Immigration and multiculturalism news

[Sailor.X]

An angry mob did the deed, and the people who made up state of Oklahoma government at the time are all either dead or on the back half of a nursing home stay about to die.

None of the people who would actually have to pay for this (IE modern taxpayers) had anything, nothing to do with the crime.

Thats called theft, and just because the Government has decided to steal taxpayer money to pay for something done by someone else multiple decades ago, doesn't make it "okay".

If this had just happened? Sure, round up the criminals and award the survivors monetary compensation.

But it didn't, it happened so long ago the vast majority of the people involved are already dead.

Most reparations ideas, are fundamentally immoral and idiotic. I'll pay reparations when Rome pays me for my people's suffering under their Empire, because if we are going to stretch into the deep past to find things we think people today deserve money for, why not go really deep? Why not force Rome to pay for what a bunch of dead people did to other dead people? Why not make the barbary coast pay for what their ancestors did to our ancestors?

Aircraft from the State of Oklahoma National Guard were used to bomb the victums. The State is at fault.

Edit: And more to the point for the past 35 years the State of Oklahoma has been trying to get out of doing the right thing. They first said none of the victums were still alive until they realized 3 of them were. Then for the next 3 decades to moved Heaven and Earth to try and get out of it. I have no sympathy for the State of Oklahoma. They deserved to get condemned.

 

[Ixian]

Aircraft from the State of Oklahoma National Guard were used to bomb the victums. The State is at fault.

Edit: And more to the point for the past 35 years the State of Oklahoma has been trying to get out of doing the right thing. They first said none of the victums were still alive until they realized 3 of them were. Then for the next 3 decades to moved Heaven and Earth to try and get out of it. I have no sympathy for the State of Oklahoma. They deserved to get condemned.

They were privately owned aircraft out of Curtiss-Southwest Field just outside of Tulsa. They were not owned by Oklahoma, there may or may not have been some local Tulsa police officers on some of the planes.

Basically, none of the victims are alive, and of the couple that were still among the living 35 years ago, why exactly did they deserve money from people who had nothing to do with the crime?

This shit happened in 1921, exactly 103 years ago, nobody owes anything at this point.

 

[willdelve4beer]

This shit happened in 1921, exactly 103 years ago, nobody owes anything at this point.

IE: Horrible things were done by horrible people.

Today both they, and all of their attempted victims that they failed to kill, have joined their actual victims in death.

No, there is no means of securing justice for that crime, it is too late.


If you want justice for that crime, or in general, hope for it in the next world, this one has precious little of it to go around.

 

[Sailor.X]

They were privately owned aircraft out of Curtiss-Southwest Field just outside of Tulsa. They were not owned by Oklahoma, there may or may not have been some local Tulsa police officers on some of the planes.

Basically, none of the victims are alive, and of the couple that were still among the living 35 years ago, why exactly did they deserve money from people who had nothing to do with the crime?

This shit happened in 1921, exactly 103 years ago, nobody owes anything at this point.

Dude two of the victums are alive have you not read the news report this past June.

Edit and back in the 90s the shit bags that carried out the crimes were still alive too. And the State did nothing.

 

[Ixian]

Dude two of the victums are alive have you not read the news report this past June.

Edit and back in the 90s the shit bags that carried out the crimes were still alive too. And the State did nothing.

Again, the two people of presumably over 100 years of age each, aren't owed anything by the modern taxpayers in regards to compensation for the crime they were victims of.

As to the possible criminals who were still alive in the 90s, it sucks they evaded justice, it sucks the government officials at the time failed to see the issue was satisfactorily completed. Again, not seeing how that entitles two people north of 100 to my, or anyone else's money.

You feel they should get something? Feel free to send them a check, or start a fundraiser for them. IE give them your money, don't take the money from someone who had nothing to do with the situation.

 

[Sailor.X]

Again, the two people of presumably over 100 years of age each, aren't owed anything by the modern taxpayers in regards to compensation for the crime they were victims of.

As to the possible criminals who were still alive in the 90s, it sucks they evaded justice, it sucks the government officials at the time failed to see the issue was satisfactorily completed. Again, not seeing how that entitles two people north of 100 to my, or anyone else's money.

You feel they should get something? Feel free to send them a check, or start a fundraiser for them. IE give them your money, don't take the money from someone who had nothing to do with the situation.

And you wonder why a lot of people in the US say Conservatives don't care about minorities. Just a bunch of do nothings the lot of them.

 

[mrttao]

And you wonder why a lot of people in the US say Conservatives don't care about minorities. Just a bunch of do nothings the lot of them.

>> Don't steal my money to pay someone for something I didn't do
> Sailor.X: REEEE RACIS!

...
pathetic.

 

[Sailor.X]

>> Don't steal my money to pay someone for something I didn't do
> Sailor.X: REEEE RACIS!

...
pathetic.

You do realize any lawsuit against your state comes out of your tax money. Which happens all the time. Your outrage is impotent .

 

[Ixian]

You do realize any lawsuit against your state comes out of your tax money. Which happens all the time. Your outrage is impotent .

Yeah, typically for shit that has happened recently, or within the last decade or so.

Not for something that occurred over a century ago.

And there are strong markers that allowing the government to pay for their fuck ups with taxpayer dollars is a problem.

Imagine how the policing situation would improve, if bad cops actually had to pay out of their own pocket? If corrupt city officials had to pay the people they injured from their own checking accounts instead of the citizens.

 

[Sailor.X]

Yeah, typically for shit that has happened recently, or within the last decade or so.

