MGTOW Opinion

[Spartan303]

Some, but I doubt it's most.

And look, I know that sucks. We've all seen or heard stories of men who just got outright fucked. Some bitch cheated on him or screwed him out of property or money. The courts are either unable to address the issue or don't care to in some cases. Of course, I also put that to scale with the women who also get screwed over by men. Judges aren't, as a general rule, stupid. You have to generally fuck up pretty hard not to have equal custody of your kids or you have to get played really well.

But I'm not seeing a lot of "unfair court cases" or "unfit mother" bits coming from MGTOW. I have seen them, don't get me wrong. But the overall message and theme from MGTOW is "Pump and dump these bitches because 15 years ago, they wouldn't look at me twice". Which is essentially treating women the same way they accused the men they fucked 15 years ago of doing. Which is, incredibly hypocritical.

I'm not on board with that. It's a funny joke--but it's a really shitty way to treat people.

I know 7 guys who are self identified as MGTOW. All of them were either in long term relationships or were married. All of them screwed really bad. One of them is paying child support for a kid that isn't his. Mandated by the courts. Another spent almost a year in prison for not paying child support for a kid he didn't know about. He only got out because his Mother pawned off everything and then took out a loan from the bank to get him out of prison. The judge was going to keep him in prison until he got the money....and how the fuck was he supposed to get the money if he had no source of income? He's fighting it but its a losing battle. More than once I've had to act as an intervention as he looks ready to just eat a gun and end it all.

Two others have been cheated on by long term girlfriends. When the guys ended it both were arrested and charged for sexual assault. Charges later dropped but the damage was done as their reputations were destroyed and they lost their jobs and their homes.

Another guy found out his own Mother was conspiring with his then Fiance on how to cheat on him and have her fun without risking her marriage and that she would cover for him.

And finally the newest one. He just got Married 9 months ago. When he was with his then girlfriend she was on her best behavior, treated him great and gave him what he called 'incredible sex'. Not even 48 hours after returning from their honeymoon she announced all that was over as she now 'had him'. Now she doesn't cook, doesn't clean, spends his money and is gaining weight. He's lucky if he gets starfish sex once a week. He's taking his frustrations out on the weights now but he's not happy. And she said plain as day, that if he tried to divorce her she was going to rape him in court.



The problem isn't so much the women. Women are women and have always been the way they are. There are good ones and bad ones. You take your chances when you play the game. The problem is the Government and legal system that incentives women their bad behavior. They say 50/50 split of assets. But when men can be taken for nearly everything and then pay life time alimony, and must also pay child support on top of that and yet can be denied access to his children on the whim of a wife with no repercussions. When women don't face justice for the numerous false rape and sexual assault claims, when the women can and do destroy mens lives simply because she doesn't like a guy....there's a fucking problem.

So it then becomes a game of weighing your options. Risks vs Rewards. And right now the risks far exceed rewards. Western Society has never loved men. We were always viewed as a disposable, renewable resource. But we were respected for the societies we built and maintained. Now men don't even get that and the very notion of masculinity is under attack by government institutions. There are only three ways forward that I can see.

1.) Mass government reforms. This is unlikely to ever happen as the Government has never given back power it was given.

2.) Men collectively snapping and picking up their guns and ending Feminists and their enablers in an orgy of violence. THIS one, sadly, is looking far more likely as time goes on but, thankfully, we are not yet there.

3.) MGTOW. This is the route most men are going today. Men, by and large, are no longer participating in the marriage contract as the risks far exceeding the rewards.How effective this one will be is uncertain, but it IS having an economic impact. The Government and Feminists are now taking notice and they are very afraid if the fever pitch of their rhetoric is any indication. The trouble is, they're playing from a playbook that no longer works and they are slow to adapt...if they show any indication of doing so. But what this IS doing is forcing other women to finally stand up for their own men and demand change in order to bring men back to the table.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

3.) MGTOW. This is the route most men are going today. Men, by and large, are no longer participating in the marriage contract as the risks far exceeding the rewards.How effective this one will be is uncertain, but it IS having an economic impact. The Government and Feminists are now taking notice and they are very afraid if the fever pitch of their rhetoric is any indication. The trouble is, they're playing from a playbook that no longer works and they are slow to adapt...if they show any indication of doing so. But what this IS doing is forcing other women to finally stand up for their own men and demand change in order to bring men back to the table.

