IOM gets upgraded

Alaric Volta

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At M42 as Guilliman comes back and gives the primaris space marines, ROB gives Guilliman all the assets of the Empire from Star Wars, the UNSC from Halo, the Terran Domion from Starcraft, the Federation from Star Trek, Federation from Starship Troopers, and the United States Empire from Section 8.

For instance they get all the star destroyers the empire ever had, while keeping all of the ships the Imperium already has.

How will the Imperium react to the new stuff Cawl and Guilliman bring out.

Use the high ends of all of them.

And what civilization could take this new Imperium on?
 

CarlManvers2019

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Wait, does this mean the Imperium has access to Slipspace? That will piss off a LOT of Navigators and endanger them

Though, if they were smart, they’d slowly become more human by interbreeding with normals in political marriages

Also, who’s to say this tech isn’t considered heretical? And it’d take awhile to spread it around the Imperium and it’d probably get taken by Chaos at some point
 

Lanmandragon

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Well first up the mechanics all die simultaneously. From the sheer shock of the collective orgasm they all experience. Do they get the personnel or just the tech?
 

Tryglaw

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Actually, to "fix" the Imperium, Federation tech (properly sanctified of course) from Star Trek would be more then enough.

Biggest game changers would be:

Subspace communication technology - an FTL comm system that doesn't depend on the Warp, and is extremely high bandwidth (as opposed to pretty much text messages that they have).

Subspace sensor arrays - an auspex that can look over dozens / hundreds of lightyears in real time? Yes, please.

Starfleet Warp Drives might be (relatively) slow(er), but again, they don't depend on Warp nor Navigators - huge, huge advantage.

Replicator technology would be another enormous boon, since replicators could reprocess pretty much all their waste (yay, no more forge / hive worlds that are un-livable outside of sealed habitats) into useful stuff, on top of expanding Mechanicus ability to make more stuff.

Maybe sufficiently upscaled Phasers could vape Orks without leaving spores behind. ;)

And maybe Federation medical tech could heal the Emperor (or do an ass-pull with Genesis technology, for Spock it worked well enough...)
 

Lanmandragon

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Actually, to "fix" the Imperium, Federation tech (properly sanctified of course) from Star Trek would be more then enough.

Biggest game changers would be:

Subspace communication technology - an FTL comm system that doesn't depend on the Warp, and is extremely high bandwidth (as opposed to pretty much text messages that they have).

Subspace sensor arrays - an auspex that can look over dozens / hundreds of lightyears in real time? Yes, please.

Starfleet Warp Drives might be (relatively) slow(er), but again, they don't depend on Warp nor Navigators - huge, huge advantage.

Replicator technology would be another enormous boon, since replicators could reprocess pretty much all their waste (yay, no more forge / hive worlds that are un-livable outside of sealed habitats) into useful stuff, on top of expanding Mechanicus ability to make more stuff.

Maybe sufficiently upscaled Phasers could vape Orks without leaving spores behind. ;)

And maybe Federation medical tech could heal the Emperor (or do an ass-pull with Genesis technology, for Spock it worked well enough...)
So they get technobabble powers as well or no?
 

CarlManvers2019

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Wouldn’t there be problems with things like Navigators NOT wanting to be replaced due to losing their monopoly

Astropaths, even in small numbers, doing stuff out of spite or because they know they’ll be executed since they’re no longer needed

The Mechanicus possibly having problems on not getting full access or the engineers not all following their beliefs?

The Ecclesiarchy as well possibly have a problem in the lack of faith or conversion being instant?
 

mrttao

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Actually, to "fix" the Imperium, Federation tech (properly sanctified of course) from Star Trek would be more then enough.
Mostly agreed with one caveat.
Starfleet Warp Drives might be (relatively) slow(er), but again, they don't depend on Warp nor Navigators - huge, huge advantage.
Being slower is considered in universe to be a crippling disadvantage. They choose not to use such drives because of it.
The Tau are just using a reverse engineered IOM drive that they reconfigured to skim the warp instead of fully enter it, since for some really mysterious reason (daemons) any attempt to fully replicate it results in the ship being lost. As such imperial drives can already travel without entering the warp, it is just far too slow to maintain an empire as wide as the IOM. The lore for the astronomicon and the patrenova both states that the imperium will collapse if there is a significant slowdown to ship travel speeds.

