The Coming Polish-Belarusian War

Yeah, thanks!

If the place has majority polish population and they want to become part of Poland I don't see why you shouldn't "get" it.
I want Królewiec not becouse it is important,but to remove enclave which could be used as pretext for next war against Poland.
And you are right,that after 1953 USA failed to stabilize ANY country they invaded.

Either they are idiots,or do not want stabilize anytching.
 
Wait, the name sounds familiar, is it Konigsberg?
Yes, it's Polish and more recently the official name of the region in Polish.

There has never been such a city as Kalinigrad, there is only Królewiec.

Just as there is no such thing as London, there is Lądek.

On the other hand, Królewiec belongs to us legally and eternally, the Russkies only stole it illegally, so another decade or two and the last piece of Prussia will return to the motherland, where it should have been for a very long time or at least since 1945.

It's not going to happen... but if and when it happens... It will be Putin's master stroke!
Yes, getting rid of Wagner and his boss by the hands of the Poles sounds like a "brilliant" move indeed.

At the same time there will be a good lesson for the next "rebels", either be polite or end up in Poland.
 
Yes, it's Polish and more recently the official name of the region in Polish.

There has never been such a city as Kalinigrad, there is only Królewiec.

Just as there is no such thing as London, there is Lądek.

On the other hand, Królewiec belongs to us legally and eternally, the Russkies only stole it illegally, so another decade or two and the last piece of Prussia will return to the motherland, where it should have been for a very long time or at least since 1945.


Yes, getting rid of Wagner and his boss by the hands of the Poles sounds like a "brilliant" move indeed.

At the same time there will be a good lesson for the next "rebels", either be polite or end up in Poland.
I hate to say this, but I'm pretty sure Kruschev offered back Kaliningrad to the Lithuanians, and the Lithuanians were smart enough to say no, because they didn't want a large Russian minority as part of the country/province (they would be in Ukraine's shoes right now). I figure the same holds now. The territory might be nice, but not the people there.
 
Wait, the name sounds familiar, is it Konigsberg?
Yes, Królewiec is the Polish name (which you can guess means Kingstown) for that place. In use from c.1300 AD.
Makes it Polish in same way as use of the name Benátky makes Venice Czech.

I'm pretty sure Kruschev offered back Kaliningrad to the Lithuanians,
This was covered on AH-com by a poster who seemed knowledgeable, who claimed that Krushchov (or maybe even Stalin earlier, I no longer remember) did make an offer, but only of a small part of it.
 
The territory might be nice, but not the people there.

Obvious solution is obvious...

Hoppe_20190323_750x516.jpg


"...so to speak."
 
I hate to say this, but I'm pretty sure Kruschev offered back Kaliningrad to the Lithuanians, and the Lithuanians were smart enough to say no, because they didn't want a large Russian minority as part of the country/province (they would be in Ukraine's shoes right now). I figure the same holds now. The territory might be nice, but not the people there.
I know very well what it looked like, the problem lies in the fact that Lithuanians are about 2 million and the Königsberg region has over 1 milion of them. For such a small country, it was and continues to be a risk to have such a significant minority.

But Poles are about 38 million, for Lithuania it would be 1/3 of their entire population, for Poland as many as Ukrainians and in a small compact area. For us they are not such a problem as for the Lithuanians. Especially in an area so brazenly demarcated from the lines between Poles and Russians. (Actually, it's one big military base from 1945 to the present day, cut off even during the USSR era from the rest of the Union, special permission was needed to enter and leave the area.)

I'm not kidding, originally the border was supposed to be more to the north and jagged, in line with the county boundaries that were in Prussia, but the Soviets in 1946 blew it and simply moved the border further south (creating the current border) destroying the previous plan to settle Prussia (not to mention that originally all of Prussia was supposed to be Polish, with Polish troops entering Königsberg before being driven out by the Soviets) so that discouraged people from settling in the region.

edit

This was covered on AH-com by a poster who seemed knowledgeable, who claimed that Krushchov (or maybe even Stalin earlier, I no longer remember) did make an offer, but only of a small part of it.
Let me guess, the rest of Prussian Lithuania?

Obvious solution is obvious...

Hoppe_20190323_750x516.jpg


"...so to speak."

Good old displacement an incentive to emigrate?
 
