Gun Political Issues Megathread. (Control for or Against?)

[Bacle]

 

[LordsFire]

You are right, it is about individual choice, and those choices don't happen in a vacuum. The question is why have those decisions been made? What motivated them? What pushed someone into becoming a terrorist or refugee?

Funny, that's not what the muslim terrorists themselves say. They quote things like 'These people are unislamic,' or 'these people disrespected the prophet.' Not 'The US invaded Iraq' or 'The US invaded Afghanistan.'

It is undeniable fact the US invasions were the critical factor and main cause of the surge of Islamic terror in Europe, and many other places too. If you had been more surgical in retaliation I am confident that all of the other factors feeding into terrorism would not have been sufficient to trigger what we historically saw.

Your confidence is unfounded, and based on leftist rhetoric, rather than what the terrorists who either survived or left messages actually said.

 

[Harlock]

Funny, that's not what the muslim terrorists themselves say. They quote things like 'These people are unislamic,' or 'these people disrespected the prophet.' Not 'The US invaded Iraq' or 'The US invaded Afghanistan.'

Some I am sure do, but others do not and do tie it to America and the battle lines it has created.

Your confidence is unfounded, and based on leftist rhetoric, rather than what the terrorists who either survived or left messages actually said.

It may be so, but I doubt it. By your assessment the invasion is unrelated then, that the sudden massive surge has nothing to do with the US invasions, that it is pure coincidence. It seems improbable and frankly the most insanely delusional cope I have ever, ever read. And I've read a lot.
I have no actual come back to that, I was ready to look at how other factors weighed but to dismiss the invasions entirely as a factor is, well I'm not going to insult you because that isn't fair. I'll just let people assess you based on that position.

You got me, I have nowhere else to go on this one.

 

[Bacle]

 

[Ixian]

They are trying to rush it through, unsurprising.

Fingers crossed the republicans don't screw the American people over.

 

[BlackDragon98]

Jews learned the lesson the hard way.

When some threatens violence against you, you hit back with full force.

I've been thinking of taking a vacation to Jerusalem to look at all the historical things there and go to the Dead Sea and try to walk on water there.

1st thing a dictator does is take guns away from people he's gonna butcher down the road

What's that line Tony Stark said to Loki "We may not be able to save the world, but we can damn well avenge it."

I think that is the general feeling of a lot more of the young people these days, and is what part of what drives people like Greta Thurberg, even if she's more a tool of her parents than anything.

It's why the intergenerational issues that led to the 'Ok, Boomer' memes are so widespread; a lot of the youth can see through the charade their parents and grandparents tried to maintain for their self-comfort and peace of mind.

Telling Boomers they won't get a cushy, fun retirement era like their parents had is going to be one of the most devastating realizations many older folk are going to be going through in the near future, if they haven't already.

Us Centennials are both cursed and blessed. We grew up in the 90s but weren't Gen X'ers, and were too old to be Millennials, and we saw the end of what might be end of humanities Golden Age when 9/11 happened and blew everything open. Many people these days don't get how much we lost and in such a short time, or how the downslope may not end in our, or our childrens, life time, even if we work hard at it.

Personally I think trying to just beef up Musk's stuff and just try to escape to Mars might be simpler and more sustainable in the long run; light lag is a problem and solution all in one.
I came from a Hard-D household, I went to liberal arts schools, and even the environmental masters I tried for. I know what the other side is like and how they think, and many steps ahead of the conservative/populist base they are already operating on/have plans for.

And most of the time when I'm trying to warn people that the Right really isn't prepared for the lengths the Desm want to go to, I'm laughed off. Coming out to support Trump and the sanity he represented cost me most of my social circle and many long time friends, while also alienating family, and what happens when I donate to Bernie in 2016; Hillary's supercandndates make it all worthless. Donating to Trump and couple others in 2020 gets tons of spam donation texts, calls, and emails with 'double-dip' donation buttons and recurring donation buttons already preselected, forcing me to deselect every time.

And lets be blunt, the Libertarian Party is something I would love to have more power and impact, but I also know it seems to have it's own internal ego fights that keep it from being effective, which is just the cherry on the shit sunday.

I hope I'm wrong about how fucked things are, but I see more reinforcing this feeling every day, and before the Ukraine War broke out I might have even thought we could economically/socially hold it together, but now it feels like the future is either going to be 1984 or the Fallout series.

