th Fleet (the one keep China honest) is rotting away and has been for the past 2 decades.

corruption, under-manned ships, poor training, bad morale, nepotism; you name it, they have it.

here is just a taster (note: I detest ProPublica with all my heart and soul, but i have to say that it raises some good points here)

The Troubled US Seventh Fleet > Articles | (globalasia.org)

Years of Warnings, Then Death and Disaster: How the Navy Failed Its Sailors (propublica.org)

Disaster in the Pacific — ProPublica

The Navy Installed Touch-screen Steering Systems To Save Money. Ten Sailors Paid With Their Lives. (propublica.org)

7th Fleet Overworked, Suffered Manning Shortage Ahead of Fatal Collisions, Says Former CO Aucoin - USNI News

The Story Of How The Submarine USS Connecticut Crashed | The Drive
 

Zachowon

The Army Life for me! The POG life for me!
Founder
I mean the rainbow Ukraone seems to he doing fine against Russia so...
 

Zyobot

Just a time-traveling robot stranded on Earth.
No. Infact they do quite the opposite. Now, put someone like Trump in office or DeSantis, have them purge the Woke BS and get back to Warfighting basics. You'll see recruitment go up. Young men want to serve leaders like that. No one wants to serve Joey Bag of Donuts.

Well, you're certainly right that I don't.

Problem is, Trump or DeSantis won't be president forever, so you can't count on them to permanently vanquish an establishment that's been entrenched for decades and has its tentacles in far more than what the president has domain over. They have the universities, the media, and the one percent on their side, and—judging by the things they've done and gotten away with over the years, from MK Ultra to Operation Northwoods—I doubt they have many qualms about sabotaging MAGA whenever and wherever they can, or are too afraid of a populist base that by and large believes voting in The Right GuyTM will fix America. (When, in reality, it's taken multiple generations to get us to this point, and will probably take multiple generations to get us out, too.)
 

Zachowon

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Founder
you mean the 14th SS Division reborn that is . . .

Ukrop-fascists fight well on home soil, I'll give them that
....
Do you want me to point out the multiple Neo Nazis in Wagner who are doing the majority if the fighting.
Hell iirc, the leader of Wagner is a card carrying neo nazis with tattoos...
 

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