China ChiCom News Thread

[Zachowon]

Ahh.
You can launch a missle.
Cute, now get a whole division of your military far behind our lines and then we can talk.
Because we have the most powerful logistical train in the world.

 

[Whitestrake Pelinal]

Ahh.
You can launch a missle.
Cute, now get a whole division of your military far behind our lines and then we can talk.
Because we have the most powerful logistical train in the world.

If China can make a credible threat of mutually assured destruction, our ability to stage foreign invasions is rendered moot in places that China chooses to occupy. In the face of NATO attempts to establish ABM systems, weapons such as this seem quite relevant.

 

[Husky_Khan]

China is engaging in a very expansive and broad censorship campaign to bring about the ultimate in curated "walled gardens!"

The nation investigated 1.83 million apps to ensure they don't infringe users' rights. Some 4,200 illegal apps found to require "rectification".

On top of that, 73,000 websites were "investigated and dealt with in accordance with the law" according to machine translation of Xiao's speech. Roughly 51,900 companies with "bad lists" were also told to straighten up.

The July 2021 order requiring an end to use of pop-up ads that can't be closed appears to have worked: the minister said 69 per cent of such ads could not be closed in July, and that number is now down to "basically zero".

The minister also talked up initiatives aimed at helping smaller tech companies. Xiao said those plans have created 4,700 "little giants" and helped 40,000 provincial-level companies focussed on innovation as part of China's plan to encourage development of "healthy" tech companies.

China's tech minister signals ongoing crackdown of apps, web

Ongoing crackdown saw apps 1.83 million apps tested, 4,200 told to clean up their act, pop-up ads popped

www.theregister.com

---

In related news, both Apple and Audible removed 'Bible' and "Koran' apps from their Chinese app stores at the request of the Chinese government due to "hosting illegal religioust texts." Recently Microsoft also was compelled to remove its LinkedIn from China for failure to comply to Chinese permits.

Apple takes down Quran app in China

The popular Islamic app was removed in the country, after an official request.

www.bbc.com

 

[Zachowon]

If China can make a credible threat of mutually assured destruction, our ability to stage foreign invasions is rendered moot in places that China chooses to occupy. In the face of NATO attempts to establish ABM systems, weapons such as this seem quite relevant.

Not really.
The weapons we are talking about are not good for attacking aircraft in the sky, because, if it can miss by 2 miles, a small target is noensense

 

[Whitestrake Pelinal]

Not really.
The weapons we are talking about are not good for attacking aircraft in the sky, because, if it can miss by 2 miles, a small target is noensense

Nuclear weapons do not need to be perfectly accurate to inflict terrible damage and mass fatalities. Again, the significance of such weapons is not to fight our military, but to threaten our empire as a whole with MAD nuclear exchange if we were to attempt to employ our superior conventional force projection against China.

The threat would be credible; CCP officials would feel no remorse for nuking a bunch of uppity gweilo, and they would immediately lie to their population and claim we launched first.

 

[Zachowon]

Nuclear weapons do not need to be perfectly accurate to inflict terrible damage and mass fatalities. Again, the significance of such weapons is not to fight our military, but to threaten our empire as a whole with MAD nuclear exchange if we were to attempt to employ our superior conventional force projection against China.

The threat would be credible; CCP officials would feel no remorse for nuking a bunch of uppity gweilo, and they would immediately lie to their population and claim we launched first.

They will not nuke us if we try to defend Taiwan.
That would cause MAD and they arnt willing to lose everything for Taiwan.

Also, the hypersonic glider missing by two miles is a huge issue, because it may seem like they are ahead of us, but they arnt.

What this is is called Propaganda to try and show they are better then the US.

Besides the fact we have also been working on the same things and ways to counter.

 

[Whitestrake Pelinal]

They will not nuke us if we try to defend Taiwan.
That would cause MAD and they arnt willing to lose everything for Taiwan.

Also, the hypersonic glider missing by two miles is a huge issue, because it may seem like they are ahead of us, but they arnt.

What this is is called Propaganda to try and show they are better then the US.

Besides the fact we have also been working on the same things and ways to counter.

A partially successful test of an orbital weapon is not mere propaganda.

Telling ourselves "they won't do it" is not a deterrent. They absolutely would do it if they convinced themselves of a favorable outcome. Whether the CCP rules a nation of 1500 million or 500 million matters less to them than their security in power.

 

[Zachowon]

A partially successful test of an orbital weapon is not mere propaganda.

Telling ourselves "they won't do it" is not a deterrent. They absolutely would do it if they convinced themselves of a favorable outcome. Whether the CCP rules a nation of 1500 million or 500 million matters less to them than their security in power.

They wouldn't even have a population of they caused MAD.

Partially successful.
What all do we actually know about what was launched? Besides what China is saying and unverified US sources?

