Serious question about anti-Semitism.

[LindyAF]

Also, I think that arguments about insufficient political capital can only be considered as being made in good faith if they are made by people who actually agree with the general point. If you disagree with the general point, you can only debate the general point on it's merits in good faith, you can't in good faith make an argument about political capital or picking and choosing battles, and it comes off as disingenuous and deceptive.

Like for instance, say you're talking with someone about 2A, and they support it and agree with you that the Hughes Amendment should be repealed, but they don't think bump stocks is a winnable fight and don't want to expend the political capital on it. You disagree on tactics and strategy, not goals. Compare that to someone whose a fudd, or thinks the 2A should be repealed - any argument they're making about political capital is being made in bad faith, and you really couldn't convince them they're wrong even if you could prove that it is a winning strategy because they don't want you to win.

 

[King Arts]

That you actually believe in freaking physiognomy explains so much about you.

And if you actually understood the optics of your arguments around Jews, of any political persuasion, you understand what Lord Sovereign meant by Leave It Alone.

Too few people on the Far-Right, and really the Right in general, seem to have realized Sun Tzu's teachings about battle apply to politics as well.

"Some cities must not be besieged, some battles must not be fought." is true of military stategy as well as political battles, because political capital is not unlimited and with some issues you lose by trying to fight over them at all.

What do you mean when you say physiognomy? Because while it is superficial people will judge you by your appearance so if you have a trustworthy looking face it’s better than looking shifty. There is the other definition of seeing what ethnic group someone is from by how they look. It’s not 100 percent but 75 percent chance you can tell the difference between a Japanese and a Chinese if you know what to look for. As for the whole Jews thing obviously screaming about Jewish plots is bad form and dangerously close to Nazi doctrine. It’s also silly because the protocols is a fabrication and there is no secret conspiracy. However that does not mean that we should not look to see who are supporters and political rivals are. Then move from there for example on the right you could argue we should kick out the evangelicals and others who support Israel no matter what. We can still support Israel but it would now be conditional.

 

[Bacle]

What do you mean when you say physiognomy? Because while it is superficial people will judge you by your appearance so if you have a trustworthy looking face it’s better than looking shifty. There is the other definition of seeing what ethnic group someone is from by how they look. It’s not 100 percent but 75 percent chance you can tell the difference between a Japanese and a Chinese if you know what to look for. As for the whole Jews thing obviously screaming about Jewish plots is bad form and dangerously close to Nazi doctrine. It’s also silly because the protocols is a fabrication and there is no secret conspiracy. However that does not mean that we should not look to see who are supporters and political rivals are. Then move from there for example on the right you could argue we should kick out the evangelicals and others who support Israel no matter what. We can still support Israel but it would now be conditional.

Physiognomy is just reskinned phrenology, which was used to 'scientifically' justify why African Americans/African slaves were 'less intelligent' by psuedo-science quacks in the 1800's.

That Fried actually treats it seriously is...well, I guess unsurprising given his other views and ideas about history and what the US is 'supposed to be'. He considers slavery to 'not be immoral' after all, and even tried to use Roman/Jewish 'slavery/indentured servitude' in ancient times to try to justify it.

Which is part of why dealing with anti-semitism, and how it relates to making legit critiques of anything related to people of Jewish decent or Israel, so dicey.

It is very difficult to have any debate on these subjects in good faith when the fringes of either side are involved, because both seem to have taken to using reskinned versions of anti-semitic memes in thier arguments, just from different directions.

 

[King Arts]

Physiognomy is just reskinned phrenology, which was used to 'scientifically' justify why African Americans/African slaves were 'less intelligent' by psuedo-science quacks in the 1800's.

That Fried actually treats it seriously is...well, I guess unsurprising given his other views and ideas about history and what the US is 'supposed to be'. He considers slavery to 'not be immoral' after all, and even tried to use Roman/Jewish 'slavery/indentured servitude' in ancient times to try to justify it.

Which is part of why dealing with anti-semitism, and how it relates to making legit critiques of anything related to people of Jewish decent or Israel, so dicey.

It is very difficult to have any debate on these subjects in good faith when the fringes of either side are involved, because both seem to have taken to using reskinned versions of anti-semitic memes in thier arguments, just from different directions.

Well the only way to end the taboo is to take a page out of Trumps handbook and just loudly say it. Don’t ally with the fucking Nazis. But call Israel out for when they abuse the Palestinians. While it’s true that Palestinians aren’t innocent neither are the Jews. And the problem isn’t even Israel or Jews influence us though they do with AIPAC it’s that we have a willing fifth column that is loyal to another nation. I’m referring to evangelicals not Jews. So yes while it will hurt since many many useful conservatives like Cruz rely on that they should probably be purged.