It’s weird how, sort of choosing to live like a hermit and isolate yourself from enemies or potential enemies and not partaking in their goods can gradually make them panic

Much better an option than that earlier line you made that someone can take out of context and use to call you an Incel and possible crazed gunman

 

[Spartan303]

It’s weird how, sort of choosing to live like a hermit and isolate yourself from enemies or potential enemies and not partaking in their goods can gradually make them panic

Much better an option than that earlier line you made that someone can take out of context and use to call you an Incel and possible crazed gunman

I Don't ever want to see violence again. When you've been to war, when you've seen the meat chunks and charred flesh that was once a human body up close and personal...that shit stays with you and hits you in ways I still can't fully grasp. You can laugh and joke about reaching for a gun and putting your political enemies along the wall for injustices. But its a far different thing to actually see it and deal with the consequences.

I don't say things like this lightly. So when I talk about men collectively snapping, I say it with dread and trepidation. Because we are fast approaching a point where Men are going to collectively say 'enough'. And the Language men speak that is universally understood is violence.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

I Don't ever want to see violence again. When you've been to war, when you've seen the meat chunks and charred flesh that was once a human body up close and personal...that shit stays with you and hits you in ways I still can't fully grasp. You can laugh and joke about reaching for a gun and putting your political enemies along the wall for injustices. But its a far different thing to actually see it and deal with the consequences.

I don't say things like this lightly. So when I talk about men collectively snapping, I say it with dread and trepidation. Because we are fast approaching a point where Men are going to collectively say 'enough'. And the Language men speak that is universally understood is violence.

I wonder how they(those whom they will “snap” at)will take it

I don’t think they will be smug or accusatory, aside from terror and possible legit PTSD

I think they may use it to justify shitting on men some more and taking other guys’ guns away

Because they would be legit afraid this time, they may even take away knives.....then you will remember that almost anything can be used as a weapon just by picking it up

The richer types like those in Hollywood will probably stay in their ironically walled compounds, whilst maybe people decide to really stay tge fuck away from men

 

[Cherico]

I Don't ever want to see violence again. When you've been to war, when you've seen the meat chunks and charred flesh that was once a human body up close and personal...that shit stays with you and hits you in ways I still can't fully grasp. You can laugh and joke about reaching for a gun and putting your political enemies along the wall for injustices. But its a far different thing to actually see it and deal with the consequences.

I don't say things like this lightly. So when I talk about men collectively snapping, I say it with dread and trepidation. Because we are fast approaching a point where Men are going to collectively say 'enough'. And the Language men speak that is universally understood is violence.

to be fair we are trying to speak in English but they keep saying that's ethnocentric.

 

[Spartan303]

I wonder how they(those whom they will “snap” at)will take it

I don’t think they will be smug or accusatory, aside from terror and possible legit PTSD

I think they may use it to justify shitting on men some more and taking other guys’ guns away

Because they would be legit afraid this time, they may even take away knives.....then you will remember that almost anything can be used as a weapon just by picking it up

The richer types like those in Hollywood will probably stay in their ironically walled compounds, whilst maybe people decide to really stay tge fuck away from men

There is an article that was discussed in a recent Red Pill interview with Rollo Tomassi in which he saw the threat that this posed that not many others have. I don't have the link to it at present. But I think it was the American Mental health institute or something to that effect. In it they classify masculinity as toxic and a mental disorder. By itself its scary, but when one combines that with say...the recent Red flag laws, suddenly you see a picture of what our future is in store for. The Government is not going to disarm men in one fell swoop. That is a sure path to war. Instead, its going to do it by degrees. A piece at a time. The same way they do everything else.

 

[Fleiur]

I know 7 guys who are self identified as MGTOW. All of them were either in long term relationships or were married. All of them screwed really bad. One of them is paying child support for a kid that isn't his. Mandated by the courts.