I want them to do it.
Because I know for a fact I will be invovled
 
Yes, Królewiec is the Polish name (which you can guess means Kingstown) for that place. In use from c.1300 AD.
Makes it Polish in same way as use of the name Benátky makes Venice Czech.
Haha, was it part of Banat once or something?
In any case, only reason I am familiar with it is due to the bridges problem.
Which call if Konigsberg.
This was covered on AH-com by a poster who seemed knowledgeable, who claimed that Krushchov (or maybe even Stalin earlier, I no longer remember) did make an offer, but only of a small part of it.
I mean, it doesn't appear to be that useful.

However, the Krauts see it as theirs, too, and they probably would have jumped at the chance to get it back.

It was an important part of their national muth/consciousness, and you know they can be retsrded autists.
Yes, it's Polish and more recently the official name of the region in Polish.

There has never been such a city as Kalinigrad, there is only Królewiec.

Just as there is no such thing as London, there is Lądek.

On the other hand, Królewiec belongs to us legally and eternally, the Russkies only stole it illegally, so another decade or two and the last piece of Prussia will return to the motherland, where it should have been for a very long time or at least since 1945.
I swear, you Poles are thirsting for that place harder than a simp in chastity and stuffed with viagra simps after his favorite domme e-thot...

In any case, does it have any real historic significance, as in it is not like Poland was founded there, or was the capitol.

But the Krauts probably simp harder than you do.

I don't understand what is so good about the place, I mean, I really want Thessaloniki back, but that is because I want the frigging harbour that is not in a cul de sack, with the Bosporus blocking the only exit, and to fuck over the damned Greeks, but really I don't thirst as hard for that or for Macedonia as compared to what you do.
 
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Remind me, how well did "liberating" Iraq and Afghanistan and Vietnam from the Taliban/Osama/Saddam/the Veitncong go for you guys again?
Remind me how Belarus has the fucking will to fight a prolonged insurgency war over idiocy?

Lukashenko has been in charge over thirty years and this isn't the second world war scenario with genocidal Germans invading, I can't imagine everyone being so content with his rule after all this time that they will unquestioningly head for the hills and fight an insurgency for him when he commits the ultimate act of military suicide by using Wagner to attack NATO.

I mean seriously Agent? Afghanistan and Iraq? One is the fucking graveyard of empires one was invaded based off flimsy evidence of WMD's when they were already unstable and not a threat and that was ignoring that the U.S. had a fundamental disconnect with both in occupying a nation composed of a fundamentalist culture who were openly hostile to us based of religious zeal and trying to install a western democracy in said country which had no interest in it.

As for Vietnam don't bullsh*t me I had relatives who fought in that war, the myth that the U.S. was 'defeated' in Vietnam is mostly a fantasy concocted by communist sympathizers, we won militarily in every regard and defeated the Vietcong in every fucking regard (Look at the casualties and especially the Tet Offensive) we 'loss' the war because due to political fuckery, we weren't able to invade North Vietnam due to Soviet threats which meant they were free to continue raising armies and sending the South all the while they had the benefit of having this be a deeply nationalist conflict in which (For them at least) the fate of a Vietnam free from imperialism was at stake and from their it was a war of attrition we couldn't win.

Belarus isn't fucking Vietnam, it isn't Afghanistan, it isn't Iraq and if you want to point out America's occupational record, I will point out that we did so to both Germany and japan quiet easily for a number of years with no major insurgencies or problems.

Insurgencies only pop up if the right pretext are met and Belarus in the above scenario doesn't have any.
 
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I swear, you Poles are thirsting for that place harder than a simp in chastity and stuffed with viagra simps after his favorite some e-thot...

In any case, does it have any real historic significance, as in it is not like Poland was founded there, or was the capitol.

But the Krauts probably simp harder than you do.

I don't understand what is so good about the place, I mean, I really want Thessaloniki back, but that is because I want the frigging harbour that is not in a cul de sack, with the Bosporus blocking the only exit, and to fuck over the damned Greeks, but really I don't thirst as hard for that or for Macedonia as compared to what you do.
For two reasons, the elimination of a Russian outpost/military base from which almost all of Poland can be attacked, or the creation of a cauldron for liquidation that will undoubtedly consume a considerable amount of resources that would be better off elsewhere.