 

[Bacle]

Well the only way to end the taboo is to take a page out of Trumps handbook and just loudly say it. Don’t ally with the fucking Nazis. But call Israel out for when they abuse the Palestinians. While it’s true that Palestinians aren’t innocent neither are the Jews. And the problem isn’t even Israel or Jews influence us though they do with AIPAC it’s that we have a willing fifth column that is loyal to another nation. I’m referring to evangelicals not Jews. So yes while it will hurt since many many useful conservatives like Cruz rely on that they should probably be purged.

See, that's the thing, Israel hasn't abused the Palestinians; they've been abused by their own leaders for decades and told it's the Jew's fault.

Israel has actually repeatedly tried to find a way to peacefully exist with them, and every time they get close to something resembling a peace deal, Hamas or Islamic Jihad break the peace because peace with Israel robs them of thier power over the people they have abused and brainwashed.

That people still think anything Israel has done is even close to the shit Hamas and Islamic Jihad have done to Israeli's is testement to how powerful the media machine Hamas and co have cultivated, along with how pervasive anti-semetic feelings are among certain fringe groups, who try to reskin the memes to make ignorant or uninformed non-anti-semites fall for the arguments.

 

[King Arts]

See, that's the thing, Israel hasn't abused the Palestinians; they've been abused by their own leaders for decades and told it's the Jew's fault.

Israel has actually repeatedly tried to find a way to peacefully exist with them, and every time they get close to something resembling a peace deal, Hamas or Islamic Jihad break the peace because peace with Israel robs them of thier power over the people they have abused and brainwashed.

That people still think anything Israel has done is even close to the shit Hamas and Islamic Jihad have done to Israeli's is testement to how powerful the media machine Hamas and co have cultivated, along with how pervasive anti-semetic feelings are among certain fringe groups, who try to reskin the memes to make ignorant or uninformed non-anti-semites fall for the arguments.

You do realize that Jews in Israel experience privilege right? The state of Israel is called a Jewish state they allow all Jews to make Aliya I think it’s called and become citizens. This means that ethnic Jews and Jewish faith has a place of prominence and while there are non Jewish Israeli citizens even Arabs there are Jews articles about discrimination they face you’d have to be blind to argue that Israel is different than other peoples or Jews are better and won’t discriminate against minorities. While Israel isn’t as much of an apartheid state as South Africa the non Jewish citizens of Israel do face issues. And yes maybe Palestine are 75 percent responsible but they are the weaker party. And a 1st world nation is held to a higher standard.

 

[Bacle]

You do realize that Jews in Israel experience privilege right? The state of Israel is called a Jewish state they allow all Jews to make Aliya I think it’s called and become citizens. This means that ethnic Jews and Jewish faith has a place of prominence and while there are non Jewish Israeli citizens even Arabs there are Jews articles about discrimination they face you’d have to be blind to argue that Israel is different than other peoples or Jews are better and won’t discriminate against minorities. While Israel isn’t as much of an apartheid state as South Africa the non Jewish citizens of Israel do face issues. And yes maybe Palestine are 75 percent responsible but they are the weaker party. And a 1st world nation is held to a higher standard.

'Privilege' is a Leftist/socialist theory that punishes people for luck, good fortune, and ancestors accomplishments.

Also, Israel is not an 'aparthied' state or even close to it; you've swallowed a lot of Hamas propoganada if they actually think it is.

As well, why should Israel be held to a 'higher standard's then the people constantly attacking them, and breaking every attempt at peace?

You also seem to have missed or just ignored that Israel goes out of its way to try to minimize civie casualties in dealing with Hamas and their ilk, while Hamas uses schools and hospitals as launching grounds and ammo depots.

Any other nation in the world (except maybe Germany) who was enduring the attacks Israel does would have wiped Gaza off the map by now. Israel has instead engaged them with rather tight ROEs and multiple olive branches that have all been slapped away.

 

[King Arts]

'Privilege' is a Leftist/socialist theory that punishes people for luck, good fortune, and ancestors accomplishments.

Also, Israel is not an 'aparthied' state or even close to it; you've swallowed a lot of Hamas propoganada if they actually think it is.

As well, why should Israel be held to a 'higher standard's then the people constantly attacking them, and breaking every attempt at peace?

You also seem to have missed or just ignored that Israel goes out of its way to try to minimize civie casualties in dealing with Hamas and their ilk, while Hamas uses schools and hospitals as launching grounds and ammo depots.

Any other nation in the world (except maybe Germany) who was enduring the attacks Israel does would have wiped Gaza off the map by now. Israel has instead engaged them with rather tight ROEs and multiple olive branches that have all been slapped away.