 

[Bear Ribs]

Yeah, if you look at the radius of damage for nuclear weapon effects, you need the bigger nukes to have any serious effects from a 2-mile miss. A W-83 warhead in a Minuteman missile, f'rex, only has a 10psi overpressure of 1.8 miles (8-10 is where buildings are destroyed). So a 2-mile miss is pretty significant as it won't likely destroy the target it's aimed at though it will still do significant damage.

That said, 2 miles is the maximum if I read things right, not the average, and resting on our laurels and presuming China won't be working to get that number down post-haste would be a grave mistake.

 

[Zachowon]

Yeah, if you look at the radius of damage for nuclear weapon effects, you need the bigger nukes to have any serious effects from a 2-mile miss. A W-83 warhead in a Minuteman missile, f'rex, only has a 10psi overpressure of 1.8 miles (8-10 is where buildings are destroyed). So a 2-mile miss is pretty significant as it won't likely destroy the target it's aimed at though it will still do significant damage.

That said, 2 miles is the maximum if I read things right, not the average, and resting on our laurels and presuming China won't be working to get that number down post-haste would be a grave mistake.

Oh of course.
But ot seems people think we are behind.

We were working on this shit since 2011. That is what I got a quick Google search

 

[Bear Ribs]

Oh of course.
But ot seems people think we are behind.

We were working on this shit since 2011. That is what I got a quick Google search

The US isn't behind, however it is always easier for somebody behind to catch up than the person ahead to keep ahead, just by the nature of espionage, copying, and not following the same dead ends that the leader did.

 

[Zachowon]

The US isn't behind, however it is always easier for somebody behind to catch up than the person ahead to keep ahead, just by the nature of espionage, copying, and not following the same dead ends that the leader did.

Yep.
People seem to focus on what is shown. Almost like China wants everyone to know what they make. Same with Russia and North Korea. The US doesnt.

 

[Bear Ribs]

Yes, we've advanced well past pigeon-guided missiles and today the US military may have seagull, even crow-guided missiles which are far more intelligent than pigeons.

 

[Zachowon]

Yes, we've advanced well past pigeon-guided missiles and today the US military may have seagull, even crow-guided missiles which are far more intelligent than pigeons.

I would say Eagle guided, but those are precious to us. Definently Crow guided. We put the enemy face to be there to act like they hut the crow so for generations we can have them be used to guide the bombs

 

[Vaermina]

Yeah, if you look at the radius of damage for nuclear weapon effects, you need the bigger nukes to have any serious effects from a 2-mile miss. A W-83 warhead in a Minuteman missile, f'rex, only has a 10psi overpressure of 1.8 miles (8-10 is where buildings are destroyed). So a 2-mile miss is pretty significant as it won't likely destroy the target it's aimed at though it will still do significant damage.

That said, 2 miles is the maximum if I read things right, not the average, and resting on our laurels and presuming China won't be working to get that number down post-haste would be a grave mistake.

It missed by 2 dozen miles, not 2 miles...

 

[LordsFire]

A partially successful test of an orbital weapon is not mere propaganda.

Telling ourselves "they won't do it" is not a deterrent. They absolutely would do it if they convinced themselves of a favorable outcome. Whether the CCP rules a nation of 1500 million or 500 million matters less to them than their security in power.

You are demonstrating that you really do not understand how MAD works.

First off, if one nation can do whatever it wants because the other nation is afraid of its nuclear arsenal, that's not MAD, that's global dominance.

Second, the fact that we can launch back, launch more, and can intercept a meaningful percentage of what they launch, while they can't intercept anything of what we launch, means that MAD favors us, not them.

Third, if the US launches on the CCP, there will not be a 'nation of 500 million' left for them to rule afterwards. There will be total anarchy and collapse, because every single major military and governmental center will be destroyed, the Three Gorges Dam will be destroyed, their entire economy will be smashed, the Chinese won't even be able to feed themselves.

I'm sure that some of their elite leadership cabal would initially survive in some deep bunker somewhere, but odds are very good that they would be killed by their own people in the aftermath for what they caused, and even if they weren't, follow-up strikes both conventional and nuclear by the US would be pretty much guaranteed to take them out.

The best case for China is that the US is equally wrecked, but under no condition whatsoever does a nuclear exchange result in the CCP ruling anything, except for maybe the irradiated wreckage of Beijing itself.

 

[Whitestrake Pelinal]

You are demonstrating that you really do not understand how MAD works.

First off, if one nation can do whatever it wants because the other nation is afraid of its nuclear arsenal, that's not MAD, that's global dominance.

Second, the fact that we can launch back, launch more, and can intercept a meaningful percentage of what they launch, while they can't intercept anything of what we launch, means that MAD favors us, not them.

Third, if the US launches on the CCP, there will not be a 'nation of 500 million' left for them to rule afterwards. There will be total anarchy and collapse, because every single major military and governmental center will be destroyed, the Three Gorges Dam will be destroyed, their entire economy will be smashed, the Chinese won't even be able to feed themselves.