How so? What happened?

Another spent almost a year in prison for not paying child support for a kid he didn't know about.

How so? What is the scenario?

And finally the newest one. He just got Married 9 months ago. When he was with his then girlfriend she was on her best behavior, treated him great and gave him what he called 'incredible sex'. Not even 48 hours after returning from their honeymoon she announced all that was over as she now 'had him'. Now she doesn't cook, doesn't clean, spends his money and is gaining weight. He's lucky if he gets starfish sex once a week. He's taking his frustrations out on the weights now but he's not happy. And she said plain as day, that if he tried to divorce her she was going to rape him in court.

How did they meet?

 

[Captain X]

I understand that it’s not easy. I certainly had my own horrible moments of fear over finding a job... I also understand that these jobs can be hard on the body and being the engineer chick in the office trailer I am always going to be insulated from that to a real degree. It’s not an easy life and you might well die early from it. But I just, strictly from anecdote, find the guys at work much happier than the demoralised men complaining about feminism on the internet.

What’s your Master’s in, if I may?

I have a Master of Engineering in Mechanical Engineering.

 

[Spartan303]

How did they meet? I don't know. They'd been together for 3 years when he joined our crew.

 

[The Original Sixth]

I know 7 guys who are self identified as MGTOW. All of them were either in long term relationships or were married. All of them screwed really bad. One of them is paying child support for a kid that isn't his. Mandated by the courts. Another spent almost a year in prison for not paying child support for a kid he didn't know about. He only got out because his Mother pawned off everything and then took out a loan from the bank to get him out of prison. The judge was going to keep him in prison until he got the money....and how the fuck was he supposed to get the money if he had no source of income? He's fighting it but its a losing battle. More than once I've had to act as an intervention as he looks ready to just eat a gun and end it all.

Two others have been cheated on by long term girlfriends. When the guys ended it both were arrested and charged for sexual assault. Charges later dropped but the damage was done as their reputations were destroyed and they lost their jobs and their homes.

Another guy found out his own Mother was conspiring with his then Fiance on how to cheat on him and have her fun without risking her marriage and that she would cover for him.

And finally the newest one. He just got Married 9 months ago. When he was with his then girlfriend she was on her best behavior, treated him great and gave him what he called 'incredible sex'. Not even 48 hours after returning from their honeymoon she announced all that was over as she now 'had him'. Now she doesn't cook, doesn't clean, spends his money and is gaining weight. He's lucky if he gets starfish sex once a week. He's taking his frustrations out on the weights now but he's not happy. And she said plain as day, that if he tried to divorce her she was going to rape him in court.



The problem isn't so much the women. Women are women and have always been the way they are. There are good ones and bad ones. You take your chances when you play the game. The problem is the Government and legal system that incentives women their bad behavior. They say 50/50 split of assets. But when men can be taken for nearly everything and then pay life time alimony, and must also pay child support on top of that and yet can be denied access to his children on the whim of a wife with no repercussions. When women don't face justice for the numerous false rape and sexual assault claims, when the women can and do destroy mens lives simply because she doesn't like a guy....there's a fucking problem.

So it then becomes a game of weighing your options. Risks vs Rewards. And right now the risks far exceed rewards. Western Society has never loved men. We were always viewed as a disposable, renewable resource. But we were respected for the societies we built and maintained. Now men don't even get that and the very notion of masculinity is under attack by government institutions. There are only three ways forward that I can see.

1.) Mass government reforms. This is unlikely to ever happen as the Government has never given back power it was given.

2.) Men collectively snapping and picking up their guns and ending Feminists and their enablers in an orgy of violence. THIS one, sadly, is looking far more likely as time goes on but, thankfully, we are not yet there.

3.) MGTOW. This is the route most men are going today. Men, by and large, are no longer participating in the marriage contract as the risks far exceeding the rewards.How effective this one will be is uncertain, but it IS having an economic impact. The Government and Feminists are now taking notice and they are very afraid if the fever pitch of their rhetoric is any indication. The trouble is, they're playing from a playbook that no longer works and they are slow to adapt...if they show any indication of doing so. But what this IS doing is forcing other women to finally stand up for their own men and demand change in order to bring men back to the table.