Not for something that occurred over a century ago.

And there are strong markers that allowing the government to pay for their fuck ups with taxpayer dollars is a problem.

Imagine how the policing situation would improve, if bad cops actually had to pay out of their own pocket? If corrupt city officials had to pay the people they injured from their own checking accounts instead of the citizens.

There is no statute of limitations on attempted murder. If the victim is still alive they can sue the State.

 

[LordsFire]

There is no statute of limitations on attempted murder. If the victim is still alive they can sue the State.

The back and forth of this is making things a lot of murky.

From what I have gathered so far:

102 years ago some people did some horrific things, including aerial bombings of civilians. There are arguments about whether or not it was state actors directly doing this.

~30 years ago, in the 90's, there was an attempt to get some justice for this, by a handful of survivors.

You want damages to be paid out now.


The problem I see, is that if someone was seeking damages for this in the 90's, then they must have been 70+ years old, and the people they were seeking damages against, in order to have been adult perpetrators of the crime, would have had to be in their 90's, which is not exactly common.

So, in order to clarify the situation, please can you name the specific survivors, and give some details about their attempts to seek damages?

And @Ixian, can you give some evidence that it was not state actors who did this bombing and whatever else?

 

[Sailor.X]

The back and forth of this is making things a lot of murky.

From what I have gathered so far:

102 years ago some people did some horrific things, including aerial bombings of civilians. There are arguments about whether or not it was state actors directly doing this.

~30 years ago, in the 90's, there was an attempt to get some justice for this, by a handful of survivors.

You want damages to be paid out now.


The problem I see, is that if someone was seeking damages for this in the 90's, then they must have been 70+ years old, and the people they were seeking damages against, in order to have been adult perpetrators of the crime, would have had to be in their 90's, which is not exactly common.

So, in order to clarify the situation, please can you name the specific survivors, and give some details about their attempts to seek damages?

And @Ixian, can you give some evidence that it was not state actors who did this bombing and whatever else?

Here is some info

Oklahoma Supreme Court Rejects Reparations for Tulsa Race Massacre

The decision is the latest — and perhaps final — blow to the massacre’s two remaining survivors in their decades-long quest for justice.

statecourtreport.org

 

[Abhorsen]

Here is some info

Oklahoma Supreme Court Rejects Reparations for Tulsa Race Massacre

The decision is the latest — and perhaps final — blow to the massacre’s two remaining survivors in their decades-long quest for justice.

statecourtreport.org

So to go into why this legally failed, ignoring whether or not it should have, The victims couldn't sue for the wrongful deaths, etc, because as a civil matter, those do have a statute of limitations.

Instead, they alleged that the city has an ongoing practice of causing a public nuisance by frustrating attempts to get justice for the massacre, relying on a lower Oklahoma's court ruling against a drug manufacturer which wildly expanded what a public nuisance is. But the case against the drug manufacturer got overturned by the Oklahoma Supreme Court, so since the Tulsa case relied on that, it too got overruled.

 

[Sailor.X]

So to go into why this legally failed, ignoring whether or not it should have, The victims couldn't sue for the wrongful deaths, etc, because as a civil matter, those do have a statute of limitations.

Instead, they alleged that the city has an ongoing practice of causing a public nuisance by frustrating attempts to get justice for the massacre, relying on a lower Oklahoma's court ruling against a drug manufacturer which wildly expanded what a public nuisance is. But the case against the drug manufacturer got overturned by the Oklahoma Supreme Court, so since the Tulsa case relied on that, it too got overruled.

There have been court cases since the 90s. They have literally tried every legal argument. While the DNC has it's share of racists in State Government. The GOP does as well.

 

[Abhorsen]

There have been court cases since the 90s. They have literally tried every legal argument. While the DNC has it's share of racists in State Government. The GOP does as well.

Even the 90s was well past the day when this needed to happen (because Jim Crow). Basically, the courts are not capable of solving all injustices. Really, this ought to be a bill for paying out just reparations for the harm the city did. As for what the individuals who participated did, there's no real way to fix this problem as it was too long ago.

I'd also say it's not a racist thing in the present (obviously, the original riots and Jim Crow were racist). It's a "Government doesn't want to pay" thing. Government will try to fuck over anyone, and then always attempt to refuse to pay up, and they win a ton of times when they shouldn't. Just look at some of the IJ cases like where government won't pay for running a bearcat through someone's wall to catch a suspect, etc. Or civil asset forfeiture by road pirates. And those are modern cases.

 

[LordsFire]

There have been court cases since the 90s. They have literally tried every legal argument. While the DNC has it's share of racists in State Government. The GOP does as well.

I have one last question for you.

Which legal entities do you think should be held legally culpable, as a matter of justice principles, whether or not the law agrees with that?

 

[Captain X]

 

[Sailor.X]

I have one last question for you.

Which legal entities do you think should be held legally culpable, as a matter of justice principles, whether or not the law agrees with that?

State Law Enforcement..

 

[LordsFire]

State Law Enforcement..

By 'legal entities' I don't just mean 'government bodies,' I also mean individuals, private companies, private organizations, whatever.

 

[mrttao]

Yeah, typically for shit that has happened recently, or within the last decade or so.

Not for something that occurred over a century ago.

And there are strong markers that allowing the government to pay for their fuck ups with taxpayer dollars is a problem.

Imagine how the policing situation would improve, if bad cops actually had to pay out of their own pocket? If corrupt city officials had to pay the people they injured from their own checking accounts instead of the citizens.

Exactly. Find the actual criminals and punish them.