Ok Doomer.

I respectfully concur on this. If you've thrown in the towel and would rather just lay down and die at this point....then, yes, they've won. They broke you. They got what they want from you. That's EXACTLY how they want you to feel.

Perhaps this video will help?




"Pain, or damages, don't end the world, nor despair, nor fuckin' beatings. The world ends when you're dead! Until then, you've got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man, and give some back."

That said, rebellion would have a good chance of succeeding TBH.

Just study guerilla warfare tactics (especially those used by Latino Leftist groups) and then apply to USA.

Guaranteed victory!

Reports: Biden admin orders ammo maker to stop selling 5.56 rounds to Americans

Reports: Biden admin orders ammo maker to stop selling 5.56 rounds to Americans

The Biden administration has reportedly ordered an ammunition manufacturer to stop selling Americans some 5.56mm rounds, which is the most common for the

americanmilitarynews.com

this will actually just create a bunch of smaller bullet manufacturers, which will in turn, lead to better quality as the small companies are usually the dedicated ones

I'll have to bring my friend and give him the snickers.

I'm on a diet and an exercise plan.

How red flag laws will play out

Viva la Revolution!

That was funny, NGL.

Progress on Senate Gun Control Package Stalls as Senators Fail to Reach Final Agreement (theepochtimes.com)

It appears Cornyn and gang couldn't come to an agreement in time to hold a vote prior to the 4th of July Recess. Doesn't mean it's dead, but likely makes it harder to pass as time goes on. I'm going to keep trying to get people to call the Rs and pull support myself.

Corryn and Co. want to keep their jobs.

That simple.

They have the money for security and etc. and they couldn't care less about the everyman/everywoman.

meanwhile, the Czechs be like:

O čem to mluvíš?

Bank wants to track suspect credit card sales of guns, ammo – but can't

MSN

www.msn.com

"Socially Responsible" Bank wants to be able to track firearm and ammunition purchases... "The bank said it could then file what's called a suspicious activity report with law enforcement..." if they don't like your shopping habits.

The fact that somebody actually believed people are bringing their credit cards to a back alley illegal gun purchases is beyond comical.

use cash m8.

No. They did this because we went over there and started fucking with them. Oh, they'd be a shitty place to live regardless of what we did, but the reason why they attacked us is because we attacked them, bombing them, and fucking with them for far longer than we like to admit. Hardline Islamism owes it's popularity to America proving the crazies right.

I miss the good dope days of Saddam and Gaddafi.

You could actually go to Iraq and Libya for a legit vacation without getting killed.

gad'em!

Now, I'm not a gun guy by any stretch, but my understanding is that using terms like "assault weapon" or "assault-style weapon" are a telltale sign of illiteracy when it comes to firearms? (Branding them "assault rifles" is even worse, I'd think, seeing as civilians are barred from owning fully automatic weapons, save for a handful of hurdle-ridden exceptions.)

this is why my friend likes Mini-14s.

when the 2nd Revolution comes around, a foolish leftist will think his Mini-14 isn't a thread, and then get stomped 6 feet under.

They are trying to rush it through, unsurprising.

Fingers crossed the republicans don't screw the American people over.

at this point, you don't even need to read.

just vote against it because whatever they're trying to pass is inevitably infringing on the 2A.

I'm surprised a TrueRepub hasn't tweeted about this already.

 

[Bacle]

 

[Ixian]

Blatantly unconstitutional, at every level. No way this survives the supreme court even if it passes.

 

[Abhorsen]

Blatantly unconstitutional, at every level. No way this survives the supreme court even if it passes.

No, it seems designed to setup the bare minimum that they think will pass constitutional muster, which is far worse. And designed such that if part of is invalidated (like the lawyer not at government expense), it will just delete that part, no the whole bill.

 

[Bacle]

 

[Terthna]

No. They did this because we went over there and started fucking with them. Oh, they'd be a shitty place to live regardless of what we did, but the reason why they attacked us is because we attacked them, bombing them, and fucking with them for far longer than we like to admit. Hardline Islamism owes it's popularity to America proving the crazies right.

Also, we kinda kept arming and training extremists in the region.

 

[Cherico]

more people to purge I guess.