I'm not saying there aren't men who haven't suffered and who don't fall into the MGTOW sphere.

What I am saying is that this is not unique to men. Women get fucked over too. Badly. Unfairly.

I know of one loser I was forced to put up with until just last week. Has two kids. Drinks and smokes the $400 a week he makes. Was not allowed to see his kids because he is such a fucking loser. Literally lied about being in the military, quitting school when he was 13, and having a "dark criminal" history. Was literally fucking around with a woman twice his age to avoid having to do anything with his worthless life.

Or another woman, who was fighting a custody battle against a shit father who wanted to hold something over his ex girlfriend, despite having ran the moment he heard the words "I'm pregnant...". She had two or three kids and worked her tail off at a fucking Applebee's for a living. Then one day, this piece of shit wants something from her and uses the kid he never supported or cared about to get at her.

Or another woman, who had an off-and-on again relationship with a man who she thought was her best friend. He spent the better part of several years lying and cheating on her, while convincing her she was crazy. He would use guilt to trigger her anxiety to get her money. He would lie to her about her financial situation to trick her into giving him money. He would go behind her back to drive off real men so he could keep her all to herself, while sleeping around. He would try and sabotage any friendship she had (including stealing her phone and sending texts to ruin friendships). And when all of that didn't work, he would outright steal cash or credit cards. Left her worse than penniless and forced her into a psychotic break. Literally went halfway across the country to get away from him.

No judge can magically help these women. Two of the men are penniless losers who are essentially immune to lawsuits because they spend other people's money. The other is literally using the judge to get at the woman. Terrible people is not limited to gender. They're just really shitty people who use others and will do whatever they can to continue to take from them. Facts are that people will always exploit the laws and rules in a way that benefits them and harms others.


PS -- Your buddy who got married nine months ago should record her. It probably can't be used against her in divorce court, but he has two options right now. One is to continue with a terrible marriage. Two is to end the marriage and take what she dishes out, but make she he ruins her reputation and defends against any insane charges against him. He might lose half his shit, but it's better than waiting and having a kid. Then he is truly fucked--because she will use that to hold leverage on him for the next 18+ years. Right now, he can escape with half his shit and his future 18 years of wealth.

And eventually that bitch will burn her bridges. She'll be an angry old bitch with a man she hates, angry at herself for having fucked over a man who would have given her a good life.

 

[hyperspacewizard]

Look it’s not about good people and bad the family court and society as a whole is biased against men that’s it you can’t argue against that look at how many shelters charities and scholarships are women specific and when you try to set something like that up for men only your a sexist who hates women.

Women are a protected class they are better and more important than men because of what they where born as would you lambast a peasant for trying to stay away from a noble oh not all nobles are going to abuse their power not all not all but because they can you should not poke the sleeping dragon

 

[Spartan303]

I'm not saying there aren't men who haven't suffered and who don't fall into the MGTOW sphere.

What I am saying is that this is not unique to men. Women get fucked over too. Badly. Unfairly.

I know of one loser I was forced to put up with until just last week. Has two kids. Drinks and smokes the $400 a week he makes. Was not allowed to see his kids because he is such a fucking loser. Literally lied about being in the military, quitting school when he was 13, and having a "dark criminal" history. Was literally fucking around with a woman twice his age to avoid having to do anything with his worthless life.

Or another woman, who was fighting a custody battle against a shit father who wanted to hold something over his ex girlfriend, despite having ran the moment he heard the words "I'm pregnant...". She had two or three kids and worked her tail off at a fucking Applebee's for a living. Then one day, this piece of shit wants something from her and uses the kid he never supported or cared about to get at her.

Or another woman, who had an off-and-on again relationship with a man who she thought was her best friend. He spent the better part of several years lying and cheating on her, while convincing her she was crazy. He would use guilt to trigger her anxiety to get her money. He would lie to her about her financial situation to trick her into giving him money. He would go behind her back to drive off real men so he could keep her all to herself, while sleeping around. He would try and sabotage any friendship she had (including stealing her phone and sending texts to ruin friendships). And when all of that didn't work, he would outright steal cash or credit cards. Left her worse than penniless and forced her into a psychotic break. Literally went halfway across the country to get away from him.

