Hurricane Katrina was caused by Bush initiating authorization for HAARP to use it's assets to sink a submarine containing Iranian diplomats bound for Mexico, that's the thinker.
History The Impact of Geological/Astronomical Events in Societal Upheaval and How It Is Often Ignored In Modern Historical Discourse
- Thread starter Bacle
- Start date
Sometimes natural events can outpace event the best leaders and least corrupt governments, and then it's more about who survives to rebuild or escapes to tell the tale, more than who in control, when shit went down.
The Atlantis myth, the many flood myths, and Sodom/Gamorrah story (just to name a few) likely originate from survivors of natural disasters, with the stories being embellished with moral lessons and such later on.
Now you are right that in how a society responds to disasters often show how moral or corrupt a society is, and how close it is/was to breaking apart or how strongly it is bound together.
bintananth
behind a desk
A big ecological event leading to major social change happening shortly afterwards is something of a "chicken and egg" conundrum.
Sometimes the event just brought problems which could no longer be ignored to the forefront. A major earthquake causing a complete re-think of building standards like 1906 San Francisco earthquake did is one such example.
A long drought or massive flooding devastating an area to such an extent that the survivors need to move just so they can eat is will lead to tensions and changes in the societies they migrate to.
A massive volcanic eruption messing up the climate for a few years while the dust settles causes problems for everyone in unpredictable ways.
The fall of Rome is a weird one to describe because it wasn't just one thing. It was a whole slew of them over a long period of time which ended with a "Game Over" in 476AD.
I think the climate was getting colder because there were mass migrations from the North and East pointed in Rome's general direction the Romans couldn't fend off and failed to absorb.
Sometimes the event just brought problems which could no longer be ignored to the forefront. A major earthquake causing a complete re-think of building standards like 1906 San Francisco earthquake did is one such example.
A long drought or massive flooding devastating an area to such an extent that the survivors need to move just so they can eat is will lead to tensions and changes in the societies they migrate to.
A massive volcanic eruption messing up the climate for a few years while the dust settles causes problems for everyone in unpredictable ways.
The fall of Rome is a weird one to describe because it wasn't just one thing. It was a whole slew of them over a long period of time which ended with a "Game Over" in 476AD.
I think the climate was getting colder because there were mass migrations from the North and East pointed in Rome's general direction the Romans couldn't fend off and failed to absorb.
Rome had weakened for some time. By the time the Barbarians arrived to give the final push it was quite brittle.
Their over-urbanized society had been depopulated by some nasty epidemics. The excessive taxation required to keep the Legions funded meant that coming under Visigoth rule meant much less taxation, much more freedom, for the average Joe.
When your whole society has become about squeezing the majority of the population as much as possible so that the top elite can continue to live in luxury.. surprise, surprise, the common people aren't much motivated to fight for that system to keep going.
Indeed.The same goes for France in 1789 - there were some climate change,but main problem was with corrupted elites giving power to inner barbarians almost without fight.Result - people only in Vandea fought,becouse inly there they still have some freedom.
When there are possible civilizations wiped out of history because of these events.
What happened to the Mycinians?
What happend that caused the large battle in Europe, central, during the time of the Great civilizations of Mesopotamia?
One needs to remember we only have so much known about history
What happened to the Mycinians?
What happend that caused the large battle in Europe, central, during the time of the Great civilizations of Mesopotamia?
One needs to remember we only have so much known about history
Yep.
A lot of history/pre-history has been lost to time, and new traces of it are exceedingly rare.
Volcanoes, sea level rise, and meteors can erase a lot of history while leaving few traces for us to put together later.
There are probably cities buried under set the sands of Saudi Arabia as well, and likely many cove lost under jungles, or drowned when the Ice Age ended, like Doggerland.
Fun thing - according to arab myths,there existed lost city of Iram/Ubar which according to 1000 night stories had palace with 1000 golden columns and were defended by 1000 castles with 1000 mamluks each.
Of course,nothing like that existed - but there is many old ruins in SA and Oman which as claimed as Iram.
In Honduras there is legend of "Ciudad Bianca/white city" which was discovered in 2015 - totally unknown culture destroyed by european plagueas before spaniards could come.
And they discovered there remnants of many cities,not one.
So,apparently human memory work in starnge way - many cities turn into one,but with unreal power and treasures.
See, now that would make sense.humans tend to exagerate, for example Atlantis was probally the dodger bank island that got demolished by a tsunami
that is big but its not continant sized and something that big being lost under the waves forever in an instant would be remembered for a real long time.
The glacial release floods/tsunami's would have been something that could have wiped out low lying islands, particularly once it became more and more frequent, meaning any rebuilding or salvage effort would likely have perished or failed as well.
The real problem is that so much shipping has gone down in those waters, and there are so many UXOs that trying to do an archeological expedition would likely be fruitless as it may be hard to find intact evidence that can be pinned to Doggerland, and not any of the many European powers that have traversed those waters.
going to be honest if this is the real historical atlantis it is not going to be like the myths we have of this ultra advanced place. I think we would probally find a few megalithic structors like stone henge because that was a regional thing but not much else. So slightly advanced for the time period but not world shaking in the least.
I think we may see proto-druid and proto-germanic structures, maybe a primitive smelter if it was more 'advanced' than it's neighbors, or a possibly a grain mill and temple structures.
I'd be surprised at anything more than that.
id be very impressed if we found a smelter, people often exagerate the accomplishments of lost civilizations by a whole lot.
This mostly happens because when civilization ends its tramatic as hell and the new civilization that arrises from its ashes often has a bit of a complex about what happened before if only to avoid any huberus that caused the last collapse.
Indeed.Iram which was mentioned - few ruins were found,but none of them had palace big enough for 1000 golden columna and 1000 castles defending it.
Usually there were just forts.
Remember, Britain was known as the 'Tin Isles' in parts of early history, and tin has pretty low melting point.
Tin also doesn't do great in salt-water, so after this long there'd be no evidence left unless it was stuck in an anoxic pocket.
Good video on the Bronze Age collapse, that adds a new wrinkle to the issue; Hekla, a volcano in Iceland.
There was a massive eruption right at the end of the Bronze Age that ejected so much material it caused bad tree growth seasons for 18 years in Ireland, and even affected tree growth in the Americas, and likely caused cold, dry winters which led to crop failures Europe, that forced starving European to become the Sea People's, just as iron weapons started to spread into more common use.