The other is similar to the desire to have Thessaloniki, the point is that thanks to the graciousness of the Soviets/Russians, the whole of Prussia is kicked economically for it has been unceremoniously cut in half so that upper Prussia (lying in Poland) is cut off from its natural outlet to the Sea.

Elblag is developing quite well as a replacement, although it would have been better if Königsberg, as the natural capital of the region, had also been part of Poland along with the rest of lower Prussia.

That way the region could revive and Königsberg itself could return to normalcy and stop being one big military base.

And all the rest, it's just a justification for why Poland and not Swabland should be given these territories.
 
Remind me how Belarus has the fucking will to fight a prolonged insurgency war over idiocy?

Lukashenko has been in charge over thirty years and this isn't the second world war scenario with genocidal Germans invading, I can't imagine everyone being so content with his rule after all this time that they will unquestioningly head for the hills and fight an insurgency for him when he commits the ultimate act of military suicide by using Wagner to attack NATO.

I mean seriously Agent? Afghanistan and Iraq? One is the fucking graveyard of empires one was invaded based off flimsy evidence of WMD's when they were already unstable and not a threat and that was ignoring that the U.S. had a fundamental disconnect with both in occupying a nation composed of a fundamentalist culture who were openly hostile to us based of religious zeal and trying to install a western democracy in said country which had no interest in it.

As for Vietnam don't bullsh*t me I had relatives who fought in that war, the myth that the U.S. was 'defeated' in Vietnam is mostly a fantasy concocted by communist sympathizers, we won militarily in every regard and defeated the Vietcong in every fucking regard (Look at the casualties and especially the Tet Offensive) we 'loss' the war because due to political fuckery, we weren't able to invade North Vietnam due to Soviet threats which meant they were free to continue raising armies and sending the South all the while they had the benefit of having this be a deeply nationalist conflict in which (For them at least) the fate of a Vietnam free from imperialism was at stake and from their it was a war of attrition we couldn't win.

Belarus isn't fucking Vietnam, it isn't Afghanistan, it isn't Iraq and if you want to point out America's occupational record, I will point out that we did so to both Germany and japan quiet easily for a number of years with no major insurgencies or problems.

Insurgencies only pop up if the right pretext are met and Belarus in the above scenario doesn't have any.
All true,yet....
I bet,that your deep state manage to lost to Belaruss insurgent somehow,if they get a chance.
Becouse they fucked everytching what they could fucked after 1953.

Why this time those bloody clowns should win?
 
Remind me how Belarus has the fucking will to fight a prolonged insurgency war over idiocy?
Yeah, sure, because their opposition is an actual threat to the regime and not just a bunch of idiots that have had a bit too much stupid propaganda and free money from NGOs...


Lukashenko has been in charge over thirty years and this isn't the second world war scenario with genocidal Germans invading, I can't imagine everyone being so content with his rule after all this time that they will unquestioningly head for the hills and fight an insurgency for him when he commits the ultimate act of military suicide by using Wagner to attack NATO.
If Poland starts a war of aggression then any defensive action by Belarus and its allies against it will be justified.

And Article 5 is out.
I mean seriously Agent? Afghanistan and Iraq? One is the fucking graveyard of empires one was invaded based off flimsy evidence of WMD's when they were already unstable and not a threat and that was ignoring that the U.S. had a fundamental disconnect with both in occupying a nation composed of a fundamentalist culture who were openly hostile to us based of religious zeal and trying to install a western democracy in said country which had no interest in it.
You went in there for the same pretext as the one you are using to back the Sliva Usrana crowd, but muh freedumb...
As for Vietnam don't bullsh*t me I had relatives who fought in that war, the myth that the U.S. was 'defeated' in Vietnam is mostly a fantasy concocted by communist sympathizers, we won militarily in every regard and defeated the Vietcong in every fucking regard (Look at the casualties and especially the Tet Offensive) we 'loss' the war because due to political fuckery, we weren't able to invade North Vietnam due to Soviet threats which meant they were free to continue raising armies and sending the South all the while they had the benefit of having this be a deeply nationalist conflict in which (For them at least) the fate of a Vietnam free from imperialism was at stake and from their it was a war of attrition we couldn't win.
Yup, and let us forget the massive inflation and all the social problems and domestic terrorism the USA was having because of the war and LBJ's otehr policies and how all of that culminated into helping the modern left/libtards and the bloated MIC...
Belarus isn't fucking Vietnam, it isn't Afghanistan, it isn't Iraq and if you want to point out America's occupational record, I will point out that we did so to both Germany and japan quiet easily for a number of years with no major insurgencies or problems.
All I hear is "Hurr-Durr, Murika special" and "over by Christmas".