No judge can magically help these women. Two of the men are penniless losers who are essentially immune to lawsuits because they spend other people's money. The other is literally using the judge to get at the woman. Terrible people is not limited to gender. They're just really shitty people who use others and will do whatever they can to continue to take from them. Facts are that people will always exploit the laws and rules in a way that benefits them and harms others.


PS -- Your buddy who got married nine months ago should record her. It probably can't be used against her in divorce court, but he has two options right now. One is to continue with a terrible marriage. Two is to end the marriage and take what she dishes out, but make she he ruins her reputation and defends against any insane charges against him. He might lose half his shit, but it's better than waiting and having a kid. Then he is truly fucked--because she will use that to hold leverage on him for the next 18+ years. Right now, he can escape with half his shit and his future 18 years of wealth.

And eventually that bitch will burn her bridges. She'll be an angry old bitch with a man she hates, angry at herself for having fucked over a man who would have given her a good life.

I'm not saying that there aren't men out there that don't deserve it or who are scum. I'm saying Society has a way of punishing them...most of the time. But the reverse is not always the case for women. There is no balance and the pendulum is skewered too far one way.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

I'm not saying that there aren't men out there that don't deserve it or who are scum. I'm saying Society has a way of punishing them...most of the time. But the reverse is not always the case for women. There is no balance and the pendulum is skewered too far one way.

Well, that is sorta to be expected, it’s kinda hard to see men as the victims when by Hollywood definition they are supposed to be the typical abusers or bad guys

That reminds me, isn’t Feminism supposedly saying that they are defending men now?

 

[The Original Sixth]

Look it’s not about good people and bad the family court and society as a whole is biased against men that’s it you can’t argue against that look at how many shelters charities and scholarships are women specific and when you try to set something like that up for men only your a sexist who hates women.

Women are a protected class they are better and more important than men because of what they where born as would you lambast a peasant for trying to stay away from a noble oh not all nobles are going to abuse their power not all not all but because they can you should not poke the sleeping dragon

And that bias is seeing a backlash. This is the beginning of the backlash. Because this is a two-way street that a lot of women have not calculated for. It's one aspect that MGTOW does understand; women are at their highest value via looks and youth. This backlash has just begun and it's going to be one of the most terrible things you will witness in your life.

Let me set you the scene.

• Millennial women of the first world are generally are the only ones who have the knowledge of the US legal system and cultural norms to take advantage of the court system against men. They are also the women most motivated to do so for ideological and economical reasons. The first of these women are now hitting their thirties. By the end of Trump's likely second term, they will be in their mid to late thirties. They will realize that the clock is ticking in terms of fertility.
• At the same time, millennial men will be entering the peak of their sexual, social, and economical power.
• Generation Z and younger Millennial women will be entering the peak of their sexual and social power. This will immediately drive a wedge of old vs young women within the United States in regards to the hot studs.
• At the same time, there will be a worldwide collapse in the world trading. Wars will ignite, famine will sweep across the developing world, and those people will want to go anywhere. Most will go to Europe, which will result in a rich flight from Europe and a large nationalist revolution within the European countries (or their cultural deaths).
• There will be a large increase of immigrants to the USA. Including foreign women. Foreign women who will, on the whole, lack the knowledge and motivation to weaponize the state against their husbands. Women who are intent on starting families and living a good life with a good man.

Conclusion

Just as US millennial men are reaching the peak of their power, US millennial women will begin to fade (or smash into a wall, in some cases). At that same moment, the US will be flooded with competing foreign women whose living standards would be ghastly at the impoverished level within the US. Suddenly, those women who had it all won't have their looks and they'll be competing against women who offer more, are younger, fitter (lots of US women turning into hogs), and more attractive. The 'white man' genocide will suddenly flip into the 'white woman' genocide. And no one will give two shits because they'll be fat, old, ugly, angry, and smell like filthy animals. And because the intersectionalists that the feminists buddied up to to work against men will toss them out on their heads the moment they aren't worth a damn. And many 'feminists of color' already hate white feminists.They will reap what they sow.

