Karl Franz vs God Emperor of Mankind

[StormEagle]

Probably. He may mismanage them in different ways though. And without GEoM's insane powers he would bigger issues with ambitions of some.
Though hard to say if he would have created them in the first place.

Isn't being schizophrenic in fact an intended part of his characterization? GEoM is a pile of ancient psychic humans wearing the same body and pretending to be one demigod, of course it's schizophrenic. Depending on all sorts of factors and how much attention is GEoM paying to the conversation you may be talking to a very different part of him.

I find it more likely for that to be a convenient explanation GW stumbled it’s way into, rather than any intentional decision making on their part.

 

[King Arts]

One of the main problems with the Emperor boils down to one of the main problems with the Horus Heresy in general.

Inconsistent characterization.

Which makes sense, because of the nature of Black Library. There’s so many different authors writing so many different characters, shit is bound to get jumbled up.

In one of Mortarian’s books, I believe it’s called the Pale King, the interaction he has with Big E paints a very different picture to the one we got in Master of Mankind or the First Heretic. Same with when Perturabo talked with him.

In both of those instances, he comes across as far more human than in others. He comes across more as a father than, say, his interactions with Angron or Lorgar.

Fundamentally speaking, the Big E isn’t really what we’d call a character. He’s more like a plot device or set dressing for whatever given author is writing him at the time.

As a character/person, I like Karl better. He’s more consistent, whereas the Emperor can almost come across as schizophrenic from one book to another.

I don’t know if he’d be able to handle the WH40k universe any better than Emps, besides maybe not being as bad with some of the Primarchs.

Inserting the Emperor into fantasy is rather pointless, because he’d basically nuke the setting. Asking if he’d be a better ruler than Karl is rather pointless, when he just starts marching into chaos/skaven/vampire/ork strongholds and cleansing them in not holy fire.

Thats why in these sorts of threads we should imagine that the emperors getting swapped don’t keep their super powers. After all this is to see who is the better LEADER not super hero or walking nuke. So Karl Franz gets all the Emperors psyker powers ability and controls, and the emperor is busted down to a normal mortal so he can actually rule a fantasy Holy Roman Empire instead of just being a walking god.

 

[Marduk]

Thats why in these sorts of threads we should imagine that the emperors getting swapped don’t keep their super powers. After all this is to see who is the better LEADER not super hero or walking nuke. So Karl Franz gets all the Emperors psyker powers ability and controls, and the emperor is busted down to a normal mortal so he can actually rule a fantasy Holy Roman Empire instead of just being a walking god.

If Karl Franz gets all the mental and psychic abilities of GEoM, he is functionally no longer Karl Franz, or is about to drift away from being him due to the sheer amount of thinking and experience he will accumulate over time that a normal human wouldn't. GEoM can not only think and communicate but even act on stellar distances and in the warp in many locations at the same time, that's so far out of normal human experience and thinking process that it's completely expected for him to end up quite weird.

Think of the most retarded young child you have ever met. If that kid suddenly got all the knowledge and intellect of Bismarck, Eisenhower and Einstein combined, how different would that kid be from the original?

 

[Husky_Khan]

Karl Franz would probably need a different kind of boost. Kind of like what Bretonnisn Grail Knights get from Ze Lady. Sigmar can bless him with a centuries long life with general immunity to natural ailments, superhuman physicality, mental acuity and endless stamina and highly resistant to corruption of magical and pedestrian forms.

Something like that as a starting point.

 

[Agent23]

If Karl Franz gets all the mental and psychic abilities of GEoM, he is functionally no longer Karl Franz, or is about to drift away from being him due to the sheer amount of thinking and experience he will accumulate over time that a normal human wouldn't.

None of that is in the op, so moot point/strawman argument.

Regular human that ran a glorified fantasy holy Roman empire for maybe a few decades vs. millennia old superhuman that built and ran a galactic empire out of a few technobarbarians is no fight at all.

 

[Husky_Khan]

None of that is in the op, so moot point/strawman argument.

Regular human that ran a glorified fantasy holy Roman empire for maybe a few decades vs. millennia old superhuman that built and ran a galactic empire out of a few technobarbarians is no fight at all.

Can you even follow the flow of the conversation? There's no strawman and there's no fight going on.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Another idea for Karl Franz would be he just gets super-Primarchy style abilities arbitrarily for the purposes of this thread since most of us seem to be in agreement that Primarchs are seen as more Mortal/Human and relatable them the perpetual gestalt entity that is the God-Emperor.

 

[Him]

No space marine is relatable, they're disconnected psychopaths.

 

[Agent23]

No space marine is relatable, they're disconnected psychopaths.

Ventris was not.
Garro was not.
Even the the Carcarodons Astra, the fallen Night Lords, Blood Gorgons and Iron Warriors and the renegade/demon influenced Soul Drinkers were all quite relatable when described.

Perhaps you need to read more of the material you are trying to comment on.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Captain Titus of the Ultramarines seemed like a nice fellow.

And the White Scars almost as an entire Chapter seemed rather amenable and Humanitarian actually. Certainly no psychopathy was evident IMHO. They actually seemed to care a great deal about civilians as well, especially in personal encounters.

 

[Aldarion]

No space marine is relatable, they're disconnected psychopaths.

I dare you to watch Helsreach and repeat that.

EDIT:

Captain Titus of the Ultramarines seemed like a nice fellow.

And the White Scars almost as an entire Chapter seemed rather amenable and Humanitarian actually. Certainly no psychopathy was evident IMHO. They actually seemed to care a great deal about civilians as well, especially in personal encounters.

Ultramarines in general I think do care about civilians, even if not to the extent of some other chapters.

Space Wolves as well.
Salamanders.
And of course, never forget the Lamenters.

Even the more hardcore chapters (e.g. Space Templars) are not exactly psychopaths, at least towards Imperial civilians.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Ultramarines in general I think do care about civilians, even if not to the extent of some other chapters.

Ultramarines in fact, as Captain Titus admits in the end to Lieutenant Mira, are more Human then you know...



Oops wrong gameplay clip... Still illustrates the same point.