Also imperial warp drive is fully capable of working without navigators. it is just much slower and much shorter in range per jump

So for the usability of startrek warp drive will really depend on which era you get
note there is inconsistency in the application of the scale of warp drives. And they vary massively between the low end and the high end. Low end will be utterly useless, high end star trek drive though could conceivably replace the warp drives of the imperium
Wouldn’t there be problems with things like Navigators NOT wanting to be replaced due to losing their monopoly
Yes, navigators are extremely potent psykers and mutants, especially in the high end. And they have historically sabotaged the imperium to prevent their replacement
However, not all of them do so, as mentioned in the links some were loyal. However it is worth noting that in this hypothetical guilliman is there acting as regent and he should be able to kill the traitorous navigators.
Astropaths, even in small numbers, doing stuff out of spite or because they know they’ll be executed since they’re no longer needed
unlike navigators, astropaths remain useful as they are still sanctioned psykers who can be used for war. Additionally astropath loyalty is ensured by chaining their souls to the emperor (a process that occurs in terra itself and burns out the physical eyes of the astropath). as such they will never rebel against the imperium
 
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CarlManvers2019

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Yes, navigators are extremely potent psykers and mutants, especially in the high end. And they have historically sabotaged the imperium to prevent their replacement
However, not all of them do so, as mentioned in the links some were loyal. However it is worth noting that in this hypothetical guilliman is there acting as regent and he should be able to kill the traitorous navigators.
I think one solution would be to “get normal” or marry into rich influential normal human families

The results of said unions are normal humans or what would have been before the tech uplift, a waste of sperm and eggs

These normals inherit stuff from then on, while the mutated looking ones live away from public eye or the tech from those civilizations helps make them look normal again
 

mrttao

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I think one solution would be to “get normal” or marry into rich influential normal human families

The results of said unions are normal humans or what would have been before the tech uplift, a waste of sperm and eggs

These normals inherit stuff from then on, while the mutated looking ones live away from public eye or the tech from those civilizations helps make them look normal again
In the technical sense it should be viable.
Whether it will actually be done though? I would say the big question is how well Guilliman can diplomance the paternova, and how willing the various sides are to get along and compromise. Also whether the navigators are willing to risk extermination to keep their wealth and power at its current level. Or how threatened the navigators feel over it, do they think any negotiations is temporary and that they will be exterminated as mutants the moment they are no longer needed?
And then there is chaos to consider, whispering in ears and sowing... well, chaos.
 

CarlManvers2019

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In the technical sense it should be viable.
Whether it will actually be done though? I would say the big question is how well Guilliman can diplomance the paternova, and how willing the various sides are to get along and compromise. Also whether the navigators are willing to risk extermination to keep their wealth and power at its current level. Or how threatened the navigators feel over it, do they think any negotiations is temporary and that they will be exterminated as mutants the moment they are no longer needed?
And then there is chaos to consider, whispering in ears and sowing... well, chaos.
Good points

One of the most irrational assumptions people can make is to assume that others will act rationally simply because it would be in their own interest or things can be moderated or not go so extreme

Speaking of Psykers, what could be done in-regards to them with this tech?
 

mrttao

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Speaking of Psykers, what could be done in-regards to them with this tech?
I am not familiar with section 8. from other techbases given the only one I think contains relevant stuff is the terran dominion from starcraft, as they have various psy tech. they can build psionic suppression devices (that must be worn) and routinely mindwipe the memories of their psions to keep them acting like machines. They could also build a beacon that emulated the signature of overpowered psykers to draw the zerg to a target.

Honestly, I do not think it would be a good idea to use that tech, as it sounds like a quick path towards daemonic possession, which was not an issue in their home dimension.
 

Tryglaw

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Wouldn’t there be problems with things like Navigators NOT wanting to be replaced due to losing their monopoly
Nobody likes to loose a monopoly, that one goes without saying... ;)

Astropaths, even in small numbers, doing stuff out of spite or because they know they’ll be executed since they’re no longer needed
As above. But Astropaths can do other jobs as @mrttao pointed out.

The Mechanicus possibly having problems on not getting full access or the engineers not all following their beliefs?
Not getting full access is kinda sorta standard policy between Forge Worlds, just because one has this or that STC template doesn't mean others get it too. Horse trading is very much a thing with the Cogboys.
But given how bloody useful an Industrial Replicator or ten would be, they'd be promptly proclaimed as Holy STC Fabricators...

And phasers (upscaled as needed) would be dead useful against Orks (yay, no spore left behind :D ) or Tyranids (biomass goes away at max. setting).

The Ecclesiarchy as well possibly have a problem in the lack of faith or conversion being instant?
Only if people come along with the tech.

Mostly agreed with one caveat.

Being slower is considered in universe to be a crippling disadvantage. They choose not to use such drives because of it.

So for the usability of startrek warp drive will really depend on which era you get
note there is inconsistency in the application of the scale of warp drives. And they vary massively between the low end and the high end. Low end will be utterly useless, high end star trek drive though could conceivably replace the warp drives of the imperium
If we go by TNG+ era (though TOS just might actually be faster, LOL), Trek Warp is very useful indeed.

Not as full replacement for Immaterium mind you, but it's plenty fast within a sector if you need to reinforce an adjacent system or one within a couple dozen / hundred lightyears, and unlike traversing Immaterium it's both dead reliable (in comparison), and rather immune to Immaterium-related problems, be they Chaos or Shadow in the Warp courtesy of the 'Nids. No risk of arriving before / centuries after departure, no demons waiting to om-nom-nom you during transit. And you can use it anywhere in a system.