I'm sure that some of their elite leadership cabal would initially survive in some deep bunker somewhere, but odds are very good that they would be killed by their own people in the aftermath for what they caused, and even if they weren't, follow-up strikes both conventional and nuclear by the US would be pretty much guaranteed to take them out.

The best case for China is that the US is equally wrecked, but under no condition whatsoever does a nuclear exchange result in the CCP ruling anything, except for maybe the irradiated wreckage of Beijing itself.

This is some of the purest, uncut copium I have encountered this year.

The entire point of the hypersonic weapons China just tested is to evade our existing interception methods. As for MAD, every nation with nuclear capability chooses where it draws its lines, and when it pulls the trigger, there is no fairness and equality clause. If the CCP occupies Taiwan and claims "Taiwan is part of China, touch it and we nuke you", globohomo could choose to call their bluff.. but the choice of whether it is or is not a bluff is entirely up to the CCP.

Expecting the Chinese people to rise up against their own leaders when what they see around them is the ruin caused by a foreign attack? Expecting a US nuclear arsenal maintained by political hires to be fully effective?

Come on.

 

[Cherico]

This is some of the purest, uncut copium I have encountered this year.

The entire point of the hypersonic weapons China just tested is to evade our existing interception methods. As for MAD, every nation with nuclear capability chooses where it draws its lines, and when it pulls the trigger, there is no fairness and equality clause. If the CCP occupies Taiwan and claims "Taiwan is part of China, touch it and we nuke you", globohomo could choose to call their bluff.. but the choice of whether it is or is not a bluff is entirely up to the CCP.

Expecting the Chinese people to rise up against their own leaders when what they see around them is the ruin caused by a foreign attack? Expecting a US nuclear arsenal maintained by political hires to be fully effective?

Come on.

The chinese rise up against their leaders all of the time.

All you need is a big enough fuck up and boom mandate of heaven is gone and you have constant rebellions until the old leadership is gone and the new one takes up its place.

Don't get me wrong the country has a lot going for it but they also have a host of internal weaknesses including being the most overleveraged country in human history, one of the fastest aging populations in the world, water issues and the fact that they have pissed off a lot of their neighbors in quick succession.

The country is in for some serious hard times with internal issues either worse or just as bad as the wests.



Really every ones some degree of fucked for the forseeable future.

 

[LordsFire]

This is some of the purest, uncut copium I have encountered this year.

The entire point of the hypersonic weapons China just tested is to evade our existing interception methods. As for MAD, every nation with nuclear capability chooses where it draws its lines, and when it pulls the trigger, there is no fairness and equality clause. If the CCP occupies Taiwan and claims "Taiwan is part of China, touch it and we nuke you", globohomo could choose to call their bluff.. but the choice of whether it is or is not a bluff is entirely up to the CCP.

Expecting the Chinese people to rise up against their own leaders when what they see around them is the ruin caused by a foreign attack? Expecting a US nuclear arsenal maintained by political hires to be fully effective?

Come on.

If there's a Democrat in the White House, there are good odds that they'd choose not to fight over Taiwan, that's true.

That's very different than what this post:

If China can make a credible threat of mutually assured destruction, our ability to stage foreign invasions is rendered moot in places that China chooses to occupy. In the face of NATO attempts to establish ABM systems, weapons such as this seem quite relevant.

Implies.


I'm not posting 'copium.'

The US currently has 400 Minuteman III ICBMs in land-based silos, 14 Ohio-class submarines with classified numbers of nukes on board, as well as 20 B-2 stealth bombers, and 40 active-service B-52's with hundreds more mothballed. This is what we have that the existence of which is not classified.

Best estimates are that China has 66 land-based ICBMs capable of spanning the Pacific or hopping the Arctic sea to hit North America. Unlike the US, cultural, technological, and military realities mean that the actual functional number is likely lower, not higher. They have a couple of subs with missiles, but they're... well, a threat to minor nations I suppose, but not much else.

The Chinese also have no meaningful implementation of anti-ballistic missile shield technology, while the US is the world leader in such things, with multiple different layers and elements to such. Of course, exactly how effective it would be isn't known, and hopefully never will, but it certainly factors into strategic calculus.

The Chinese have now tested a missile which is not in general production, much less wide-scale service. It might be a meaningful MAD threat in five to ten years.


...If China lasts that long as a rising power. They're suffering from rolling power outages, their real estate bubble is starting to implode, their demography is collapsing, foreign investment has been increasingly pulling out, and there's a very real danger that yearly flooding alone will destroy the Three Gorges Dam, and if that goes, tens of millions die and the Chinese economy is shattered.

If China manages to overcome all of these problems, and the US fails to overcome the problems that it is currently facing, then in a decade or three, there might be some parity to the MAD calculus.

But as things currently stand, any nuclear exchange will destroy the CCP, whereas the US will simply suffer grievous loss. After all, we are actually capable of producing our own food; they aren't.

 

[Zachowon]

Apperently China is getting power help from russia

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