Books J.R.R. Tolkien's 129th Birthday today

[Urabrask Revealed]

It's J.R.R.Tolkien's birthday. He would be 129 years old if he were alive today.

Tolkien Birthday Toast: Raise a glass to the Professor in honour of his 129th birthday

To mark J.R.R. Tolkien's twelfty-ninth (129th) birthday, The Tolkien Society invites fans all over the world to participate in our annual Birthday Toast. The Toast After Bilbo left the Shire on his eleventy-first birthday in…

www.tolkiensociety.org

Sometimes I wonder what our fantasy culture would look like if not for his codifying work.

 

[Zachowon]

It's J.R.R.Tolkien's birthday. He would be 129 years old if he were alive today.

Tolkien Birthday Toast: Raise a glass to the Professor in honour of his 129th birthday

To mark J.R.R. Tolkien's twelfty-ninth (129th) birthday, The Tolkien Society invites fans all over the world to participate in our annual Birthday Toast. The Toast After Bilbo left the Shire on his eleventy-first birthday in…

www.tolkiensociety.org

Sometimes I wonder what our fantasy culture would look like if not for his codifying work.

I mean, Conan, King Arthur, Alice in wonderland stories were all out before his was. As was Dracula and peter pan.

There were also other stories involving goblns as well before then.

His brand of fantasy just would not exist. It would be more like what we have in Conan or John Carter series.

There was also Tolkiens inspiration. The Worm Ouroboros as one as well to help push what fantasy would be like nowadays

 

[Free-Stater 101]

Their is and can only be one lord of the rings! Godspeed Mr Tolkien!

 

[Bear Ribs]

Tolkien directly influenced DnD which shaped a lot of fantasy to follow. Final Fantasy, f'rex, lifted a ton of stuff directly from DnD (Hi Saguagin Sahagin!). That will shape the look of a lot of fantasy to come.

It's probable a different fantasy would influence Gygax and produce a DnD with a different flavor. However he also only adapted Tolkien, he threw everything and the kitchen sink in so plenty of stuff will still make it. DnD's most notable takes from Tolkien are (IMO) races (Pre-Tolkien elves were seen as tiny gnome-like creatures that were crafters as in the Shoemaker and the Elves, not tall skinny ubermensch). Secondarily the party (Fellowship) format and magic items were lifted there.

DnD inspired by another source will probably have a different selection of races, Halfings, Elves, Dwarves, and Orcs are all lifted directly from Tolkien. If Gygax pulled on Barsoom and Conan for his intial inspiration we might see humans, green martians with the serial numbers filed off, trolls, jaguar/beast men, and perhaps something like lizardmen lifted from some sci-fi story. Magic items will be less prominent, Conan has a dependable steel sword rather than a magic one. Possibly we'd see materials (Stone<Bronze<Iron<Steel<Adamantite<Orichalcum) being the standard for better gear rather than enchantment. Mithril was all Tolkien so it will never show up. Magic jewelry and weapons don't show as nearly as pivotal in works prior to Tolkien.

 

[Zachowon]

Tolkien directly influenced DnD which shaped a lot of fantasy to follow. Final Fantasy, f'rex, lifted a ton of stuff directly from DnD (Hi Saguagin Sahagin!). That will shape the look of a lot of fantasy to come.

It's probable a different fantasy would influence Gygax and produce a DnD with a different flavor. However he also only adapted Tolkien, he threw everything and the kitchen sink in so plenty of stuff will still make it. DnD's most notable takes from Tolkien are (IMO) races (Pre-Tolkien elves were seen as tiny gnome-like creatures that were crafters as in the Shoemaker and the Elves, not tall skinny ubermensch). Secondarily the party (Fellowship) format and magic items were lifted there.

DnD inspired by another source will probably have a different selection of races, Halfings, Elves, Dwarves, and Orcs are all lifted directly from Tolkien. If Gygax pulled on Barsoom and Conan for his intial inspiration we might see humans, green martians with the serial numbers filed off, trolls, jaguar/beast men, and perhaps something like lizardmen lifted from some sci-fi story. Magic items will be less prominent, Conan has a dependable steel sword rather than a magic one. Possibly we'd see materials (Stone<Bronze<Iron<Steel<Adamantite<Orichalcum) being the standard for better gear rather than enchantment. Mithril was all Tolkien so it will never show up. Magic jewelry and weapons don't show as nearly as pivotal in works prior to Tolkien.