Also, against sublight-only ships, warp strafing FTW.
 
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Lanmandragon

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There's a non zero chance that you can cancel out the warp with technobabble. This chance is increased exponentially if they get Starfleet. Technobabbling gods and god like beings is well established in trek lore.
 

CarlManvers2019

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Not getting full access is kinda sorta standard policy between Forge Worlds, just because one has this or that STC template doesn't mean others get it too. Horse trading is very much a thing with the Cogboys.
But given how bloody useful an Industrial Replicator or ten would be, they'd be promptly proclaimed as Holy STC Fabricators...
So in essence, they pretty much can’t declare the technology “tech-heresy” due to how much they can’t help but want it all

As the technology spreads out, I expect many worlds industries, not just Forge Worlds, to suddenly deal with mass unemployment

Perhaps sending all those masses off to colonize planets outside the solar system like in Isaac Asimov’s Robots/Galactic Empire/Foundation series would be a good idea whilst using the new advanced technologies to conquer and settle new worlds in large numbers as rapidly as possible

One possible problem is the prioritization of who gets the upgrades first and said tech may end up in Chaos’ hands
 

Archinist.

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Subspace communication technology - an FTL comm system that doesn't depend on the Warp, and is extremely high bandwidth (as opposed to pretty much text messages that they have).

Subspace sensor arrays - an auspex that can look over dozens / hundreds of lightyears in real time? Yes, please.

Starfleet Warp Drives might be (relatively) slow(er), but again, they don't depend on Warp nor Navigators - huge, huge advantage.

Replicator technology would be another enormous boon, since replicators could reprocess pretty much all their waste (yay, no more forge / hive worlds that are un-livable outside of sealed habitats) into useful stuff, on top of expanding Mechanicus ability to make more stuff.

Maybe sufficiently upscaled Phasers could vape Orks without leaving spores behind. ;)

And maybe Federation medical tech could heal the Emperor (or do an ass-pull with Genesis technology, for Spock it worked well enough...)
Do you have any citations for this?

I think just about nothing changes; the Empire's hyperdrive could be a massive improvement in logistics and wartime response, but I highly doubt the Navis Nobilite or the Adeptus Astra Telepathica is going to allow their monopoly on Imperial commerce and communications to slacken. The Paternova personally sent an agent to destroy/sabotage the Emperor's Dark Glass project.
 

mrttao

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Do you have any citations for this?

I think just about nothing changes; the Empire's hyperdrive could be a massive improvement in logistics and wartime response, but I highly doubt the Navis Nobilite or the Adeptus Astra Telepathica is going to allow their monopoly on Imperial commerce and communications to slacken. The Paternova personally sent an agent to destroy/sabotage the Emperor's Dark Glass project.
If the IOM just gets the tech that would be so, but in this scenario guilliman is healed and is actively acting as the regent of the imperium. So he has the force to force the issue
 

Archinist.

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If the IOM just gets the tech that would be so, but in this scenario guilliman is healed and is actively acting as the regent of the imperium. So he has the force to force the issue
Even if he does, M.42 isn't the right time. The Great Rift is still open, and the Imperium's oligarchy wouldn't react kindly to this; they would drum up political support and point at the primarch, saying, "These are what his reforms lead to! The dismantling of His most Holy organizations!" The resulting political purge would be nightmarish, and there would be staunch opposition to any further actions taken by Guilliman.

While the High Lords can be competent, and may even in some way care about the Imperium, their interests come first. Things would have to reach Star Trek levels of peace for him to try anything.
 

CarlManvers2019

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Even if he does, M.42 isn't the right time. The Great Rift is still open, and the Imperium's oligarchy wouldn't react kindly to this; they would drum up political support and point at the primarch, saying, "These are what his reforms lead to! The dismantling of His most Holy organizations!" The resulting political purge would be nightmarish, and there would be staunch opposition to any further actions taken by Guilliman.

While the High Lords can be competent, and may even in some way care about the Imperium, their interests come first. Things would have to reach Star Trek levels of peace for him to try anything.
So maybe best avoid having the FTL Tech and Communications?

Well, I think the ability to somehow use some tech to help do things like mass produce Power Armor for the Space Marines may help
 

Archinist.

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So maybe best avoid having the FTL Tech and Communications?

Well, I think the ability to somehow use some tech to help do things like mass produce Power Armor for the Space Marines may help
Yeah.

The hyperdrive will probably see use by the Custodes or the Grey Knights, since they get all the nice toys. The Death Star probably becomes one of Terra's many defense installations (but not before they dip it in gold and cathedrals). The Super Star Destroyers and the Imperial Star Destroyers likely join Battlefleet Solar as well; even if they are paltry compared to the forces already stored there. Star Destroyers start to look something like this:




I'll try to get more info on the other sci-fi polities; from what I remember they're drops of water in an ocean compared to both the Imperium and the Empire.

Edit: Image problem.
 
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