Use of Personal Weapons in the Military

[LordsFire]

Which is a shame.

The 17th Indiana, 72nd Indiana, 98th Illinois, and 123rd Illinois got Spencers because John T. Wilder basically told Congress "we're getting Spencers". When he volunteered two cannons he comissioned came along for the ride.

Yes, and back in the day when the idea of standardized and interchangeable parts was just starting to get going, and guns didn't require brass cartridge ammunition with tolerances measured in a millimeter or less, things were very different.

Technology and logistics have both substantially changed.

 

[bintananth]

Okay.
I want yall to realize something. They were requiring people to use the weapons issued since WW1.
Exceptions could be made for Sidearms, but not main weapon.

They* were colliqually known as "The Lightning Brigade", "Wilder's Brigade" or "The Hatchet Brigade" during the latter parts of the US Civil War.

A Spencer Rifle would have cost a US Private Soldier three months of pay back then and they were willing to pay for them out of their own pockets ... assuming they could get them. That would be akin an E3 today deciding to buy an M82A1 because the Army won't issue them one and they think they need it.

* 1st Brigade, 4th Division, XIV Corps and I forgot to list the fifth regiment and the artillery.

 

[Zachowon]

They* were colliqually known as "The Lightning Brigade", "Wilder's Brigade" or "The Hatchet Brigade" during the latter parts of the US Civil War.

A Spencer Rifle would have cost a US Private Soldier three months of pay back then and they were willing to pay for them out of their own pockets ... assuming they could get them. That would be akin an E3 today deciding to buy an M82A1 because the Army won't issue them one and they think they need it.

* 1st Brigade, 4th Division, XIV Corps and I forgot to list the fifth regiment and the artillery.

Logistics is the main reason for why we don't get to bring our own

 

[bintananth]

Logistics is the main reason for why we don't get to bring our own

Wilder was not a normal Colonel.

He was affluent enough to embarass Congress with words, very stubborn, and skilled enough that 2-3 days before Antietam Braxton Bragg sent roughly 20,000 Confederates on an approximately 30 mile overnight forced march just to get rid of the 3 Union regiments he was in charge of that were dug in around Munfordville, Kentucky.

That's about half as many Confederate troops as R.E. Lee had at Antietam.

 

[Zachowon]

Wilder was not a normal Colonel.

He was affluent enough to embarass Congress with words, very stubborn, and skilled enough that 2-3 days before Antietam Braxton Bragg sent roughly 20,000 Confederates on an approximately 30 mile overnight forced march just to get rid of the 3 Union regiments he was in charge of that were dug in around Munfordville, Kentucky.

That's about half as many Confederate troops as R.E. Lee had at Antietam.

I am just telling you why we have standard and can't have our own weapons.

 

[bintananth]

I am just telling you why we have standard and can't have our own weapons.

Wilder was one of those very rare individuals in the right place, at the right time, and with the right skills and resources to completely change the standard.

Just about the only early-1860s American rifle you can get that's better than a Spencer Rifle is the Henry Rifle and the total number of those made back then would barely be enough for an 1860s infantry division. If the Spencer and Henry weren't the best two availble anywhere in the world they were certainly among the best.

If a Confederate somehow managed to get their hands on a Spencer or Henry they wouldn't be able to use it for long because there wasn't a single factory in the entire South capable of making the cartridges except for possibly Tredegar Iron Works in Richmond, VA.

 

[Zachowon]

Wilder was one of those very rare individuals in the right place, at the right time, and with the right skills and resources to completely change the standard.

Just about the only early-1860s American rifle you can get that's better than a Spencer Rifle is the Henry Rifle and the total number of those made back then would barely be enough for an 1860s infantry division. If the Spencer and Henry weren't the best two availble anywhere in the world they were certainly among the best.

If a Confederate somehow managed to get their hands on a Spencer or Henry they wouldn't be able to use it for long because there wasn't a single factory in the entire South capable of making the cartridges except for possibly Tredegar Iron Works in Richmond, VA.

In modern times though, the round used is used by two separate systems so always have it on board.

Plus, with the upcoming rifle they are making,it wont be the lowest bidder (Never really has been for the weapon. M14 was just pushed forward not the lowest bidder)

 

[bintananth]

In modern times though, the round used is used by two separate systems so always have it on board.

Plus, with the upcoming rifle they are making,it wont be the lowest bidder (Never really has been for the weapon. M14 was just pushed forward not the lowest bidder)

During the Civil War the two most common rifles were the British Enfield and the American Springfield. They used the same paper-wrapped Minié-ball black powder cartridge and the Springfield could be called a cheap knock-off (Enfields: $20, Springfields: $15).

 

[Knowledgeispower]

During the Civil War the two most common rifles were the British Enfield and the American Springfield. They used the same paper-wrapped Minié-ball black powder cartridge and the Springfield could be called a cheap knock-off (Enfields: $20, Springfields: $15).

Of course American labor costs were lower than English ones as were the shipping costs

 

[bintananth]

Of course American labor costs were lower than English ones as were the shipping costs

It's estimated that roughly two Enfields wound up in American* hands for every one the British military bought. Toss in the Springfields and "a rifle behind every blade of grass" would be more of a hyperbole than a grossly absurd exaggeration.

(As it stands now most militaries aren't as well armed as American civilians collectively are)

* CSA or USA, ain't making a distinction here.