I mean we do have King Arthur stories so magical swords would not be unknown.
HAving never heard of the Worm Ouroboros before, I do not know what kind of fantasy it was for instance

 

[Bear Ribs]

I mean we do have King Arthur stories so magical swords would not be unknown.
HAving never heard of the Worm Ouroboros before, I do not know what kind of fantasy it was for instance

Oh I'll grant, "A magic item" is certainly a thing in all sorts of myths and legends. Alladin's lamp, Mjollnir, Vajra the diamond pounder, Athena's aegis they happened. The thing is that generally you only run into maybe one or two such items per myth and they're wondrous things of epic rarity, often found only in the hands of the gods themselves. Tolkien had at least half a dozen magical things in his stories with at least half the cast packing one, never mind the various magic rings, you've got Sting, Anduril, Foehammer, Goblincleaver, wizard's staffs, cloaks of elvenkind, palantirs, etc.

 

[Zachowon]

Oh I'll grant, "A magic item" is certainly a thing in all sorts of myths and legends. Alladin's lamp, Mjollnir, Vajra the diamond pounder, Athena's aegis they happened. The thing is that generally you only run into maybe one or two such items per myth and they're wondrous things of epic rarity, often found only in the hands of the gods themselves. Tolkien had at least half a dozen magical things in his stories with at least half the cast packing one, never mind the various magic rings, you've got Sting, Anduril, Foehammer, Goblincleaver, wizard's staffs, cloaks of elvenkind, palantirs, etc.

I have never actually read the LOTR books

 

[Navarro]

Tolkien directly influenced DnD which shaped a lot of fantasy to follow. Final Fantasy, f'rex, lifted a ton of stuff directly from DnD (Hi Saguagin Sahagin!). That will shape the look of a lot of fantasy to come.

It's probable a different fantasy would influence Gygax and produce a DnD with a different flavor. However he also only adapted Tolkien, he threw everything and the kitchen sink in so plenty of stuff will still make it. DnD's most notable takes from Tolkien are (IMO) races (Pre-Tolkien elves were seen as tiny gnome-like creatures that were crafters as in the Shoemaker and the Elves, not tall skinny ubermensch). Secondarily the party (Fellowship) format and magic items were lifted there.

I mean, what Tolkien really did was pull back towards the original Norse and Celtic mythological sources when it came to his elves, not redefine them.

 

[Lord Sovereign]

Tolkien was not the first, but he is likely the most important.

Those who came before him, semi-build up to him. Those who came after are trying to catch up. The man had a singular impact on the world of fiction, and he is probably one of England's proudest sons in that alone.

 

[Bear Ribs]

I mean, what Tolkien really did was pull back towards the original Norse and Celtic mythological sources when it came to his elves, not redefine them.

Agreed, however he still heavily codified them and redefined them to his own purposes, for instance the Norse Svartalfar (Black Elves) are Dwarves as Tolkien defined them, enough that some translators will directly translate Svartalfar as Dwarf and the home of Dwarves was an underground kingdom called Svartalfheim. Tolkien essentially made Elves and Dwarves as to what they are today when before, elves and dwarfs were the same race of small people.

 

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I have never actually read the LOTR books

I'd recommend reading them. You'll be surprised just how different they are from the Peter Jackson films.

A lot of people praise Tolkien for his "worldbuilding", as if that was what made his books great. Let me tell you: absolutely no one would give a damn about LotR unless it was an actually good story. The characters are very likeable and you want to find out what happens next.

There are plenty of fantasy stories out there with "great worldbuilding", but nobody cares about them because the story simply isn't interesting. In LotR's case, the worldbuilding is the icing on the cake, but it's not what you read for. Unlike Brandon Sanderson or GRRM, Tolkien doesn't stop the plot and spend pages and entire scenes describing the world when it has absolutely nothing to do with the plot. Tolkien just gives you a brief sentence or two about the river they are passing by and then continues moving the plot forward.

 

[gral]

It's probable a different fantasy would influence Gygax and produce a DnD with a different flavor.

TSR had a RPG setting that was more Conan-like, but it didn't gain much traction: Empire of the Petal Throne - Wikipedia . This was after D&D was created, though.

 

[Laskar]

I mean, Conan, King Arthur, Alice in wonderland stories were all out before his was. As was Dracula and peter pan.

So, basically mythic fantasy would be a shadow of its present self? No elves as we know them, no Orcs as we love them, no Halflings and Rings of Power and Ents and all of the concepts that started with Tolkein or were erected in response to him.

Actually, you know what might have arisen in the absence of Tolkein? Lions and tigers and tin woodsmen, oh my! L. Frank Baum tried to break with old fairy tales and create new ones with robot lumberjacks and emerald cities. Without Tolkein creating what was both a love letter and a prehistory of the old Germanic folk tales, a generation of authors might have erected new myths, and the old myths of goblins and elves might seem as quaint as, say, big band music is five decades after Rock and Roll put a dozen of the old genres into the grave.

 

[ATP]

I have never actually read the LOTR books

You should.And his Letters,too.His comments about soviets were very interesting - that we defeated Sauron/WW2/ using ring and with orcs on our side.And as a result,free people with time would become orcs,too.
If you look at Antifa in USA,that arleady happened.