 

[Ixian]

14 politicians selling out their fellow countrymen.

 

[BlackDragon98]

14 politicians selling out their fellow countrymen.

14 more nooses to the pile

 

[DarthOne]

Kari Lake for AZ Governor

@KariLake

When I’m Governor, Arizona will not recognize unconstitutional Gun Laws in our state. We just won’t do it. What are the Feds going to do? Fly down here and arrest a sitting Governor? Call my bluff.

Of course, the usual suspects in the comments are bringing up mass shootings to play the guilt card.

Senate Gun Control Deal Applies Domestic Violence Statutes, Gun Bans, to ‘Dating Relationships’

Gun Control Deal Applies Domestic Violence Statutes to 'Dating'

Section 12005 of the Senate gun control deal expands traditional domestic violence protections from spouses to "dating relationships."

www.breitbart.com

Section 12005 of the Senate gun control deal expands traditional domestic violence protections from spouse and ex-spouses to “dating relationships.”

This the list of prohibited purchasers in the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) will include certain boyfriends and girlfriends, should the Senate gun control deal become law.

The bill says, “The term ‘dating relationship’ means a relationship between individuals who have or have recently had a a continuing serious relationship or a romantic or intimate nature.”

The legislation indicates the “length of the relationship,” “the nature of the relationship,” and the “frequency and type of interaction between individuals involved in the relationship,” all play a role in determining if the relationship is, in fact, a “dating relationship.”

The legislation does not indicate who will decide which relationships qualify as a “dating relationship.” Because of such ambiguities the NRA noted, “The NRA noted, “This bill leaves too much discretion in the hands of government officials and also contains undefined and overboard provisions — inviting interference with our constitutional freedoms.”

National Association for Gun Rights

@NatlGunRights

Would you look at that! 9 out of top 11 highest NRA funded US Senators voted FOR selling out your gun rights to the Democrats. In other words this compromise was brought to you by the
@NRA
. Care to explain Wayne?
@NRAILA

 

[DarthOne]

BREAKING: Text of Senate Gun Bill Released, and Your Rights Are Dangling by a Thread

Text of Senate Gun Bill Released, and Your Rights Are Dangling by a Thread

There are ZERO guidelines for what triggers a

redstate.com

Nearly 10 days after a “framework” agreement on additional federal gun laws was reached by a group of 20 members of the United States Senate, the text of the bill was released by Sen. Chris Murphy (D-CT) Tuesday night, and the Senate is currently (as of press time) taking a vote on whether or not to begin debate on the bill – even while analysts are still digesting it.

For those who don’t want to read for themselves or wait for trusted analysts, Murphy posted a tweet thread asking people to “let [him] tell you what it does.”

Chris Murphy

@ChrisMurphyCT

Here it is, folks - the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act, the most significant piece of anti-gun violence legislation in nearly 30 years. This bill is going to save thousands of lives. 1/ We just released the text. Let me tell you what it does:

Pardon us if we’re not going to take Murphy’s word on the bill’s provisions.

According to a cursory reading, here’s what we see that the bill does:

• Allots more than $100 million to states and tribal authorities in the form of grants to “expand” mental health services, including mental health services delivered on school campuses
  
  
• Expands Byrne JAG grant program to cover implementation of “extreme risk protection orders,” a/k/a red flag laws, with zero framework for that except a cursory, “don’t violate their due process rights” warning
  
  
• Includes juvenile criminal convictions and commitment to a mental health institution (after age 16) as prohibiting factors
  
  
• “Closing” the supposed “boyfriend” (or girlfriend depending on how they identify) loophole by adding even more undefined/loosely defined terminology and stronger penalties
  
  
• Enhances sentencing for “straw purchasers” under federal law
  
  
• (Laughably) goes after drug dealers/cartels for gun running (more on that in an additional piece)
  
  
• Allocates $100,000,000 to the FBI for “salaries and expenses…to meet additional resource needs of the National Instant Criminal Background Check System”
  
  
• Awards $1,400,000,000 (yes, that’s $1.4 billion) to the Department of Justice for “State and Local Law Enforcement Assistance,” $750 million of which is earmarked for Byrne JAG grants
  
  
• $100,000,000 to the FBI to be used “for competitive grants to be administered by the Community Oriented Policing Services Office for purposes authorized under the STOP School Violence Act of 2018”

The text of the bill can be read here.