Well, usually those 2 fail hard and fast.

Both Japan and Germany had very advanced, centralized and cohesive societies with high trust levels and not all their industrial strength was destroyed, the USA had a much larger share of manufacturing and global GDP back then than it does now, and there was another big bad to consider, namely the USSR, which forced the USA to be a lot nicer and more accommodating to former enemies.

And mostly, they rebuilt themselves.

As to Belarus, well it had a rather strong partizan movement during WWII.
Insurgencies only pop up if the right pretext are met and Belarus in the above scenario doesn't have any.
Oh, so if space aliens decide to try and occupy the USA and replace its political system with their own, turn it into a province, and displace all American business with their corpos then you will just bend over and take it up the ass?

Oh, and to add some insult to injury, they got together with teh Mexicans, Canadians and British first, and those are acting as their local sepois now.
 
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For two reasons, the elimination of a Russian outpost/military base from which almost all of Poland can be attacked, or the creation of a cauldron for liquidation that will undoubtedly consume a considerable amount of resources that would be better off elsewhere.

The other is similar to the desire to have Thessaloniki, the point is that thanks to the graciousness of the Soviets/Russians, the whole of Prussia is kicked economically for it has been unceremoniously cut in half so that upper Prussia (lying in Poland) is cut off from its natural outlet to the Sea.

Elblag is developing quite well as a replacement, although it would have been better if Königsberg, as the natural capital of the region, had also been part of Poland along with the rest of lower Prussia.

That way the region could revive and Königsberg itself could return to normalcy and stop being one big military base.

And all the rest, it's just a justification for why Poland and not Swabland should be given these territories.
I mean, I think that holding an exclave like that is stupid and pointless and they should have sold it off to you under some pretext, but then the Krauts would have had a hissy fit.


Now,the place is part of Russian national consciousness and inhabited by Russians,too, and some of them will scream bloody murder if it is lost.

So, yeah, it is the ultimate "play stupid games, get stupid prizes" situation IMHO.
 
I mean, I think that holding an exclave like that is stupid and pointless and they should have sold it off to you under some pretext, but then the Krauts would have had a hissy fit.


Now,the place is part of Russian national consciousness and inhabited by Russians,too, and some of them will scream bloody murder if it is lost.

So, yeah, it is the ultimate "play stupid games, get stupid prizes" situation IMHO.
What russians? postsoviets.And ,do not matter what they think,becouse people there ALWAYS do what kagan want.
Only person there which opinion is important is kagan,no matter red or white.

And,as long as it belong to postsoviet,they could gave it to germans,which mean another german attack on Poland.

At least,as long as united german state exist.If we have free Bavaria,Saxony,etc again,there would be no problems.
We could kick what is left of prussians by ourselves.
 
Ah! The typical agent posting style that we all know and love be evasive, answer the post as little as possible and then throw bull to distract let's disect!
Yeah, sure, because their opposition is an actual threat to the regime and not just a bunch of idiots that have had a bit too much stupid propaganda and free money from NGOs...
Irrelevant to the subject Nazi Germany didn't have noteworthy apposition either and yet surrender and surrender completely they did when the time came.
If Poland starts a war of aggression then any defensive action by Belarus and its allies against it will be justified.

And Article 5 is out.
What are you smoking? This reeks of cope because you know that besides Russia threating nuclear war they are in no position to back up an invasion of europe.

Poland isn't threatening Lukashenko here it's the other way around stating you will let foreign mercs invade another country through your soil explicitly as a threat makes you a belligerent no matter what BS excuse you try to make to the contrary, plausible deniability denied the second the threat flew through Lukashenko's mouth.
You went in there for the same pretext as the one you are using to back the Sliva Usrana crowd, but muh freedumb...
Irrelevant to the subject of Belarus, never denied it.
Yup, and let us forget the massive inflation and all the social problems and domestic terrorism the USA was having because of the war and LBJ's otehr policies and how all of that culminated into helping the modern left/libtards and the bloated MIC...
Irrelevant to the subject as even if all that didn't happen America couldn't have won peace in Vietnam and again has nothing to do with Belarus, it's defensive capabilities such as terrain or weapons and beyond that to fight a guerilla war against all of NATO if they go through with this stupidity.
All I hear is "Hurr-Durr, Murika special" and "over by Christmas".
It must be nice to have reality finally hit over the situation Russia is in isn't it?

