PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
Just ask Bruce Lee. Chuck held back and let him win because they were friends, yet still he just collapsed and died one day from the delayed damage.
Chuck Norris wants to save the A-10
- Thread starter Scottty
- Start date
Tiamat
I've seen the future...
You know, as an Air Force vet myself, never understood the sneering condescension from the brass toward the Hog. Yes, I know, it comes back to it not being air-capable like the F-16 (aka Lawn Darts), but the maxim remains if you want to take territory and hold it, you need boots on the ground, and the boots need effective CAS which the A-10 provides.
Granted, I worked mainly on F-15's and I love the damn birds, but the Hog is a goddamn Reaper as far as the other side is concerned, whether they happen to be an insurgent with an AK or some poor schmuck in a Soviet-era tank. I would often see the big ugly birds taxiing down the runway at Spangdahlem AFB, looking at that seven-barreled GAU-8 30mm autocannon it's built around, and think "world's biggest airborne splat gun/can opener."
(Caveat: Some would argue that the honor of the world's biggest airborne splat gun might belong to the AC-130 Spectre, but the A-10 was purposefully built to stomp tanks like beer cans.)
Granted, I worked mainly on F-15's and I love the damn birds, but the Hog is a goddamn Reaper as far as the other side is concerned, whether they happen to be an insurgent with an AK or some poor schmuck in a Soviet-era tank. I would often see the big ugly birds taxiing down the runway at Spangdahlem AFB, looking at that seven-barreled GAU-8 30mm autocannon it's built around, and think "world's biggest airborne splat gun/can opener."
(Caveat: Some would argue that the honor of the world's biggest airborne splat gun might belong to the AC-130 Spectre, but the A-10 was purposefully built to stomp tanks like beer cans.)
The Air Force Brass does not respect the fact that the A-10 is the Air Forces @#%!ing Pimp Hand!!!
The Navy respects the fact that the Ohio Class SSGNs are our Pimp hand
The Army respects the fact that the M1A2 is it's Pimp Hand
And the Marines respect the fact that it's Zulu Cobra is it's Pimp Hand.
The Air Force brass seem like UConn Grads in Military Uniforms. They have an over inflated sense of their own opinion. Which is sad.
I think the AF sees it's Pimp Hand more in the B-52 than anything.
The A-10 probably seems more like varmit gun to them, despite the fact ground pounders love it.
Objectively the actual Pimp Hand is probably the B-1B.
PsihoKekec
Swashbuckling Accountant
The biggest factor in USAF brass hatred of A-10 is that from the moment thy became an independent branch, the Air Force leadership insisted that they could win wars on their own, so ALL THE MONEY should go to them. You can't win the war all on your own by supporting the other branches, can't you?
See, they thought that because they were apart of the Army who at the time before the split, they were winning as their own branch..the Army.
Maybe the Air Force should have had the same setup as the US Marines have. Be a separate branch within the Department of the Army. Just like the Marines are a separate branch in the Department of the Navy.
They were to high and mighty for their own good. We got rid of them because they were to egotistical, and it allowed us to free up our budget.
Its funny, they are the two largest branches, and couldn't be more diffrent
Just a bit of personal history. Back when I was in High School I talked to an Air Force recruiter and asked about joining (I know I must have had a high fever and was sick or something). He pretty much made it clear that I would not be a good fit for the Air Force. Where as the Army, Navy and Marine Corps recruiters were falling over themselves trying to get me to join their branches. The way that Air Force recruiter dismissed me left a bad taste in my mouth for many years. But I eventually got over it.
The Air force may have the hottest women, but are the biggest most egotistical branch. Of course I know plenty that aren't, but also know more that are.
Knowledgeispower
Ah I love the smell of missile spam in the morning
To be fair to the Air Force brass who want to retire the A-10 the simple fact is that the A-10 is in need of serious upgrades and moreover they don't have unlimted flight hours for their airframes so a replacement would be a good idea as it's a better investment of money. Mind you the F-35A ain't a proper replacement. Of course at this point assuming Congress forked over the dough and mandated the program you'd probably see a prospective A-10 replacement enter service in around eight to ten years and probably replace the full A-10 at around 2040 assuming we make them at a reasonable pace. This of course means that while we were deeply involved in wars which saw extensive use of the A-10 during the 2000s a program to replace the A-10 with a proper replacement should have been commenced
Why not just replace the airframes - ie build more of them?
Knowledgeispower
Ah I love the smell of missile spam in the morning
If nothing else I imagine that the A-10 airframe lacks the spare power production capabilities to run all the systems a modern A-10 equivalent would need in a modern war and to run everything in general since modern equipment uses a lot more juice. Plus given how the last A-10 rolled off the line in 1984 it's not like there's any benefit in maintaing the industrial base in building such an old design
I wonder what a more modern design of the same concept would look like?
As you can see, the Army would love there to be something to Make CAS Great Again.
gral
Well-known member
Also, Fairchild Republic went bankrupt two-three years after ending production of the A-10 - it was a company with serious management(both company and engineering) problems, and after they fucked up the T-46 they couldn't survive.
My guess is the next CAS platform for the Army will be something like the YAH-56 Cheyenne, being either a compound helicopter like the S-97 Raider or the SB-1(S-100) Defiant, or a tilt-rotor. I don't think the Air Force will build a successor(even though there is a program going on).
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I mean, I'm pretty sure if the military gave Boeing (who kinda needs the money) or any other aircraft company money to make a new A-10 they would. Hell just make a contest asking for a replacement that is strictly CAS and set the parameters as: Build it around a big ass machine gun. Make it nigh unkillible. Make it a one man killing machine. Must go BBBRRRTTTT.
Knowledgeispower
Ah I love the smell of missile spam in the morning
Oh course to make it nigh unkillable on the modern battlefield I suspect it would need quite the beefy ECM and EW package which wouldn't do pretty things to the cost per airplane. Also I suspect that Congress would need to hold the fighter mafia's procurement of new rides hostage to get the Air Force to agree to procure such a craft.
Doomsought
Well-known member
The problem the A-10 has is that it fills a niche role that only the US is rich enough to have an aircraft variant to fill. It is a close air support gunship, but everyone judges it against strike fighters, even though the roles are completely different. If you only look at how it is used, it has more in common with an attack helo than a strike fighter.
Knowledgeispower
Ah I love the smell of missile spam in the morning
Not really a whole bunch of nations operate its Soviet/Russian equivalent the SU-25 in fact said airframe is still made today some 42 years after it first rolled off the line