Now, no one is against students, particularly teenagers, who might be at risk of violently attacking their classmates, receiving necessary mental health care to prevent a horrific outcome.

But why are we including things like DHHS sharing “best practices for delivering telehealth services” to underserved communities, including billing to Medicare/Medicaid, in a gun control bill? Shouldn’t DHHS be doing that as a matter of course, as a matter of streamlining program delivery?

Why are we including directives to ensure that CHIP and Medicare/Medicaid funding pays for things called for in a student’s Individualized Education Plan (IEP) in a gun control bill? Shouldn’t that already be happening, and if it isn’t, shouldn’t it be part of its own bill?

Why are we including a provision to “ensure ongoing coordination and collaboration between the Department of Health and Human Services and the Department of Education with respect to the provision of, and payment for, assistance under Medicaid by local educational agencies” in a gun control bill?

This provision stood out to me:

$50,000,000 for fiscal year 2022 for the Secretary to award grants to States for the purpose of implementing, enhancing, or expanding the provision of assistance through school-based entities under Medicaid or CHIP. A State shall not use any grant funds to provide medical assistance, child health assistance, or other health services.

Is that why the Hyde Amendment was such a sticking point? Did they foresee using those funds for abortions? Do we have any confidence whatsoever that those monies will be used to help the students truly at risk for violence? It’s not like we don’t know the profile of a school shooter by now.

As a resident of California, where most terrible laws start and are abused, I read the “extreme risk protection orders” section with great concern. Just because the bill says that procedures have to be in place to ensure that one’s due process and other constitutional rights are protected, that one is entitled to counsel at no charge, has the right to confront witnesses, et cetera, et cetera, doesn’t mean that’s what the state-based laws will actually do in practice. In fact, a provision on page 34 gives it away (emphasis mine):

Such programs must include, at the appropriate phase to prevent any violation of constitutional rights, at minimum, notice, the right to an in-person hearing, an unbiased adjudicator, the right to know opposing evidence, the right to present evidence, and the right to confront adverse witnesses;

An ex parte order can be granted if a judge determines that there is cause for the ex parte hearing, which means that you are not guaranteed notice before your rights are stripped. And, because there are no — zero — guidelines in this bill as to what constitutes a trigger for an extreme risk protection order, the US Senate cannot even debate the pros and cons of those triggers.


The National Rifle Association issued a statement late Tuesday:

The NRA will support legislation that improves school security, promotes mental health services, and helps reduce violent crime. However, we will oppose this gun control legislation because it falls short at every level. It does little to truly address violent crime while opening the door to unnecessary burdens on the exercise of Second Amendment freedom by law-abiding gun owners.

This legislation can be abused to restrict lawful gun purchases, infringe upon the rights of law-abiding Americans, and use federal dollars to fund gun control measures being adopted by state and local politicians. This bill leaves too much discretion in the hands of government officials and also contains undefined and overbroad provisions – inviting interference with our constitutional freedoms.

Decisions by the Supreme Court of the United States in the Heller and McDonald cases make clear that the Second Amendment is an individual constitutional freedom. We will always fight for those freedoms – and the fundamental values we have defended for over 150 years.

This is a blank check to Moms Demand and Everytown, signed by Mitch McConnell and the vast majority of the GOP members of the US Senate. Given that the 10 GOP senators who are part of this Gang of 20 aren’t up for election this year and many are retiring, it’s certainly within the realm of possibility that McConnell and a number of Republican senators concocted this plan, allowing 10 members who wouldn’t face an angry electorate this November to take the PR hit.

Every effort must be made to stop this terrible bill from becoming law.

 

[The Whispering Monk]

14 politicians selling out their fellow countrymen.

That should read 64. The Left is just as guilty.

 

[BlackDragon98]

just because there are laws doesn't mean people will obey them.

it is time for us to become the criminals

#MAGAGANG

 

[Ixian]

That should read 64. The Left is just as guilty.

I expect the left to be full of politicians looking to shaft the American people.

My issue here is with the 14 idiots on the right that should know who butters their fucking bread.

 

[BlackDragon98]

I expect the left to be full of politicians looking to shaft the American people.

My issue here is with the 14 idiots on the right that should know who butters their fucking bread.

commiecrat bribes.

that's who