Nope.
Israel is an apartheid state a very light one but it is. What do you call discrimination where one group gets actual enshrined laws and are said it is the bedrock of the state. Israel is a Jewish state and the Jewish homeland. Again only an idiot or a willfully blind person would think that a state built by a group of people, FOR a group of people won't have legal protections and privileges' for them, or even non legal but social support.

The reason they will be held to a higher standard then the ones attacking them is because Palestine if you count it as a nation instead of a Bantustan is a 3rd world nation, or 2nd world at best. That means the standards we expect from them are lower. However as every conservative who likes Israel keeps saying it's the only 1st world democracy in the middle east then that means they will be held to 1st world standards. America is held to similar standards when we fight 3rd world nations and we can't simply exterminate the Afghanis, we have to have tight ROE's, if there are things that were acceptable in the past war trophies for example us and the British, and Australians are forbidden from taking them. The leftests created this monster, and many rich influential Jews supported the people who tied our hands when we fight our enemies. Why should the Jews be protected from the Golem they created?

 

[Bacle]

Nope.
Israel is an apartheid state a very light one but it is. What do you call discrimination where one group gets actual enshrined laws and are said it is the bedrock of the state. Israel is a Jewish state and the Jewish homeland. Again only an idiot or a willfully blind person would think that a state built by a group of people, FOR a group of people won't have legal protections and privileges' for them, or even non legal but social support.

The reason they will be held to a higher standard then the ones attacking them is because Palestine if you count it as a nation instead of a Bantustan is a 3rd world nation, or 2nd world at best. That means the standards we expect from them are lower. However as every conservative who likes Israel keeps saying it's the only 1st world democracy in the middle east then that means they will be held to 1st world standards. America is held to similar standards when we fight 3rd world nations and we can't simply exterminate the Afghanis, we have to have tight ROE's, if there are things that were acceptable in the past war trophies for example us and the British, and Australians are forbidden from taking them. The leftests created this monster, and many rich influential Jews supported the people who tied our hands when we fight our enemies. Why should the Jews be protected from the Golem they created?

I do not even know how to disect how wrong you are, because it's like an onion of ignorance or willful acceptance of Hamas and co propaganda.

 

[King Arts]

I do not even know how to disect how wrong you are, because it's like an onion of ignorance or willful acceptance of Hamas and co propaganda.

How about you debate in good faith, instead of saying people on the other side are brainwashed by terrorists how about that? Also there were news reports of riots (in Israel mind you not Palestine) where Israli arabs would attack Jews, and Jews would attack Israli Arab neighbors. Now in a race riot situation like this who do you think the security forces would crack down on and who would they be more lenient. The side that has people from their own group.

 

[Navarro]

The primary concern with the reactionary right (seriously "reactionary" is French Revolutionary terminology. I thought you hated the Enlightenment?)

You see, the thing you have to understand about those folks is that they don't actually disagree with the Whig/progressive/leftist interpretation of history. They just invert the moral valence of everything. In that respect they're like Satanists in comparison to Christianity.

 

[FriedCFour]

You see, the thing you have to understand about those folks is that they don't actually disagree with the Whig/progressive/leftist interpretation of history. They just invert the moral valence of everything. In that respect they're like Satanists in comparison to Christianity.

No not at all lol. The history is completely different. I can only speak for myself but I follow great man theory and I see history as a way to understand human nature, that there are many things that are constants in terms of what we want and what we value and how we act, not as like, some sort of always increasing progress like Whigs do.

 

[Largo]

How many wars has China historically won against people who aren't Chinese?

Like, not to harsh on Tzu, but IMO there's a reason that his advice on how to wage war mostly sums up to "Don't."

This question makes no sense at all because whenever China has won, the people they conquered end up becoming assimilated into China (and sometimes even when others conquer China). So obviously the Chinese have never won a war against people who aren't Chinese, because axiomatically those who aren't Chinese are those who managed to beat the Chinese back.

 

[The Immortal Watch Dog]

Fried obsesses over physiognamy as a cope and its probably projection to mask his own physical mediocrity. That being said, physical aesthetics and presentation matter on an instinctive level. People are drawn to those who look strong, carry themselves with confidence and are well spoken and dressed.

Why do you think the left began to lose public traction when the face of the left became an obese pederast with a beard, in a dress who smells bad and has pink hair?

Why do you think the left has so aggressively attacked and undermined traditional beauty and promoted the old Tumblr style bean art in animation. It's a militant attempt to get people accustomed to ugliness to keep their message alive.

Problem is going against millions of years of instinct is impossible. You can't socially engineer out a a drive to see virtue in fitness.