When you are one nation of less than ten million people with only outdated military equipment and you're threatening to go to war with the largest military coalition on Earth your adds don't look good.

Furthermore, when you are that nation and your only Chief backer of note that could offer meaningful help is distracted and can't afford to send men or even spare any equipment it gets even worse.

Prove me wrong.
Well, usually those 2 fail hard and fast.
Both Japan and Germany had very advanced, centralized and cohesive societies with high trust levels
...Belarus is more advanced than either were seventy years ago, it is a centralized dictatorship with little opposition in your own words above and if you want to claim they as a society aren't cohesive on your head it be...
the USA had a much larger share of manufacturing and global GDP back then than it does now, and there was another big bad to consider, namely the USSR, which forced the USA to be a lot nicer and more accommodating to former enemies.
The amount of GDP is irrelevant in a NATO=Belarus War as six of the top ten countries by GDP would be backing Poland (22th by GDP) against Belarus (85th)

And literally your going to claim the U.S. doesn't coddle it's former enemies? I mean despite the cluster fuck we did spend 62 to 80 billion on rebuilding the country? The U.S. would coddle Belarus along with the rest of NATO for a myriad of political reasons and as poor off as they are they unlike some islamic fundamentalist cess pool would be smart enough to take it.
As to Belarus, well it had a rather strong partizan movement during WWII.
So let me get this straight? You are going to make this type of broad assumption ignorantly ignoring any and all context involved?

We'll let me educate you...

Belarus was 'Slavic' in culture and a part of the 'USSR' during WW2 a 'communist society' a type of system that seizes the means of production.
Their opponents were 'Nazi''s from 'Germany' a 'hypernationalist', 'xenophobic', ideology who among other things had a mass genocide of all 'Slavs' in the 'East' (Meaning the USSR) as their main platform.

Thus when Nazi Germany attacked unprovoked in 1941 in spite of having a non-agression pact that gave their word they wouldnt and started sending in deathsquads the Belarussian people's only real choice boiled down to 'fight' or 'die'

It also helped that they had the USSR's help and the USSR had parity with Germany and wasn't fighting a broad european coalition fully behind them rather an occupied one that draged the German state down.

In short, your entire whataboutism here is BS.
And mostly, they rebuilt themselves.
The U.S. is more that capable of helping to rebuild one small european state.
Oh, so if space aliens decide to try and occupy the USA and replace its political system with their own, turn it into a province, and displace all American business with their corpos then you will just bend over and take it up the ass?

Oh, and to add some insult to injury, they got together with teh Mexicans, Canadians and British first, and those are acting as their local sepois now.
Your the one taking something from someone if anybody.

First of all 'no' because aliens aren't human and because of that I would appose them ruling on principle.

Second of all I don't give a shit about the Corpos.

Third this is nothing more than a whiny bitch fit you are throwing in a vain attempt to discredit me when you lack the logic or reason to prove why that is.

NATO is a defensive organization and if they are attacked by Wagner mercenaries at Lukashenko's bidding, Article 5 will be invoked and Belarus will be invaded and Lukashenko displaced if the Belarussian people or the Russian government don't like that perhaps they should convince the man otherwise.

Furthermore, what the Belorussian people want after Lukashenko is entirely up to them that's the brilliance of democracy and the lack of Lukashenko as a choice is the result of himself making his own bed and losing.
 
Ah! The typical agent posting style that we all know and love be evasive, answer the post as little as possible and then throw bull to distract let's disect!

Irrelevant to the subject Nazi Germany didn't have noteworthy apposition either and yet surrender and surrender completely they did when the time came.

What are you smoking? This reeks of cope because you know that besides Russia threating nuclear war they are in no position to back up an invasion of europe.

