WI: Dmytro Vyshnevetsky Defects to the Ottomans?

[TheRomanSlayer]

For those of you who don't know, Dmytro Vyshnevetsky was rumored to have been the first Cossack Hetman and also founded the Registered Cossack regiments that served the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. However, Sigismund II August's attempts at Catholicizing the Ruthenian population had angered him to the point where he was ready to defect to the Ottomans and to a lesser extent, the Crimean Khanate. However, Vyshnevetsky was instead ordered to built a fortress in an island called Mala Khortysia, the site of what would become the Zaporizhian Cossach Sich. His fortress would ensure the security of what is OTL Southern Ukraine and deterred the Crimeans from sacking the fort, forcing the Crimean Khan to redirect his raids towards Muscovy.

So what if Vyshnevetsky had actually decided to defect to the service of the Ottoman Empire? IOTL, he was only able to serve Suleiman the Magnificent for a while before returning to Mala Khortysia and began his service with the Russian Tsardom. ITTL, would his permanent defection to the Ottomans be successful in playing off the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and the Tsardom of Russia, thereby creating a powerbase from which an alternate Cossack Hetmanate would arise with Vyshnevetsky as its head? Would an earlier formation of a Cossack Hetmanate also have an effect on the politics of the Eurasian steppe and the Sublime Porte as well?

Another thing about an earlier formation of an alt-Sich is that the Ruthenian peasants might be able to escape from serfdom towards that area, and it could also prevent any further future Cossack revolts against the Polish crown.

 

[ATP]

For those of you who don't know, Dmytro Vyshnevetsky was rumored to have been the first Cossack Hetman and also founded the Registered Cossack regiments that served the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. However, Sigismund II August's attempts at Catholicizing the Ruthenian population had angered him to the point where he was ready to defect to the Ottomans and to a lesser extent, the Crimean Khanate. However, Vyshnevetsky was instead ordered to built a fortress in an island called Mala Khortysia, the site of what would become the Zaporizhian Cossach Sich. His fortress would ensure the security of what is OTL Southern Ukraine and deterred the Crimeans from sacking the fort, forcing the Crimean Khan to redirect his raids towards Muscovy.

So what if Vyshnevetsky had actually decided to defect to the service of the Ottoman Empire? IOTL, he was only able to serve Suleiman the Magnificent for a while before returning to Mala Khortysia and began his service with the Russian Tsardom. ITTL, would his permanent defection to the Ottomans be successful in playing off the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and the Tsardom of Russia, thereby creating a powerbase from which an alternate Cossack Hetmanate would arise with Vyshnevetsky as its head? Would an earlier formation of a Cossack Hetmanate also have an effect on the politics of the Eurasian steppe and the Sublime Porte as well?

Another thing about an earlier formation of an alt-Sich is that the Ruthenian peasants might be able to escape from serfdom towards that area, and it could also prevent any further future Cossack revolts against the Polish crown.

Interesting.Tsars was slave owners,so he would not defect to them,but sultans,when they have slaves,too,created yheir christian subject better then moscovites.Peasants even better then not only tsar,but also polish gentry.
So,we could have another turkish vassal,Poland without cossack wars...Interesting,very interesting.
Stronger Turkey,weaken Poland and Moscov.
Turkey would probably keep Kamieniec Podolski in this scenario,and Zaporishian cossack would be their vassals.Maybe take and keep Vienna,too?

P.S .HAPPY EASTER !!!!!

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Interesting.Tsars was slave owners,so he would not defect to them,but sultans,when they have slaves,too,created yheir christian subject better then moscovites.Peasants even better then not only tsar,but also polish gentry.
So,we could have another turkish vassal,Poland without cossack wars...Interesting,very interesting.
Stronger Turkey,weaken Poland and Moscov.
Turkey would probably keep Kamieniec Podolski in this scenario,and Zaporishian cossack would be their vassals.Maybe take and keep Vienna,too?

P.S .HAPPY EASTER !!!!!

The absence of Cossack rebellions might actually be more beneficial to Poland, as it wouldn’t become weak to be subjected to a Deluge like devastation from either Muscovy or Sweden in that matter. Vyshnevetsky in this case would also aim at consolidating control of the lower Dnieper region plus Sloboda Ukraine region (where Kharkiv is located), and even potentially make an alliance with the Crimean Khanate.

I would suspect that Vyshnevetsky’s Hetmanate might or might not have any semblance of a nobility class due to the majority of the population in that area being runaway serfs and outlaws. Economically speaking, Vyshnevetsky would benefit from being the center of a trade traffic between the Black Sea and the PLC, and if they played their cards right, even the Caspian and Caucasian trade routes.

 

[ATP]

The absence of Cossack rebellions might actually be more beneficial to Poland, as it wouldn’t become weak to be subjected to a Deluge like devastation from either Muscovy or Sweden in that matter. Vyshnevetsky in this case would also aim at consolidating control of the lower Dnieper region plus Sloboda Ukraine region (where Kharkiv is located), and even potentially make an alliance with the Crimean Khanate.

I would suspect that Vyshnevetsky’s Hetmanate might or might not have any semblance of a nobility class due to the majority of the population in that area being runaway serfs and outlaws. Economically speaking, Vyshnevetsky would benefit from being the center of a trade traffic between the Black Sea and the PLC, and if they played their cards right, even the Caspian and Caucasian trade routes.

Indeed.Without Deluge Poland would remain superpower.And since till 1620 we did everything we could to avoid wars with Turkey,there would probaby be not many wars here.

About cossacks - they considered themselves as gentry,not peasants,so they would become new nobility.Althought probably without serfs,peasants in Turkey were free.

 

[Buba]

Such a Cossak state would immediatelly form its own nobility, even if not - at least initially - a "closed shop" affair. After all, the dream of many freed slaves was to buy a slave or two ...

Interesting premise. Maybe it would butterfly away the disastrous Lublin Union?

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Indeed.Without Deluge Poland would remain superpower.And since till 1620 we did everything we could to avoid wars with Turkey,there would probaby be not many wars here.

About cossacks - they considered themselves as gentry,not peasants,so they would become new nobility.Althought probably without serfs,peasants in Turkey were free.

True, and while there were the Kosinski and Nalyvaiko Uprisings that occurred IOTL, here it wouldn't happen, or a different kind of minor rebellions would erupt.

Such a Cossack state would immediatelly form its own nobility, even if not - at least initially - a "closed shop" affair. After all, the dream of many freed slaves was to buy a slave or two ...

Interesting premise. Maybe it would butterfly away the disastrous Lublin Union?

Possible with regards to butterflying the Lublin Union, but it may or may not butterfly the Livonian conflict that was triggered by Ivan the Terrible. However, it might also have an effect on various Tatar raids into the territories of the PLC, in that any kind of additional raids might sour the relations between the Crimean Khanate and Vyshnevetsky's fiefdom, and the latter's relations with the Ottoman Empire.