I don't listen to leftists very often in person because most are ugly and unhealthy looking and if you come to me unwashed with a hipster beard, a man bun and a soft, whiny voice I am going to dismiss everything you say because you an inferior person, it's demonstrably so. Why are you inferior? Because you don't take care of yourself...A lack of self respect is unappealing.

Hell, I refuse to hire young men who are very skinny, sound like they have low t and can't shake my hand firmly.

Why? Because I live in a city run by immigrants who see anything that isn't ruggedly stoic as a sign of communism. Their intense hatred of what they consider to be not tradionally masculine would mean it would be impossible for me to make a profit if I hired your average soyboy or sperg or lefty.

And frankly? I think they are right.

Our society needs a little less tolerance of alternate aesthetics and a lot more drawinism.

Also

The Jooossss running the world is the dumbest conspiracy theory ever.

Look at their history, tell me honestly, could a people who consistently support and defend the very entities that seek to destroy them, who time and time again have courted disaster be puppet masters?

From Hadrian to Stalin....

 

[JagerIV]

Who's bringing up Jewish conspiracy theories besides those regurgitating leftist narratives however? FriedCFour is noting that the Jews are Rich and lean heavily liberal. Just as we can notice that blacks lean poor and very heavily democrat. If his stat is correct that they provide half of the funding of the Democratic party, That would suggest Jews hold a great deal of power over the democratic party, just as looking at who makes up many prominent leadership and intellectual positions, who gets respected, and various democratic structures one could say blacks have a lot of influence on the democratic party.

So, I could have said blacks control the democrat party during the Obama administration. We could then argue whether that was true, either on what we would mean by black, how much influence would count as control, and whether or not this was even a reasonable or useful way to think about things.

It would not, however, be a discussion of a "conspiracy theory". Obama being black, the congressional black caucus, the black feminism origins of critical race theory, the masses civil rights organizations focused on black rights, those are all, I assume, uncontroversial facts. One I guess could say that Obama coordinating anything with contacts in the black congressional would be a "conspiracy", but by that definition every single person of any power engages in conspiracy. I believe it was Hitchens who explained that in the political business this conspiracy was called "lunch". In which case, conspiracy is so common and regular that calling something a conspiracy theory is equivalent to calling water wet.

In which, yeah, if there are Jew donating an awful lot of money to politicians, there are almost certainly "conspiracies" where the individual buys their way into "lunch" with the politicians he donates to so they can reach some sort of mutually beneficial understanding of achieving the donor's desires. I assume it would not be controversial in these circles to say that George Soros "conspires" with a great many people behind the scenes (though often not even behind the scenes!) to do unsavory things.

Conspiracy is a thought terminating cliché at this point.

 

[Bacle]

 

[Captain X]

Has anyone else made the connection with the Business Plot of the 1930s and what's going on now? I can't help but connect them. Like back then, fascism was the new meme, and was super popular among the rich and famous who were admiring of how Germany had reformed itself from a major recession. Now, communism is all the rage, and again, it seems like big businesses and the super-rich are the ones pushing it. I also can't help but notice that they are pushing their ideal as people who would be very weak, and are not really "workers" in the same sense as actual communist regimes would have seen them. Kind of makes me want to respond to the typical "that wasn't real communism" from this crowd with, "no, you aren't real communists."

 

[King Arts]

While this is true you also have to be careful not every criticism of Israel or Jews is anti Semitic. Hell otherwise you can make the argument that being anti Palestinians is also anti Semitic. Jews aren’t the only Semite people after all.

 

[Navarro]

I don't listen to leftists very often in person because most are ugly and unhealthy looking and if you come to me unwashed with a hipster beard, a man bun and a soft, whiny voice I am going to dismiss everything you say because you an inferior person, it's demonstrably so. Why are you inferior? Because you don't take care of yourself.

Hell, I refuse to hire young men who are very skinny, sound like they have low t and can't shake my hand firmly.

Why? Because I live in a city run by immigrants who see anything that isn't ruggedly stoic as a sign of communism. Their intense hatred of what they consider to be not tradionally masculine would mean it would be impossible for me to make a profit if I hired your average soyboy or sperg or lefty.

And frankly? I think they are right.

Our society needs a little less tolerance of alternate aesthetics and a lot more drawinism.

The left generally hates the ideals of self-improvement or trying to make something of yourself. Gets in the way of blaming everything on DA SYSTEM.

 

[Bacle]

The left generally hates the ideals of self-improvement or trying to make something of yourself. Gets in the way of blaming everything on DA SYSTEM.

To be fair, a lot of people on the Right act like 'just pulling yourself up by your bootstraps' can fix pretty much any issue a person faces.

The truth is both views are wrong, and only exist for virtue signalling purposes.

There is a limit to how much personal drive or commitment can accomplish if the system you are operating in is stacked against you.