Poland isn't threatening Lukashenko here it's the other way around stating you will let foreign mercs invade another country through your soil explicitly as a threat makes you a belligerent no matter what BS excuse you try to make to the contrary, plausible deniability denied the second the threat flew through Lukashenko's mouth.

Irrelevant to the subject of Belarus, never denied it.

Irrelevant to the subject as even if all that didn't happen America couldn't have won peace in Vietnam and again has nothing to do with Belarus, it's defensive capabilities such as terrain or weapons and beyond that to fight a guerilla war against all of NATO if they go through with this stupidity.

It must be nice to have reality finally hit over the situation Russia is in isn't it?

When you are one nation of less than ten million people with only outdated military equipment and you're threatening to go to war with the largest military coalition on Earth your adds don't look good.

Furthermore, when you are that nation and your only Chief backer of note that could offer meaningful help is distracted and can't afford to send men or even spare any equipment it gets even worse.

Prove me wrong.


...Belarus is more advanced than either were seventy years ago, it is a centralized dictatorship with little opposition in your own words above and if you want to claim they as a society aren't cohesive on your head it be...

The amount of GDP is irrelevant in a NATO=Belarus War as six of the top ten countries by GDP would be backing Poland (22th by GDP) against Belarus (85th)
Yeah, I am sure that Germany and France and a few other countreis will be happy to back Poland in an aggressive war with a Russian ally, especially since Poland has created so much trouble for them in recent years. :ROFLMAO:
And literally your going to claim the U.S. doesn't coddle it's former enemies? I mean despite the cluster fuck we did spend 62 to 80 billion on rebuilding the country? The U.S. would coddle Belarus along with the rest of NATO for a myriad of political reasons and as poor off as they are they unlike some islamic fundamentalist cess pool would be smart enough to take it.
Your MIC and NGOC and a bunch of politicians laundered that money, or do I need to remind you about Sloppy Joe's brother...
So let me get this straight? You are going to make this type of broad assumption ignorantly ignoring any and all context involved?

We'll let me educate you...

Belarus was 'Slavic' in culture and a part of the 'USSR' during WW2 a 'communist society' a type of system that seizes the means of production.
Their opponents were 'Nazi''s from 'Germany' a 'hypernationalist', 'xenophobic', ideology who among other things had a mass genocide of all 'Slavs' in the 'East' (Meaning the USSR) as their main platform.

Thus when Nazi Germany attacked unprovoked in 1941 in spite of having a non-agression pact that gave their word they wouldnt and started sending in deathsquads the Belarussian people's only real choice boiled down to 'fight' or 'die'
An invasion is an invasion, Nazis and Carebears from space are the same thing when they bomb you, kill your military and want to take over.
It also helped that they had the USSR's help and the USSR had parity with Germany and wasn't fighting a broad european coalition fully behind them rather an occupied one that draged the German state down.

In short, your entire whataboutism here is BS.

The U.S. is more that capable of helping to rebuild one small european state.

Your the one taking something from someone if anybody.

First of all 'no' because aliens aren't human and because of that I would appose them ruling on principle.

Second of all I don't give a shit about the Corpos.

Third this is nothing more than a whiny bitch fit you are throwing in a vain attempt to discredit me when you lack the logic or reason to prove why that is.
Sorry, but I am too lazy and busy to deal with all of that nonsense.
NATO is a defensive organization and if they are attacked by Wagner mercenaries at Lukashenko's bidding, Article 5 will be invoked and Belarus will be invaded and Lukashenko displaced if the Belarussian people or the Russian government don't like that perhaps they should convince the man otherwise.
I have no idea what you are talking about sometimes.

The only potential aggressor here is Poland.
Furthermore, what the Belorussian people want after Lukashenko is entirely up to them that's the brilliance of democracy and the lack of Lukashenko as a choice is the result of himself making his own bed and losing.

But muh democracy!

Yeah, sure, I am certain that no pro western candidate won't be astroturfed and helped into power...
 
I have no idea what you are talking about sometimes.

The only potential aggressor here is Poland.
Well then i guess if that's the eastern understanding of how acts of war work, Poland needs to take a page from history and at least formally privatize its effort to liberate Belarus, and form a PMC to do it.
Then by your standard Belarus or Russia will be the aggressor to retaliate against Poland for hosting the PMC liberating Belarus, and so article 5 will be invoked 😝
 

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