It won't be all that clean and simple of course. You'll have women and men who defy expectations and that sort. But overall, that is the trend that I see. And although a great deal of women will justly punished, there will be many more women who will be left out in the cold, having been misled by others into having a life that has left them cold and alone. Who will have only to look forward to a withering, lonely death while they see women making families and enjoying husbands they spurned in arrogance and ignorance. 40 years to watch the men they turned or burned have children and happy families while they sit and watch.

For some, it is justice. And for others, it will be the cruel punishment of gullibility.

 

[Fleiur]

How did they meet? I don't know. They'd been together for 3 years when he joined our crew.

I think my post did not go through correctly. I fixed it.

I was just asking and curious how did they end up in those situations. How so and what happened.

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

MGTOW is a reaction, it's a symptom, and not a particularly harmful one. If anything, non participation in a perverted system is healthy, it can create pressure for change.
If you correct the imbalance that created it, it will subside.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

MGTOW is a reaction, it's a symptom, and not a particularly harmful one. If anything, non participation in a perverted system is healthy, it can create pressure for change.
If you correct the imbalance that created it, it will subside.

It just takes time....too much time as the system is too entrenched and has too much supports

Is the same with choosing NOT to buy woke shit, they will STILL produce it even when they are going broke Nd may get support from a parent company

Unlike brands or entertainment, women can’t get back all those long past years of fertikity and the like.....and there is broken trust

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

It just takes time....too much time as the system is too entrenched and has too much supports

Theres no easy outs, the way out is through.

Is the same with choosing NOT to buy woke shit, they will STILL produce it even when they are going broke Nd may get support from a parent company

Boycotts, non participation, these things are justifiable for no other reason than they restrict your spending and make you less of a consumer. Any pressure they exert on the market is just a bonus on top of that.

Unlike brands or entertainment, women can’t get back all those long past years of fertikity and the like.....and there is broken trust

Thats the best part. A generation of foolish women are already well on their way to permanent spinsterdom, and there will be no way back for them, no amount of shrieking will help.
You cant ask to see God's manager.

They will serve as a fantastic example for future generations of women as they age, bitter and alone, raising dozens of cats.


This problem is going to solve itself.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

@Shipmaster Sane
It’s almost a variation of what Gandhi said about using “NonViolence”.....I think putting aside the smear campaign the various #Gates are getting, we are going to eventually win....it helps that they follow another saying

“Don’t stop your enemy when he’s committing a mistake”

You can redpill people by sheer exposure to watching others on the bluepill go crazy

It sorta helps that going by @Captain-General whether she actually thought about it or not, this #MeToo thing varies amongst demographics, states, cities, towns and political leanings......well it’s not like they’re going to try and actively gonna go after the people of the farmlands and provinces like the Soviets did with the Kulaks and have them be forced to work alongside other political prisoners....I don’t think there are any legal tax penalties to guys with multiple children and certain wealth levels in the USA atm

@The Original Sixth
I think this connects to our talk awhile back regarding feminists and their attempt to change beauty standards

All the butch, fat, androgynous-masculine body figures are their projection and them getting real self conscious, some ahead of time before their fertile years even end

Because let’s face it, even at a younger age, not all women are pretty and the effort is “too much” and they know they will grow old and the fact that men look at prettier feminine younger women.....even fictional ones

Really helps with their anger.

Plus having kids makes them older, both due to responsibilities and not being able to enjoy luxuries as much....not rven going to the effort of finding a pseudo balance

 

[Spartan303]

I think my post did not go through correctly. I fixed it.

I was just asking and curious how did they end up in those situations. How so and what happened.

I think they ended up in those situations because their wives and girlfriends took them for granted and that they were a little too trusting. Take what your woman says with a grain of salt but always watch what she does. There were signs in each relationship things were going downhill but they missed them. Ladies lost respect and their contempt grew. Ironically two of the ladies approve of the changes in their former partners. But these guys aren't dumb enough to place their trust in women with no integrity.